Topic: What do you think about the Fast Forward?

[David]

Long ago, it was once posted in the forum that the Fast Forward could be avoided so as to exchange it for other similar tasks (something like and Express Pass for all the teams and more options).

BUT; I really like this awesome clue! It makes you be very competitive through all the leg, and only if you're the first team, you may attempt for it.

Also, there is a new thing coming up... The Fast Forward blessing. Nat & Kat; Dan & Jordan; Meghan & Cheyne; Nick & Starr; Ken & Tina (2nd placers!); Nick & Don (3rd place for the ¿oldest contestant ever?); Uchnna & Joyce; BJ & Tyler; Tyler & James... All of them won the Fast Forward (most of the times, their race's ONLY Fast Forward) and ended up in the F3; one of them as 3rd placers; one of them as 2nd Placers, and the rest of them as WINNERS.

Is there any MAGIC involved with the Fast Forward that gives you extra powers for the rest of the entire race??

Feel free to comment your impressions, if you want to!  

[Prophet]

I don't really like the FF that much but I am glad that they are using less of them and making them slightly harder. I understand that if I was on the Race I would want them b/c it gives you a break.

As far as magic I think the FF team has reached the final a lot b/c in order to do the FF you must be a frontrunner and reach the cluebox first. Also you must be a strong team to finish it.

[Zack.]

Firstly, you can add BJ/Tyler and Tyler/James to that list of FF winners turned winner-winners.

Secondly:

Is there any MAGIC involved with the Fast Forward that gives you extra powers for the rest of the entire race??

I think there are multiple benefits to a Fast Forward victory.

The first is everything associated with being able to quickly finish a leg.

If you have an injury, it gives less time for it to be aggravated (Steve/Dave in TAR 4). Similarly, if the conditions in the area are brutal, it allows you the chance to quickly find better accomodations (Meghan/Cheyne in Dubai, the unaired FF in Phuket  in TAR 14).

Some of them allow you not to deal with difficult navigation (Ken/Tina, Nicolas/Donald, Nat/Kat) and/or save money (Dan/Jordan not taxiing all around Singapore).

The second is, I think, the motivational benefits. For a team that has been dragging, it can give them the needed push to continue onward (Dan/Jordan, Meghan/Cheyne, Uchenna/Joyce, BJ/Tyler). A frontrunning team can use it to further gain steam (Ken/Tina, Nick/Starr). I think it gives the confidence in one's racing ability and team (especially since the FF doesn't guarantee a first place finish) and, given how hard killer fatigue hits, I think that's probably the most important reason FF winners are fairly successful in the rest of the race.

[Prophet]

Firstly, you can add BJ/Tyler and Tyler/James to that list of FF winners turned winner-winners.

Secondly:

Is there any MAGIC involved with the Fast Forward that gives you extra powers for the rest of the entire race??

I think there are multiple benefits to a Fast Forward victory.

The first is everything associated with being able to quickly finish a leg.

If you have an injury, it gives less time for it to be aggravated (Steve/Dave in TAR 4). Similarly, if the conditions in the area are brutal, it allows you the chance to quickly find better accomodations (Meghan/Cheyne in Dubai, the unaired FF in Phuket  in TAR 14).

Some of them allow you not to deal with difficult navigation (Ken/Tina, Nicolas/Donald, Nat/Kat) and/or save money (Dan/Jordan not taxiing all around Singapore).

The second is, I think, the motivational benefits. For a team that has been dragging, it can give them the needed push to continue onward (Dan/Jordan, Meghan/Cheyne, Uchenna/Joyce, BJ/Tyler). A frontrunning team can use it to further gain steam (Ken/Tina, Nick/Starr). I think it gives the confidence in one's racing ability and team (especially since the FF doesn't guarantee a first place finish) and, given how hard killer fatigue hits, I think that's probably the most important reason FF winners are fairly successful in the rest of the race.

Well said, Zack!

[Mug Costanza]

I was thinking about posting a very similar topic, David! I'm glad I'm not alone in my thinking!

I've always loved the idea of the Fast Forward. I love the competitive advantage a team gets from winning it, but what it's been lacking in recent years is strategy. The point of the FF when it debuted was that teams had to decide when it was most advantageous to use it, but that becomes null and void when there's only one FF per season, as there has been in the last 4 seasons. For it to really regain the magic it had in those early seasons, I think there need to be at least 3 per season. Otherwise, whoever gets that clue first is just going to go for it, regardless of whether they need it or not.

[Caelestor]

The FF is an amazing tool, WHEN IT APPEARS ON EVERY LEG. That hasn't been the case since Season 5 due to costs (another reason why the Speedbump may be retired soon). I really wish every team could get an Express Pass at the start of the race, it has potential to be a good replacement for the FF.

Similarly, the Yield (and other related markers) had potential when it appeared on every leg.

The intersection makes no sense to me whatsoever.

[Dånooky]

The FF is an amazing tool, WHEN IT APPEARS ON EVERY LEG. That hasn't been the case since Season 5 due to costs (another reason why the Speedbump may be retired soon). I really wish every team could get an Express Pass at the start of the race, it has potential to be a good replacement for the FF.

Similarly, the Yield (and other related markers) had potential when it appeared on every leg.

The intersection makes no sense to me whatsoever.

The intersection makes sense if you want to avoid a team getting too far ahead as it forces bunching and teams have the extra difficulty of getting along with the others.

[Prophet]

The FF is an amazing tool, WHEN IT APPEARS ON EVERY LEG. That hasn't been the case since Season 5 due to costs (another reason why the Speedbump may be retired soon). I really wish every team could get an Express Pass at the start of the race, it has potential to be a good replacement for the FF.

Similarly, the Yield (and other related markers) had potential when it appeared on every leg.

The intersection makes no sense to me whatsoever.

The intersection makes sense if you want to avoid a team getting too far ahead as it forces bunching and teams have the extra difficulty of getting along with the others.

Very true Dånooky!

I don't think the FF should be on every leg at all or the Yield/Uturn. But that's just my opinion.

[WalterC]

The point of the FF when it debuted was that teams had to decide when it was most advantageous to use it

That is what I loved about it, having teams deciding whether to use it now or save for it for later. It worked so much better when it was in every leg, and added more interest to the race.

Either it should be in every leg, or none at all.

[Sandra1991]

Either it should be in every leg, or none at all.

That's my opinion too.
When there was a Fast Forward on every leg, teams had to really think twice before using it. They had to strategize if that leg was the best time for using their only Fast Forward.
Now with only a Fast Forward every season, there's no strategizing around it... basically the first team that gets the clue goes for it.

[Prophet]

Either it should be in every leg, or none at all.

That's my opinion too.
When there was a Fast Forward on every leg, teams had to really think twice before using it. They had to strategize if that leg was the best time for using their only Fast Forward.
Now with only a Fast Forward every season, there's no strategizing around it... basically the first team that gets the clue goes for it.

I agree with you, Sandra, that the first team that gets to the Fast Forward clue gets it.

[AmazingRace]

I think it gives the confidence in one's racing ability and team (especially since the FF doesn't guarantee a first place finish)

  The epic moment!  

[Jobby]

As i've said before, i hope there's at least 2 Fast Forward on the race. And the Fast Forward task be sort of like a luck based task or endurance/dare task placed after an HoH, where everybody gets a chance to go for it and the luckiest team/most daring team will win the Fast Forward. With that, probably nobody will think that the FF is a random lame task where the first team who arrives gets it. And that if it is an endurance/dare task, the team has to actually EARN it and not just complete some lame task and win the FF.

Also, you cannot have the U-TURN every leg. The producers WANT the teams to use the U-TURN, that was why the Blind U-TURN (without using Courtesy Of photo, so that a team can use the U-TURN again later on) was first imposed, and now - the DOUBLE U-TURN. If you put the U-TURN on every leg, there's going to be less drama involved when it comes to a time when a team actually decides to use the U-TURN.

[Zack.]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

[Jobby]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

[Caelestor]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

Add another task! 

[DavidJunior]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

Have it be only one EP can be used on a particular task

i.e. once team A uses it on the leg's detour, teams B, C, D, E, and F can no longer use it for that task

[Jobby]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

Have it be only one EP can be used on a particular task

i.e. once team A uses it on the leg's detour, teams B, C, D, E, and F can no longer use it for that task

That could work too. But that would mean EXTRA work for the producers you know? They need to constantly keep track of the team's movement and such. I still think one express pass is good.

[methylc]

I would rather they make the number of Fast Forwards unknown (but definitely more than one or two, maybe 4, 5, 6 or more in the entire race, variable between different races) and teams will take their chances whether they should take it or wait until the next one (IF there is another one, especially if they will not know whether there will be another opportunity again).

[Mug Costanza]

I think giving every team an Express Pass might be overkill, but I think more than one team should get one. Consider something to this extent: on the first leg, have an overnight rest on a beach. On this beach there is a marked area where 5 Express Passes are buried. Once teams arrive and sign in, they can start digging, and each team can only claim one. Teams that have raced better and arrived at the overnight rest are first will deservedly have more time to look for it and have a greater chance of finding them. This way, more than one team has one, and it's not just a hand-out; teams still have to compete for them.

(And since this is still a thread about the Fast Forward, I'll just say again that there should be at least more than 2 Fast Forwards on every leg to make it competetive and strategic again.)

[Prophet]

I think giving every team an Express Pass might be overkill, but I think more than one team should get one. Consider something to this extent: on the first leg, have an overnight rest on a beach. On this beach there is a marked area where 5 Express Passes are buried. Once teams arrive and sign in, they can start digging, and each team can only claim one. Teams that have raced better and arrived at the overnight rest are first will deservedly have more time to look for it and have a greater chance of finding them. This way, more than one team has one, and it's not just a hand-out; teams still have to compete for them.

I like this idea. However I don't think the way they did it on TAR17 is a handout, you have to win the leg after all.

[Rogue]

I think giving every team an Express Pass might be overkill, but I think more than one team should get one. Consider something to this extent: on the first leg, have an overnight rest on a beach. On this beach there is a marked area where 5 Express Passes are buried. Once teams arrive and sign in, they can start digging, and each team can only claim one. Teams that have raced better and arrived at the overnight rest are first will deservedly have more time to look for it and have a greater chance of finding them. This way, more than one team has one, and it's not just a hand-out; teams still have to compete for them.

I like this idea. However I don't think the way they did it on TAR17 is a handout, you have to win the leg after all.

I don't like the idea of having more than one Fast Forward. Supposedly one of the reasons they stopped doing so many was because they'd pay money to have these Fast Forwards set up and teams wouldn't go to them, trying to hold out so they could use one later. I think the way they used it this year was good because there were still 8 teams left as opposed to being down to say 5 and someone uses a Fast Forward. Maybe a better way to treat this would be to not have the Fast Forward on a leg in basically the same city as the previous leg. Even though it wasn't the same city this time it was just a drive through the boarder. Make teams hop on a flight to their next city, go to pick up their clue, and have the Fast Forward there.

As far as the Express Pass, I think maybe there should be two given in the race. One for winning the first leg and one thrown in a random leg but must still be used before a certain leg in the race. So maybe you can reward the winner of the third leg but still state that the Express Pass must be used by leg 8. If a team gets eliminated before using the Express Pass it either becomes void or they do what they state now, give it to the second place team from that leg. So if Thomas and Jill would have gotten eliminated before using their Express Pass it would have went to Nat and Kat. And let's say if Conner and Jonathan were eliminated in leg four and didn't use their Express Pass it would have gone to Gary and Mallory. And if teams were in a situation like we had in Oman, it would be interesting to see who would use their Express Pass at the best and most opportunistic moment. This is just a crazy thought in my head about how the situation could play out but of course it would never happen like this.

[Jobby]

3 FF and 3 Express Passes on the race?

Maybe the Express Pass should work like a HII like in Survivor? At the start of the leg (or maybe at any clue), the producers will drop a hint in the clue that an Express Pass has been hidden at a particular location on the race. Teams can either choose to race on and ignore travelling to the location to find the Express Pass, or go to that particular location on a search for the Express Pass.

The Express Pass cannot be found easily, for example let's say... they have a marked area at the beach and teams who want the EP will have to dig and try to find it. This could work out to be good drama if more than one team go for the EP, and then when they find the EP.. they will have to CONTINUE ON racing and make up for the valuable time that they lost while trying to find the EP.. which they may or may not necessary find. And if they managed to make up valuable time, they will get to keep the EP and can use it up till leg 8.. but if they found the EP but realized that they're at the back of the pack, they will have no choice but to use the EP to gain back some time. The worst of all is, if more than 2 teams went for the EP and 1 team found it.. the other team just lost valuable time and now will have to battle against the team with the EP to avoid elimination.

It all sounds pretty confusing.. but i think it can work out to be real good drama on the race. With that, the EP will not just be handed out.. but it will be more of a strategic move, which you try and find something which might potentially let you gain sometime in the future legs.. but at the same time you must make sure you can make up some time and not get eliminated.

And i still think.. tasks like this.. works best when you have an Hours of Operations. Let all the teams be bunched on equal ground. Imagine a team knew that another team (on a flight 2 hours later) has not reached yet and took all the time to find the EP... and will avoid elimination anyway? Same goes for the FF.. let there be HoO and let every team has an equal chance to go for it. The last time i remember there was an FF drama was when there were some sort of HoO and every team was on equal ground. Michael and Louie went for the FF in Singapore after arriving on the same train with Dan and Jordan.. arrived later than them at Victoria Concert Hall and did not know they went for it. As well as in TAR 13 where T/S and N/S fought for the FF after a HoO!

[Glamazon Racer]

I don't want to comment on the Express Pass until I see it in action for at least 1 more season, but as regards to the Fast Forward, I would be extremely disappointed if they scrapped the task. However, it cannot continue to exist with just one Fast Forward available in each season.

I would love a Fast Forward in each leg, but that is not economically feasible, so I would like at least 3 or 4 in the race course. When there is only 1, I believe it removes the strategy behind the Fast Forward. Before, you had to decide when would be the best time to use it. Now, if you are in the lead and you see one, you go for it - no questions asked, because you won't get another chance.

Also, the Fast Forward can't be used to catch up anymore.  There is only one per race, and the leading team at that particular point can go after it. If you are not leading, then you assume that the leader has taken it and you don't attempt it (this has been the case in Season 13 onwards, although Season 13 had 2-team- battles on two occasions between equal leading teams, Season 14's Fast Forward was unused and Nick & Vicki tried TAR17s although they seemed a little vague on the whole Fast Forward concept. )

This is just my opinion. Tell me if you agree or not, but I am a firm believer that there should be 3-4 Fast Forwards per race.

[David]

I'm OK with the FF things all of you said. I catch all of your points:
-If there's one, great for the competitivity, as you have to stay in the lead so as to go for it.
-If there's 3/4, better for competitivity and strategies.
-If there's one per leg, no competitivity but there IS a lot of strategy involved.

About the Express Pass, one for each team with no more than one team using it in the same task seems allright for me!