Topic: TAR 20 Transport

[apskip]

maf is quite right that the shortest route goes through both Switzerland (and Liechtenstein too). Here it is as best I can decipher it:

Torino to Varese 92 miles estimated driving time (it's a fast non-mountain road in the Piedmont) 1 hour 39 min.

Varese to Lugano 14 miles estimated driving time 15 min.

There are two alternate routes either one of which is approximately 166 miles and should take about 4 hours:
Lugano to Vaduz, Liechtenstein is the common route for both.

The first branch goes north and across the border to Bregenz, Switzerland and Lindau, Germany. Then it goes north to reach mountain road 12 and then the lower route 7 into Fussen.

The other branch goes through Feldkirch Austria into Sankt Anton am Arlberg, then north to reach route 198, through Reutte and into Fussen.

Total driving time about 6 hours.

Border crossing on trains and planes into and out of Italy, Switzerland and Germany are quick and easy, but I have no cross-border experience in a car.

[Jimmer]

I just cannot see it happening, driving through Austria, Switzerland, or Liechtenstein, especially knowing that Season 18 visited all three of these countries.

[apskip]

The plane possibilities are approximately as given. I want to tailor them to fir the most likely pit stop release times in Torino.

So let's start with Art and JJ. I estimate they would have checked in at 1300 on Dec. 4 and be released Dec. 5 at 0100. They then have 5 hours 40 minutes to get to Torino airport, get tickets to Munich, checkin, kill and board. When they get to Munich, perhaps 15 minutes to get off the plane and out and find marked cars (no doubt FORD FOCUS). That flight EN1705 departed TRN 0640 and arrived MUC 0820. Then 2 hours to drive to Fussen, for a 1020 arrival, 9 hours 20 minutes total.

Next is Rachel and David. They probably checked in around 1500, so their arrival is the same but their total time would be 2 hours shorter than Art and JJ at 7 hours 20 minutes.

The ability of any other teams to get to the Torino airport, ticket, go through security and board EN1705 on time is questionable. Some might have made it and they would have the lowest total time.

All this contrasts with a predictable 6 hours from Torino to Fussen by car, arriving around 0700 for Art and JJ and 0900 for Rachel and David. The unknown is the weather on that day. If driving conditions were below the best required for those mountain roads, then I would have ordered all teams to fly. Maybe they were given the choice, most unusual for the Amazing Race but World Race Productions does try to be unpredictable.

[apskip]

Since the question of weather in Fussen is slightly researchable (the rest of the driving route above Lugano is really not), I did so. December 5 was one of the warmest days in December, high of 8 degrees Celsius (46 degrees Fahrenheit) and low of -2 degrees Celsius (28 degrees Fahrenheit). It appears that it would have been a fine day for driving.

[Jimmer]

The weather along the way as I found it was light rain and mist. You can check out wunderground.com/history to check other locations on weather.

[Jimmer]

Does anyone have any clue about trains going from Turin to Frussen on December 5?

[Jimmer]

I have another thing to throw out there. Is it possible that if the teams were to drive, that TAR gives teams the street address to Neuschwanstien Castle and have the Ford Focus use the navigation system to guide the teams, to further advertise the Ford Focus, as with the park assist in the last leg?

[georgiapeach]

I was also wondering if we have ruled out trains...

[maf]

I was also wondering if we have ruled out trains...

Not completely, but it seems unlikely. The train takes more than 8 hours, and that is for Munich. I think self-driving is more probable than trains.

Also since Neuschawanstein si such a well known place they could just give teams a picture of it and tell them to drive there.

[Jimmer]

There are just so many possibilities. I just have this gut feeling that the teams will not drive themselves there. Who knows, I could be wrong.

[theschnauzers]

With Ford being involved, it would make sense to force the teams to navigate themselves to Bavaria from Turin. They already have those Fords they drove around Turin.

[georgiapeach]

We have caps of them driving during the leg...

[Declive]

With Ford being involved, it would make sense to force the teams to navigate themselves to Bavaria from Turin. They already have those Fords they drove around Turin.

If it is like this , it would mean no equalizer, damn...

[Jimmer]

Cougarspy posted this in the Leg 5 spoilers and think it should be transferred here!

Is it possible that the teams take an overnight train from Turin to Fussen, Germany?  I was checking out train travel, and you can prebook that trip.  This would also act as an equalizer for the teams.

I see that it may have been identified that the Ice Rink is in Fussen (Roadblock - Curling, where teams get their traveling gnome).


Hohenschwangau Castle, Schwangau, Germany is about 12 minutes away, so is the castle a Route Info versus a pitstop?  And this is where the snowy labyrinth occurs (walking up to the castle)?

Gemeinde Unterammergau and Oberammergau is a half hour from the castle, as we see teams driving with the gnome.

And the pitstop is near those towns?

Just a thought, since driving from Turin, Italy to Fussen is a 6 hour drive and has multiple TOLLS.

[Jimmer]

We have caps of them driving during the leg...

However, the caps with Kerri & Stacy show the Travelocity gnome.
Vanessa & Ralph also have the the gnome coming out of the car.
This leaves Bopper saying, "Yodel-a-hi-hoo," most likely coming after they Yodel (speculated for the speed bump).

We cannot completely rule out a possible flight from Turin to Munich, although I have been outnumbered as the general consensus thinks they drive themselves.

[georgiapeach]

I don't think there is a consensus yet, just all of us putting forward a lot of ideas!

[apskip]

The intermodal method of rail+car transportation to get into Bavaria was pretty interesting. The pit stop time was again designed to assure that Art and JJ were not able to get there in time to get through the Gasthaus zum Raffen, with its hours of operation.

Here are the connections for trains to go from Torino to Innsbruck (note: Innsbruck to Ehrwald will be presented when completed and the car distances after that):

3rd train after 7am is 0802am Torino Porta Nuova
0913 at Milano Centrale, leave at 0935a to
Verona Porta Nuova 1057a, leave at 1150a to
Brenner Pass (Italy/Austria border) 1452, leave to
Innsbruck 1502 arrive 1608

Note: Only Art/JJ can be on this train on Monday December 5 since all others have not been released from the pit stop.


Train 2013    12:50PM Torino Porta Nuova,
2:45PM Milano Centrale,
Train9729    3:05PM Milano Centrale,
4:27PM Verona Porta Nuova,
1hr 22min   
     
Brennero188    5:02PM Verona Porta Nuova,
8:32PM
Innsbruck Hbf,
3hr 30min   
     
Note: Rachel/David can be on this train


Le Frecce 9567    1:37PM Torino Porta Nuova,
3:50PM Bologna Centrale,
2hr 13min

Train2264    4:10PM Bologna Centrale,
8:52PM Brennero Brenner,
4hr 42min   
     
Train5233    9:28PM Brenner Pass (Italy/Austria border),
10:08PM Innsbruck Hbf,
0hr 40min   

Joey/Danny and Nary/Jamie should be on this train
     

Le Frecce 9569    2:37PM Torino Porta Nuova,
4:50PM Bologna Centrale,
2hr 13min

Train2266    6:10PM Bologna Centrale,
10:52PM Brenner Pass,
4hr 42min   
     
Train5277    11:04PM
Brenner Pass,
11:44PM Innsbruck Hbf

Note: Only Brendon/Rachel should be on this train.

We still need later trains for Kerri/Stacy and Mark/Bopper.

1550 from Torino Porta Nuova leaving to
Milano Centrale 1745, leaving 1805 to
Verona Porto Nuova 1927, leaving 1950 to Brenner Pass (Italy/Austria border)
2252 leaving Brenner Pass to Innsbruck arrive 2344

This would work for Kerri/Stacy.

1952 Torino Porta Nuova leaving to Milano Centrale
2045 Milano Centrale 2103 Verona Porta Nuova, leaving to
Innsbruck 0101 arrive 0431

This is the one for Mark/Bopper.
leaving

[apskip]

The train trip from Innsbruck to Ehrwald is about 1 hour 50 minutes. Here are the times:

0638 - 0828 There is apparent reason why all teams except Art/JJ should not have been on this train; all arrived in Innsbruck in time.
0755 - 0942
0757 - 0942
0838 - 1028
1038 - 1228
1045 - 1257
1102 - 1257
1238 - 1428
1255 - 1437
1438 - 1628 I expect Art/JJ made this connection to get to Ehrwald by 1628 but were then stranded at the train station for the night starting Monday Dec. 5.
1725 - 1907
1838 - 2030

[apskip]

The distances for driving onward from Ehrwald were approximately these:

Ehrwald (last town in Austria) to Oberammergau (first town in Bavaria) 12.9 miles

Oberammergau to Hohenschwangau and Neuschwanstein 27.4 miles

Neuschwanstein to Fussen under 2 miles

[TARFansurvivor]

Do we know if they leave from Munich or Frankfurt to Baku?

[apskip]

TARFANSurvivor,

No, we are not sure which one they fly from, but I have a strong hunch it will be Frankfurt. These are by no means the only flights, but they are the best (from my post 79 on this thread):

Here is the best flight from Frankfurt to Baku:

Nonstop LH612 1350 2120

The best alternative is to go Munich to Istanbul to Baku:
TK636 1820 2155
TK338 2335 0410+1

It is obvious that the nonstop flight is better IF they can get it.

[maf]

Here is the best flight from Frankfurt to Baku:
Nonstop LH612 1350 2120

The best alternative is to go Munich to Istanbul to Baku:
TK636 1820 2155
TK338 2335 0410+1

It is obvious that the nonstop flight is better IF they can get it.

Yes, but let's not forget that it is a 4 hour drive to Frankfurt and a 2 hour drive to Münuch.

[redskevin88]

Here is the best flight from Frankfurt to Baku:
Nonstop LH612 1350 2120

The best alternative is to go Munich to Istanbul to Baku:
TK636 1820 2155
TK338 2335 0410+1

It is obvious that the nonstop flight is better IF they can get it.

Yes, but let's not forget that it is a 4 hour drive to Frankfurt and a 2 hour drive to Münuch.

Why can't they just take a train to Frankfurt? They could then "showcase" their beautiful HD.

[maf]

A quick not regarding the travel to Ehrwald. We see that Art & JJ arrived late in the evening and had to wait until 06:30 before they were allowed to leave.

The next two teams probably managed to catch a late train from Innsbrück to Garmisch-Partenkirchen (REX 5432 at 20:48-21:59) and then spent the night in Gramisch before boarding the first train in the morning RB 5470 06:37-07:01. This matches the footage from their arrival where one can see the station clock showing just after 7.

The last teams got stuck in Innsbrück for the night and took the first morning train, also via Gramish, which arrived at 08:28.

[apskip]

I have taken a deeper look at the flights from Frankfurt or Munich via Istanbul or Moscow to Baku. My starting assumption is that teams will be bunched reasonably close together, so World Race Productions would have no need to slow down the lead teams with unusual pit stop length. I am estimating teams might have finished leg 5 around 11am to noon and been released from the pit stop between 11pm and midnight. It takes perhaps 4 hours to drive to Frankfurt and perhaps 2 hours to Munich, so what would they find?

Here are the better flights from Frankfurt to Istanbul to Baku:
TK1598 0745 1128 TK334 1500 1945
LH612 1330 2100 nonstop

Here are the better flights from Munich to Istanbul to Baku:
TK1638 0730 1103 TK334 1500 1945
TK1636 1155 1736 TK338 2230 0410+1

Here is a flight from Munich to Moscow-SVO to Baku:
SV2323 1225 1730 SV1852 2335 0025+1

This suggests that unless a team is released after 5am (making the TK1638/TK334 combination untenable) they should go to Munich because that combination is equivalent to TK1598/TK334 from Frankfurt, with less risk from driving half as long.