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The Amazing Race => The Amazing Race Discussion => Topic started by: Neobie on March 28, 2009, 02:30:08 PM
Title: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on March 28, 2009, 02:30:08 PM
Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
We watch the Amazing Race for different reasons. Some see the world through racers’ eyes, some for the emotions global travel arouses. Most are intrigued by the scale and intensity of the production.
But of late, the race has turned farce.
Slapstick tasks
Early editions of the race are compared to travelogues, allowing the audience to experience the culture of a destination vicariously. Teams danced with the Berber nomads of Tunisia, shared sunglasses with the children of Cape Town’s townships, and played Brazilian volleyball on the beaches of Rio. These interactions have been replaced with slapstick challenges designed for low humour, recently exemplified by the “pinnacle” of slapstick comedy, throwing cake on each other’s faces.
Low comedy would be forgivable if the tasks were identifiable to the locale, but throwing Austrian cakes does not an Austrian task make. In the most recent edition alone, teams have been made to carry Italian cheese in Switzerland on constructed-to-break racks, ride Segways (an American invention) in Bavaria, and run through Siberia in their underwear, apparently not the tradition host Phil Keoghan believes it to be. Real experiences, it seems, have been sacrificed for cheap laughs.
Cultural irrelevance
Producers have become increasingly insensitive to a locale’s cultural essence. Relying on stereotypes or transplanted customs, they add to the very cultural misunderstanding the show is touted to break down.
After visiting Hong Kong in the second season (in which they applaudably highlighted the city’s blend of tradition and novelty), the race returned in its eleventh cycle to an episode filled with blatant stereotypes, beginning with the very first destination, a laundromat in Tsimshatsui.
Now the laundromat is at best an American-Chinese tradition, started up for immigrants in the Chinatowns of the West. With almost every Hong Kong household owning a washing machine since the industrial boom of the 1950s, the laundromat has never had a following in the city, save the occasional need for dry cleaning. One more interesting fact: the laundromat in question, Sun Wah Kiu, is located in the heart of the city’s tourist district. The owner tells me the bulk of their business comes from tourists, not locals, and is genuinely surprised she was approached to represent the city on the race.
The episode continues to explore Hong Kong’s movie and stunt industries with “kung-fu fighters” dressed as Japanese ninjas, and ends off with a “game Hong Kong children play”, tugging a replica junk across a model boat pond. I, for my twelve years of childhood growing up in the city, have never heard of such a tradition. Hong Kong, famous for its hilly terrain, doesn’t have that many ponds to begin with. With model junks unaffordable to the masses before the 80s and out of vogue ever since, did the producers create a “tradition” out of thin air?
End of Part One
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on March 29, 2009, 04:20:28 AM
Hi Neobie!
Let me be the first to comment... :)
I must agree that the tasks on the latter seasons has lost its magic in exchange for pure quality tv humor and programming, contrary to what BvM said that they would focus more on the locations and the "culturally relevant" tasks in itself...
However, these things aren't even at the tip of the iceberg for me to stop watching the race. (Well I might have, I found it boring to watch the twelfth season for a week - the second episode, and came back after seeing some drama) As far as I know, the Austria-Germany detour was the worst for this season's (counting up to episode 6).
However, cultural irrelevance is something that I don't see in almost every episode. Why? The Hong Kong leg in All Stars showed not the culturally things Americans or tourists go, rather the walk of life of the usual HongKonger, which is through mazes and mazes of stores and buildings, and the stunty detour and roadblock proved to show how this region is famed for - action movies.
The junks I suppose is purely made up because of Travelocity.
I think that there may be some legs that are flaws or misinterpretations to some of what we know as cultures, but overall - what I see is that the producers are trying to:
1) Immerse the racers to the common life existing in a particular country they are in - not just cultural or touristy, and not just being a travel show 2) Provide another angle or point of view to us, viewers as to how we see not only the better or finer things in the country, rather showing the reality or how life is in where they are visiting.
AND...
3) To keep us fans who adore and love the show have a hard time spoiling (oh really now?) and following their tracks as they race all across the world!
I think that the Amazing Race has turned into a "tourist show" to a "travel show."
Just my opinions, peace! :hearts:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on March 29, 2009, 04:41:43 AM
The end of open-endedness
The very first episode of The Amazing Race piled questions and decisions onto the contestants at the get-go. Which airport do you head for? Do you get there by train or taxi? Which flights are likely to be direct, and therefore likely to get you to your destination sooner? The leg progressed with challenging clues ("Find the smoke that thunders." "A ____ pot never ____.") and difficult decisions (whether or not to pursue the one-off Fast Forward). Teams used to be let out of the starting gate with the words “Whatever you do… is completely up to you.”
Host Phil doesn’t say that any more, and the race has turned into a cattle corral where contestants are directed from destination to destination by means specific to the minutest detail. Teams are told to take flights connecting through specified cities, and trains at specific timings. Deviating from the course is a big no-no, and when a team takes the metro over a taxi to save money, they are refused the clue to carry on. While herding teams within narrow fences makes logistics that much simpler, it removed the free rein early racers had to make the show entertaining, and in so doing changed the main reason for elimination from poor decision-making to poor luck.
Security and privacy
Racers of today are a protected lot. They are followed around at each locale by an entourage of production assistants, making the race a spectacle of itself. Train stations are opened for racers at three in the morning to keep them from the locals. Police escorts protect and cordon off the teams on the streets, and production hires a security team of six protecting the Pit Stops. Compare this to the times when contestants slept out in the streets of Hungary, or when mother-and-daughter duo Nancy and Emily sat huddled and crying, mobbed by the begging crowds of Delhi.
The race now runs in a bubble world to keep spoilers from leaking. Jewellery shops are redesigned as puppet stores, fake company signs are put up, and abandoned apartments renovated to look like tailor shops. Racers are prohibited from taking public transportation, most likely from the fear that they’d be recognized.
For the race, producers have created a world completely detached from the existing one, inventing slapstick tasks, new cultures, and cordoning off the racecourse, both from within and without. My advice to the show which is gaining popularity but losing the “amazing” qualities that kept me watching from Day One: keep it real.
Above rant written with the resources provided by all the nice folks of RFF, and the luck of being able to track the race through a dozen cities in the Asia-Pacific. Please feel free to ask for specifics wrt my arguments.
Thanks for the comments Mooyou!
I'm disappointed especially with the Hong Kong leg, since so little of what is shown belongs to the life of the "usual Hong Konger". The laundromat does tourist business. The stunts are alright for a single task, but the Roadblock, and Detour, and Fast Forward all revolving around the same theme? That reeks of laziness. (Guess what? They engaged the same stunt company to cover all three tasks.)
There are challenging culturally-relevant tasks that allow for product placement, the need for security and the race's want of privacy. (Call me, CBS!) Too bad production isn't ready to take the extra step.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on March 29, 2009, 04:51:36 AM
I'm disappointed especially with the Hong Kong leg, since so little of what is shown belongs to the life of the "usual Hong Konger". The laundromat does tourist business. The stunts are alright for a single task, but the Roadblock, and Detour, and Fast Forward all revolving around the same theme? That reeks of laziness. (Guess what? They engaged the same stunt company to cover all three tasks.)
There are challenging culturally-relevant tasks that allow for product placement, the need for security and the race's want of privacy. Too bad production isn't ready to take the extra step.
Hong Kong is a fabulous place! I so much love it there! But TAR (and its spinoff Asia) has absolutely no good legs in HK... I think the popularity of the race itself restricted the coverage of the race, and probably security is installed to keep us fans from going straight to the teams, pulling and aiding them even to the pitstop... like the woman who recognized Romber. (Man, I envy the South African woman who got to step at the mat together with Romber in Season 7!!!)
I think redesigning things by TPTB is more costly though, but I hope that your article could be read by the producers, ESPECIALLY ELISE and BVM, so that they could figure out a way to push back the show to its former glory instead of a circus. This Season (14) should be the start of its restoration.
Care to try emailing them? :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on March 29, 2009, 12:31:22 PM
Neobie
Some of your points are things that have actually occurred from day one. Teams have always been limited to certain carriers, security personnel have always been around (they do use more now), some tasks have always been manufactured, or based on american cultural stereotypes, or of long dead practices.
Some of your points still probably happen (we just don't see them), for example Phil's comments at the starting line, might still happen he has always spoken for more then what we see in the episodes according to racers. The teams still do on occasion sleep on the street (we rarely get that footage anymore), they still interact with locals (again something we really don't see much of anymore). Those are things that the production could easily change in just how they edit the show, if they wished to.
The change in how the clues are designed for the most part changed between seasons 1 and 2. They still keep a few where the teams have to figure things out (or aren't hand feed specific directions (we have had three such clues this season), but the practice of having the clue be a puzzle ended for the most part with season one.
As to first season teams having to figure out which airport to depart from, that was a rare case because I do believe its the only time a they started the race where a city had two major international airports in taxi distance. But teams did know which carriers and what flight numbers they could take (they just were told the airport).
On the issue of teams being kept more out of the public eye, through having task being kept in remote areas or in rented out locals this is also something that has happened even as far back as season one, but it is more common today and that is probably due to two costs. 1 I am sure is due to spoilers, and CBS and the producers trying to make it less easy for the common viewer to know what happens in the race. Earlier season really didn't have to worry about it (I remember the first spoiler I ever heard and that was an airline passenger saying how the final three were in season 3). But as the race has gotten more popular both in the US and overseas the production has had to take more steps.
A really good example of this is the leg in All Stars, where local fans followed the teams all day, that they helped Charla & Mirna perform tasks. Not because they randomly were able to charm locals, but because those fans loved Charla & MIrna and wanted to help them. Look at how many fans got upset about the undue amount of local help Rob & Amber got, because of their popularity of being on survivor.
Its one thing for racers to get local help (and they do get that probably in large part due to the camera man and sound man), but to get specific help because OH my god they are on the amazing race.... (and hell I would be doing that).
Season 13 the reports were so spoiled that If Puddin actually released the location (which they found out) I could have had about 20 people out scouting areas in Portland. Including the finish line.
The other reason is it is often times cheaper to film in secluded locations or to film in an area after normal business hours.
But that doesn't mean that they can't provide a more accurate local activity for teams to perform. But it does mean that any natural interaction with locals (instead of people that have been hired) is limited to more of the navigation aspect of the legs (and thats something that is shown a lot less.
And while we have always had a couple of tasks that are humor based, I do agree that this season in particular has a high number of them. I personally prefer more endurance, strength tasks (but so many fans complain about those being designed more for the young and the male).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on March 29, 2009, 01:29:15 PM
Neobie
And just in case you couldn't tell, I do agree with your opinion that we lose a little of what makes TAR special when we see more "fake" local tasks and less authentic local interactions. I was just giving reason why that may be occurring (not that I don't want to see it).
One other possible reason for getting less coverage of down time (where they do interact) either during lulls in the race or in navigating is that we for the most part used to get 14 hours of TAR. 13 episodes (with the first episode typically being 2 hours). We have since been cut to 11 hours of TAR (12 for this season which is still less then most) in which for us to get to know the racers themselves. So a lot of the non competition aspects of the race haven't been shown, and that is often some of the more interesting footage.
For example that would have been the racers dancing with locals after they check in (or Peach giving sun glasses to local children while Mary performed the Roadblock). Things like BJ & TYler bonding with Bedowin (Sorry I can't remember how to spell it). Those are awesome moments and with less time I can see the editors thinking we don't need to see it.
I personally love that type of footage (even tiny moments like the footage of the teams this season on the train going through switzerland was cool).
Now an occasion dumb stupid task is fine. For example I loved the cow task last season, but that was mainly due to the natural humor the racers brought to the situation.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on April 03, 2009, 08:19:30 PM
I agree with much of what you have said, Neobie, although I don't know of any other solutions to circumvent spoilers unless the spoiler people themselves have some rules on what can and can't be posted (for example, I don't think it's a good idea to spoil the final 3 or the winners, or to post a bootlist especially, because that type of thing is a big blow to the production's efforts). That might encourage production that they don't have to worry as much about spoilers getting leaked. I wouldn't die if we never found out what the bootlist is or who the final 3/winners are.
I totally agree with the rest. Bring the FF to about 5 or 6 per race, show more interaction with locals, have and show more self-driving, and more of the other stuff that has made this show great. Build on the Race's foundation, don't tear it down and make the Race a cheap comedy of crazy people (that's what Big Brother is for). Really set them loose as much as possible. I want to see more Peter & Sarah lost in the desert moments. :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on April 03, 2009, 10:21:25 PM
I've been saying that TAR has lost its magic with season 7 being the last of the best. I haven't commented because my goal was to sit through all seasons back to back and then season 14 started so I'm still half way through season 6. I'm trying to see for myself where/why, exactly.... it lost its magic :'(
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on April 03, 2009, 10:54:08 PM
Am I the only one who beg to differ from everyone else? I don't think The Amazing Race has lost the magic but is getting better instead! I think teams and unpredictability is what makes the race, of course clues relating to the culture of the place makes the race very interesting as well.. but i still believe the teams and unpredicatbility can make up the season.
The reason why people really like TAR 3, 5 and 7 was because of the unpredictability. No one expected the winners to be Flo/Zach, Uchenna/Joyce and Chip/Kim. And with Linda and Karen and Meredith and Gretchen being the underdogs and outlasting teams which are much more stronger, it makes the race so much more exciting and interesting isn't it? Look at TAR 8, TAR 9 and TAR 13. Those were the seasons that received relatively low positive comments because the winners were predictable (Linz, Eric/Jeremy and BJ/Tyler as well as Nick and Starr coming in first every leg)
I do agree that the tasks have been becoming more and more slapstick and I do believe that the production team can do better than that. But I believe that's due to the production cost and that they are really doing their best to present to the audience what they want to see on TV. For example, I know going to Phuket Zoo this leg on TAR 14 is like so common and uninteresting for some other people who wants to see more than zoos and parks from different countries, but I believe many people do want to see the tourist attractions in Phuket which is why they included the place in. There could be more intellectual tasks though, which i agree wholeheartedly.
I loved TAR, loves TAR and still lovin' TAR. :hearts: I think Season 14 is picking up the momentum with the new changes and unpredictability. (Kisha and Jen in FINAL 5?? :funny:) The only thing that can make it even more unpredictable is Tammy and Victor getting eliminated next... which I don't want to see it happen. lol!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on April 03, 2009, 11:00:39 PM
Puddin? 75000?! God.
Congratulations!! :conf:
I'll be the purist and say that the classic TAR hasn't been the same since Tunisia in TAR 1. (Did one of BvM and Elise plan the first half of the race, and the other the second? I like one so much better than the other!)
Remember: All the Episode One greatness The choice of whether or not to hire a driver Subways versus taxis in Paris The secret "cargo boat" from Marseilles Taxis racing trains to El Jem The need to direct taxi drivers
And these "clues", which now only appear every so once in a blue moon that TPTB actually gets praised for putting them in: Songwe Museum The Eiffel Tower appearing in the middle of a leg, with no accompanying instructions Find something monumental Ring "Quasimodo's bell" The cat next to *which* Focault's Pendulum? Go to *Turkey?* and find this Arc de Triomphe The El Jem lighter
Leg finishes can be made more unpredictable (in a good way) if production held the teams on longer leashes. With more decisions to make (such as giving them clues to solve, the option of Fast Forwards or various modes of transportation), teams get the chance to surge ahead and fall behind, all without reliance on bunching or dumb luck.
Don't cattle corral them! (Yes, producers. It is hard work. But you did it in TAR 1. Are you lazy now? *taunt*)
Notice how even the AYL was kick-ass back then.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on April 04, 2009, 07:03:10 AM
puddin, that is an Amazing milestone. 75,000 posts. You are prolific. Congratulations!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Snooky on April 04, 2009, 10:36:10 AM
puddin, that is an Amazing milestone. 75,000 posts. You are prolific. Congratulations!
If you look at the stats page, she is huge compared to everyone else! Anyway... I totally agree with Neobie, if you watch the first season you see so many cultural and intersting clues. It doesn't have the standard clue or cluebox. However, in my opinion The Amazing Race is getting better once again. We got a fresh new start, and it is a lot more entertaining than our past "Microseasons". We also have the great more cultural sounding theme song. But we do need to have better cultural tasks. And I really love saying cultural!
I do not think TAR got ridiculous until Season 12 and 13. It has forever bothered me that they would even consider 11 legs, unless they have 2 double legs! In all stars Joe and Bill and Eric and Danielle were behind for 3 legs or so. So it wasn't too controlled yet in my opinion! The one thing I do want to see in this season is for it to be less bunched. Season thirteen was so bunched that it always seemed like a footrace or a taxi race. Not a self-driving race because there was hardly any self-driving at all in that season. It just so happens that leg 4 was my favorite because it had self-driving!
We could also have long distance train, car, and bus rides that are 300 miles long. Or say train rides that were 1,000 miles long. Wasn't there a drive in season 4 that was 500 miles long?
But after all of this, I do think that the race is improving after two very annoying seasons of crazy Americans that are being dragged around the world.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: gingerman28 on April 04, 2009, 10:57:46 AM
puddin, that is an Amazing milestone. 75,000 posts. You are prolific. Congratulations!
That's strange, Puddin posted number 75,000 back onNOVEMBER 5, 2008. Who is pulling whom's leg? But we luv you anyway :hearts:
Heee...it is probably 75000 for the third time! But :hearts: and :wohoo: :jumpy: :wohoo: anyway!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Kiwi Jay on April 04, 2009, 04:02:59 PM
I must say I have always keenly followed the race and each one brought something to the table. I must say I agree with puddin the fire stopped at 7. 8,9 sucked 10 was ok but predictable. 11 was much better. 12 I thought we were on the right track. 13 bummed me out. 14 has started lighting a fire for me?
Does anyone else feel these teams for 14 are better than the past few seasons?
I dont agree with peach on the season 1 thing ! haha It wasnt that early. I want a season with everything on the table who gives a crap about money. THEY DO! But there are ways to do things and look into the culture of each place and make great legs around it.
GOOD TEAMS HARDER CLUES (SEASON 1) GOOD LOCATIONS GOOD TASKS MORE PHIL...
LOL
In my opinion "Go to the smoke that thunders to recieve the next clue is really cool
Instead of "Drive to Niagra Falls to get the next clue"
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on April 05, 2009, 01:24:16 AM
The amazing race is still magical for me, and always has been.
If you got an unexpected result every time, the unexpected would become the expected, and lose its magic.
You need the Colin and Christie/Nick and Starr (Anybody else notice how the two most dominant teams in history aren't M/M teams?) teams to keep the unexpected results in perspective, and to keep them that much more amazing.
And of course, let's not forget the magic of seeing a team as good as Colin and Christie get beaten in the final leg. To this day that remains in the classic episode collection, simply because the power team lost.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on April 05, 2009, 08:13:27 AM
Congratulations puddin! 75000 posts!?!? That's so powerful! :lol: :hearts: :jumpy:
I have to admit, season 1 was incomparable to all other seasons because it's a first. Season 5 is comparable to the greatest season ever, even though Collin/Christie dominated the legs in the middle. Adding Romber in Season 7 killed the spark for me. Season 8 - AS went down and were not able to recover, and the only time I felt that the Amazing Race is really amazing in the microseasons were legs 7++ (excluding leg 4 of the 13th season).
REAL Culturally relevant tasks neglect by production is such a heartbreaker though...
But the magic of the race stays on! The olympic torch of the race was just lit by this season! :wohoo: And hope that it continues on forever...
Just a question and something to ponder on... Don't you think that this season's TAR is kinda following the editing style of TARA? I was rewatching the 3rd season of TARA and have found completely similar editing sequences (especially LONG PREVIOUSLY ON TAR...), minus all of those split screens, new music etc...
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Snooky on April 05, 2009, 08:41:02 AM
Quote
Just a question and something to ponder on... Don't you think that this season's TAR is kinda following the editing style of TARA? I was rewatching the 3rd season of TARA and have found completely similar editing sequences (especially LONG PREVIOUSLY ON TAR...), minus all of those split screens, new music etc...
Ya, I think it is a little similar. I also think that they might be using different cameras this season. I have never found TAR Asia to have as good editing as TAR though.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on April 05, 2009, 09:35:04 AM
Just a question and something to ponder on... Don't you think that this season's TAR is kinda following the editing style of TARA? I was rewatching the 3rd season of TARA and have found completely similar editing sequences (especially LONG PREVIOUSLY ON TAR...), minus all of those split screens, new music etc...
Ya, I think it is a little similar. I also think that they might be using different cameras this season. I have never found TAR Asia to have as good editing as TAR though.
I must agree that TARA editing is miles below TAR's supremacy in reality television editing.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Cocoa on April 11, 2009, 09:08:54 PM
Hello!
TARA is a nightmare came to life.... from its clumsy host that has only its sexy hot body as its asset.... from the destinations common or nothing exciting...... and the editing that was just like its made by a 2nd Grader (it "zooms" and the music was nothing like any of TAR seasons to date)....... not to mention the boring teams that only Henri and Terry are exempted to that....... its like a show combined to destroy TAR..... but i dont bother watching it........
and from TAR losing its magic? I cant say much because i just started watching it (with interest) only starts from Season 7 (season 3 actually, but i never knew it was TAR). But yes, i do believe it, TAR is deteriorating.... however it does not stop me from watching it.... and due to the globel economic crisis, the producers definitely would limit some actions of the racers to save some money.. Its not a joke to travel around the globe with crews and teams. That is a LOT of money.
and from TAR tasks? i dont care if its "culturally irrelevant", i dont care what task it is, because its not a main travel show!
(http://grab.by/3P1j)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Ashe on April 11, 2009, 09:28:31 PM
Just a question and something to ponder on... Don't you think that this season's TAR is kinda following the editing style of TARA? I was rewatching the 3rd season of TARA and have found completely similar editing sequences (especially LONG PREVIOUSLY ON TAR...), minus all of those split screens, new music etc...
Ya, I think it is a little similar. I also think that they might be using different cameras this season. I have never found TAR Asia to have as good editing as TAR though.
I must agree that TARA editing is miles below TAR's supremacy in reality television editing.
Gee, I don't agree at all. Sure, it's sometimes confusing, but unlike with U.S. TAR, at least TARA tries to give everyone else as even screentime as possible and let you get to know all the teams as much as you can, whereas TAR only gives the bulk of the airtime to the longer-lasting teams and almost completely shafts the earlier-exiting ones. (Case in point: Preston & Jennifer, Brad & Victoria, and Amanda & Kris this season. Of the early-eliminated teams, only Steve & Linda got mondo screentime.)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on April 11, 2009, 11:00:39 PM
Just a question and something to ponder on... Don't you think that this season's TAR is kinda following the editing style of TARA? I was rewatching the 3rd season of TARA and have found completely similar editing sequences (especially LONG PREVIOUSLY ON TAR...), minus all of those split screens, new music etc...
Ya, I think it is a little similar. I also think that they might be using different cameras this season. I have never found TAR Asia to have as good editing as TAR though.
I must agree that TARA editing is miles below TAR's supremacy in reality television editing.
Gee, I don't agree at all. Sure, it's sometimes confusing, but unlike with U.S. TAR, at least TARA tries to give everyone else as even screentime as possible and let you get to know all the teams as much as you can, whereas TAR only gives the bulk of the airtime to the longer-lasting teams and almost completely shafts the earlier-exiting ones. (Case in point: Preston & Jennifer, Brad & Victoria, and Amanda & Kris this season. Of the early-eliminated teams, only Steve & Linda got mondo screentime.)
Yeah, I agree. I would rather have fairness in editing even if it's slightly confusing. It makes it harder to predict and more interesting. I was really unhappy about the imbalanced editing in this season, but it's not over yet.
Of course, all the teams they ignore except Kisha & Jen are gone so it's too late to make up for it now.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on April 12, 2009, 09:55:36 AM
Just a question and something to ponder on... Don't you think that this season's TAR is kinda following the editing style of TARA? I was rewatching the 3rd season of TARA and have found completely similar editing sequences (especially LONG PREVIOUSLY ON TAR...), minus all of those split screens, new music etc...
Ya, I think it is a little similar. I also think that they might be using different cameras this season. I have never found TAR Asia to have as good editing as TAR though.
I must agree that TARA editing is miles below TAR's supremacy in reality television editing.
Gee, I don't agree at all. Sure, it's sometimes confusing, but unlike with U.S. TAR, at least TARA tries to give everyone else as even screentime as possible and let you get to know all the teams as much as you can, whereas TAR only gives the bulk of the airtime to the longer-lasting teams and almost completely shafts the earlier-exiting ones. (Case in point: Preston & Jennifer, Brad & Victoria, and Amanda & Kris this season. Of the early-eliminated teams, only Steve & Linda got mondo screentime.)
I'd say the prime example of this in TARA would be the end of Season 3, even though Sam & Vince had already won, they took time to show Ida & Tania's leg instead of the U.S. version who totally forgets about the 3rd place team mid-episode.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Ashe on April 12, 2009, 02:26:05 PM
You need the Colin and Christie/Nick and Starr (Anybody else notice how the two most dominant teams in history aren't M/M teams?) teams to keep the unexpected results in perspective, and to keep them that much more amazing.
Nick & Starr dominated only because all the other teams sucked. They were merely lucky in that regard. Were they up against way more competitive teams, they would've been out long before the F3.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: woden on April 13, 2009, 08:27:10 AM
Watch the first ep of TAR 7 where the teams are riding in the back of trucks through backwoods Peru with locals. Nothing like that happens on TAR anymore. That's why it's lost it's magic -- it has a pre-packaged feel from the tasks to the means of travel to the teams to the locations.
Also, love them or hate them, TAR has not been able to recreate the casting magic of Rob/Amber, who turned race strategy into an art form.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on April 13, 2009, 08:54:37 AM
You need the Colin and Christie/Nick and Starr (Anybody else notice how the two most dominant teams in history aren't M/M teams?) teams to keep the unexpected results in perspective, and to keep them that much more amazing.
Nick & Starr dominated only because all the other teams sucked. They were merely lucky in that regard. Were they up against way more competitive teams, they would've been out long before the F3. [/quote
Ashe: To state that Ken/Tina at 7 to 10 minutes behind at the Finish Line or Toni/Dallas sucked is pretty blatant. I thought AR13 was plenty competitive even though Nick/Starr won the majority of the important legs. I will guess that you must have been thinking aobut Dan/Andrew, whose main function was to provide comic relief.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on April 13, 2009, 09:01:53 AM
You need the Colin and Christie/Nick and Starr (Anybody else notice how the two most dominant teams in history aren't M/M teams?) teams to keep the unexpected results in perspective, and to keep them that much more amazing.
Nick & Starr dominated only because all the other teams sucked. They were merely lucky in that regard. Were they up against way more competitive teams, they would've been out long before the F3.
Ashe: To state that Ken/Tina at 7 to 10 minutes behind at the Finish Line or Toni/Dallas sucked is pretty blatant. I thought AR13 was plenty competitive even though Nick/Starr won the majority of the important legs. I will guess that you must have been thinking aobut Dan/Andrew, whose main function was to provide comic relief.
hear, hear.
Kenny and Tina were (for me, anyway) The BJ and Tyler of TAR 13, always just behind the dominant force. And Toni and Dallas were a well oiled racing machine, miles better than Ronald and Christina, who made final 3.
The only teams in series 13 that put in really forgettable performances were Dandrew, Anthony and Stephanie and Aja and Ty. All the other teams had distinct high points in their race.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on April 13, 2009, 09:51:34 AM
Also, love them or hate them, TAR has not been able to recreate the casting magic of Rob/Amber, who turned race strategy into an art form.
If you call bribery, strategy...I think that ain't gonna happen anymore, you see how negatively peple here react to Mark & Michael's pump hiding last leg and while some people still criticize the use of the U-Turn...Actually, now that I think of it, it's sad that most of the time teams in TAR strategize they're showcased like "evil"
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on April 13, 2009, 10:22:32 AM
I heard this analogy on TWoP way back in Season 2: TAR should be run like a marathon or a motor race - you should do everything within the rules to get yourself ahead, but not anything to put others behind.
TAR7 Rob crossed the line from time to time, but my favourite racer for fourteen seasons? Still Blake and his zany schemes by a margin! (Metal detectors in the night, rhinoceros gifts, shortcuts to the mat...)
Oh how I took the Peruvian trucks for granted back in TAR7... OK the locals were planted, but... they give such a warm fuzzy feeling that's so hard to come by nowadays!
And TAR:A? Pfft. It takes the weaknesses of TAR and then magnifies them! (Adopting the U-Turn and placing it at the worst possible place, culturally-comatose tasks like paintball in Thailand, taxi-taxi-drive-taxi-drive...) It seems like the producers aren't trying very hard - I've seen school races organized by grade kids that are that much more professional - and I'm not kidding.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on April 13, 2009, 10:50:34 AM
TARA usually gets better once they reach the final 6
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TARAsia Fan on April 13, 2009, 11:06:43 AM
I haven't posted here, but I've read all of your comments. Everyone has valid points. Whether TAR works for you or not is totally subjective. There's no right or wrong answer here.
To me, TAR has remained fresh. While I was disappointed in TAR10 when Tyler & James won (I felt as negatively as Ashe did about TAR13), I've felt the producers have tried to continuously shake things up. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't (remember that "surprise" elimination in the middle of the first leg in TAR 10? - not a good idea, IMO).
But I still get excited for each new season. I still get pumped especially after an episode like last night. To me, TAR has not lost the magic, has not jumped the shark. If you feel that way, I respect that. We all can't agree.
The show may have lost the magic, but again, not a wrong answer. Hopefully, the producers will keep trying to make improvements to the show.
Over 13 seasons, you can't have the same show over and over again, then it becomes stale. I feel shows like American Idol and Survivor have become stale because of the formula. I feel because of the different locations each season, TAR is exciting and just seeing how each team deals with the language barrier and stress is great for me.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Ashe on April 13, 2009, 08:43:29 PM
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't (remember that "surprise" elimination in the middle of the first leg in TAR 10? - not a good idea, IMO).
That one actually could've worked a lot better had they saved it for later on, like, say, the F8 or F7.
I'll agree with that. And if they used it more than once a season, it could have been better.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on April 13, 2009, 09:33:16 PM
The main reason I have a hard time classifying how strong a team Nick & Starr were is that, not only was that season full of teams blundering. It was the one season (out of all of them) that featured almost no driving. In fact all the driving they did (first only in english speaking countries) total was less then most seasons have in a heavy driving leg. And the legs they did drive in were they lost positions.
In fact in most other seasons the ability to navigate (in vehicles) is one of the single biggest factors in how well a team does.
I am not saying this as someone who disliked Nick & Starr. In fact they were one of my favorites of that season.
Based on breaking down all tasks and abilities of teams (for all the seasons in fairly psychotic detail) I would place about 10 teams better then Nick & Starr.
Still like them though.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: tarflyonthewall on April 14, 2009, 12:12:15 AM
A while back, I posted this (http://raceguysrecaps.blogspot.com/2009/02/nine-biggest-problems-with-amazing-race.html) on my old blog. I like your explanations better, though.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on April 14, 2009, 07:07:03 AM
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't (remember that "surprise" elimination in the middle of the first leg in TAR 10? - not a good idea, IMO).
That one actually could've worked a lot better had they saved it for later on, like, say, the F8 or F7.
I'll agree with that. And if they used it more than once a season, it could have been better.
For me that suprise elimination was essentially a Pit Stop, since I regard the leg as a double length leg anyway.
Total agreement on the point of shows like Survivor and their formula though. Once you get people actively anticipating "twists" like a merge, its time to can the idea and go with something else.
Biggest suggestion I would have to make to improve TAR would be to bring back the Fast Forward on every leg, and have a Yield (or U-Turn, I'm not fussy) On every leg. This way it becomes a strategic decision to use it, instead of "It only appears once, we might as well take it" decision.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Ashe on April 14, 2009, 09:06:06 AM
Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't (remember that "surprise" elimination in the middle of the first leg in TAR 10? - not a good idea, IMO).
That one actually could've worked a lot better had they saved it for later on, like, say, the F8 or F7.
I'll agree with that. And if they used it more than once a season, it could have been better.
For me that suprise elimination was essentially a Pit Stop, since I regard the leg as a double length leg anyway.
Total agreement on the point of shows like Survivor and their formula though. Once you get people actively anticipating "twists" like a merge, its time to can the idea and go with something else.
Biggest suggestion I would have to make to improve TAR would be to bring back the Fast Forward on every leg, and have a Yield (or U-Turn, I'm not fussy) On every leg. This way it becomes a strategic decision to use it, instead of "It only appears once, we might as well take it" decision.
I suspect budget problems might've forced them to discontinue that tradition.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: patlini on April 14, 2009, 09:13:52 AM
Even if the current TAR isn't the same as it was in its infancy, its still better than a lot of the pap out there.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on April 14, 2009, 10:09:25 AM
I haven't posted here, but I've read all of your comments. Everyone has valid points. Whether TAR works for you or not is totally subjective. There's no right or wrong answer here.
To me, TAR has remained fresh. While I was disappointed in TAR10 when Tyler & James won (I felt as negatively as Ashe did about TAR13), I've felt the producers have tried to continuously shake things up. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't (remember that "surprise" elimination in the middle of the first leg in TAR 10? - not a good idea, IMO).
But I still get excited for each new season. I still get pumped especially after an episode like last night. To me, TAR has not lost the magic, has not jumped the shark. If you feel that way, I respect that. We all can't agree.
The show may have lost the magic, but again, not a wrong answer. Hopefully, the producers will keep trying to make improvements to the show.
Over 13 seasons, you can't have the same show over and over again, then it becomes stale. I feel shows like American Idol and Survivor have become stale because of the formula. I feel because of the different locations each season, TAR is exciting and just seeing how each team deals with the language barrier and stress is great for me.
I couldn't agree more with what you have said Ken! Survivor and AI have been stale because of the usual things, TAR has something new for us every time. Starting with the locations itself!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on April 14, 2009, 03:45:07 PM
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on April 14, 2009, 04:22:58 PM
I find it particularly interesting that he holds up Survivorman as the shining example of a real show. . Wasn't that the show that had a recent expose showing that the main guy was receiving quite a bit of production help along the way? Or do I have that comfused with another man against the bears show? :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on April 14, 2009, 04:39:12 PM
I think its this one peach
Man vs. Wild http://www.tvguide.com/news/Man-vs-Wild-13968.aspx
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on April 14, 2009, 05:02:17 PM
Thanks, puddin!! Gosh, the wilderness is hopping these days with Discovery Channel guys! :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Snooky on April 14, 2009, 07:23:53 PM
Man vs. Wild http://www.tvguide.com/news/Man-vs-Wild-13968.aspx
Honestly, I think that Man vs. Wild is more entertaining, but on survivorman the host is on his own. Anyway...back on topic: I compare season 1 to survivorman, and season 13 as Man vs. Wild.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on April 14, 2009, 07:59:34 PM
Man vs. Wild http://www.tvguide.com/news/Man-vs-Wild-13968.aspx
Honestly, I think that Man vs. Wild is more entertaining, but on survivorman the host is on his own. Anyway...back on topic: I compare season 1 to survivorman, and season 13 as Man vs. Wild.
lol, thats a great way to look at it Snooky!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on April 15, 2009, 02:31:15 AM
I find it particularly interesting that he holds up Survivorman as the shining example of a real show. . Wasn't that the show that had a recent expose showing that the main guy was receiving quite a bit of production help along the way? Or do I have that comfused with another man against the bears show? :lol:
On the note of help from production: Did anybody notice how much make up the girls (especially Parvati) seemed to be wearing on Fans vs Faves?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TexasLady on April 16, 2009, 03:42:13 PM
I haven't commented because I'm so new to TAR but from my family's perspective, we love TAR. Nothing else compares to it. It's people doing things that most viewers will never do in places they will never visit.
My hubby and I started watching during the last All-Star version and been hooked since. I'm sure if I had watched since the beginning I'd have suggestions or dislikes but to keep a show on the air, it has to attract viewers especially new viewers. In our home, it's a must watch show. (Not to mention how I am in total AWE of the super detective abilities of everyone here on this forum!) :tup:
BTW, I hate that survivor man show. I always think he's going to die any minute from dehydration, some super poisonous snake bite or a horrible foot fungus. :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on May 03, 2009, 12:22:23 PM
I was flipping through wikipedia looking at the statistics of the past seasons of The Amazing Race and realized how much TAR love TAR 14 has brought back for me. In an interview, i remembered Phil saying that this season was special and could be compared to that of Season 1,3,5 and 7.. which i completely agree now that the race is coming to an end. There were really memorable teams this season such as Margie and Luke and Tammy and Victor, just like in TAR 3 how people remembered Flo and Zach, TAR 5 for Colin and Christie and Charla and Mirna, TAR 7 for Meredith and Gretchen and Rob and Amber.
Compared to milder seasons like TAR 4, TAR 9 and TAR 13 (mostly in recent seasons), i believe that TAR 14 has indeed helped TAR make a comeback and place it as among one of those top reality shows of all time (it already is, just that more people like it better now!)
Alot of times, it really depends on luck that a season will come off as interesting and exciting to the viewers. For example, TAR 13 was ruined by Nick and Starr's constant first place, TAR 12 was ruined by a pair of boring winners (definitely not TK and Rachel's fault, but i believe Ron and Chris and Kynt and Vyxsin had wayyyy more supporters.. but TAR 12 was a good season overall), TAR Allstars was ruined by Eric and Danielle winning against SUPER popular teams from Dustin and Kandice, Charla and Mirna, Oswald and Danny and Uchenna and Joyce. TAR 10 was ruined by alpha males winning again and the two all-female teams who make it to the F4 not winning. TAR 9 was ruined by Eric and Jeremy and BJ and Tyler switching on and off for first place for the entire race and another alpha male winning while TAR 8 was ruined by the fact that it was raced in the USA. So if you're looking from my perspective, i actually believe that it is not wrong for me to say that from Season 8 to Season 13.. TAR was actually in a real mess because the expected happenings which majority wanted did not occur (such as more teams winning first and better winning teams).
Whereas for TAR 3, 5 and 7.. there was a magic to it like Phil had said because the race was more unpredictable. TAR 3 had Teri and Ian being the underdogs, Flo and Zach winning. TAR 5 had Chip and Kim, Charla and Mirna, Linda and Karen and Kami and Karli in the F6 while TAR 7 had Meredith and Gretchen in the F4 and Uchenna and Joyce winning against Rob and Amber. And the reason why i compare this season to the 3 i listed above, is because nobody expected Margie and Luke to make it to the F4.. and all-female teams like Kisha and Jen and Cara and Jaime making it to the F4. And we had what the producers always liked as well, drama between two teams which makes the race so much more interesting! Except with the fact that there are more double legs in a particular country, i actually thought that the tasks and locations chosen for TAR 14 has been of quality standard this season and they were actually memorable like other seasons task such as TAR 5 Caviar, meat carrying and Ostrich egg.. for example i really like the cheese rolling, cake throwing, running bare in the cold win in Siberia and a number of other memorable tasks this season that we haven't see but know it's going to come soon (Opera task and scorpion eating in China).
So the point i'm trying to make here is.. TAR lost it's magic for a period of time, but i believe TAR 14 brought the magic back and i hope this little spark and flame will continue to burn brighty and bring us a good season of TAR 15 and more seasons to come!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on May 03, 2009, 01:05:32 PM
I think TAR's magic relies mostly in how the casting process goes and not having teams that are clearly stronger than the rest, I think the cast director finally nailed it in this season making a memorable cast which was also funny, dramatic, and overall kept each other in check. I think TAR recovered its magic this season, because you can feel the competition between the teams.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on May 03, 2009, 01:36:49 PM
I agree with cdfe88 on this. Casting several teams all about equal in their performance potential is the key to the most successful amazing Races. In AR14, we have the final 4, but we also had Amanda and Kris and Brad and Victoria who bit the dust early but could have gone all the way.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on May 03, 2009, 01:57:32 PM
Ken curious why were you so upset that Tyler & James won that season?
Was it just personal dislike for them (Something I have a hard time understanding since all the footage has them being nicer overall then most of the final 6 teams of that season).
Was it just because they were young athletic men?
Was it because you honestly thought another team raced better?
Was it the EZ-Pass (which, even without it with the long stretch of running usually a staple in the final leg, they should have been able to keep the lead from Rob & Kim, plus they actually knew where they were going in New York City on foot, when Rob & Kim didn't)?
Something else? A combination of things?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on May 03, 2009, 02:29:28 PM
For a few opinions.
Some things I don't like about TAR.
Casting. One of the single biggest factors on the race. I don't want to hate any of the racers (thats just me I know a lot of people want to have someone who really pisses people). You can have sneaky people who you don't hate, you can have couples with conflict that you don't hate. For the most part TAR hasn't been too bad about this, but we have had exceptions (Season six had so many people I didn't like that it really, really turned me off).
Tasks - I know budget has been a huge issue for the show. First get rid of the Fast Forward it truly serves no purpose. Originally with it being in all but the last episode it gave every team the chance to use it and did make teams actually think. With it just being one (or two) a season its simply a reward for being first. I mean seriously since the end of season 4 how many times did the team that used the Fast Forward really need it? So since it was cut to save money, cut it completely save a little more.
While I do love a humorous task on occasion, they have really increased in the last two cycles (and I think its too much).
More interaction with locals and culture during the tasks _ Again this is another budget related thing. But I would rather have simple tasks that involved real locals and real culture then larger scaled tasks that are completely staged.
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
And for some positive comments -
In the last two seasons the producers have corrected (in my mind one of the biggest flaws the race has had).
The final leg: This should be the most difficult leg to win. This should be the leg where every mistake cost you. I mean seriously for all but two seasons this has been the easiest leg to win, and thats just monumentally stupid. Sure it gave us a great finish (even if you disagree with the results) in season 2. But that same format (almost a direct copy of how it was laid out) was season 10, and look how completely anticlimatic. I hope this season continues that.
Since season 10, the show has increased the number of clue that teams have had to figure out, it still isn't close to season one but its nice to see.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on May 03, 2009, 03:20:58 PM
The final leg: This should be the most difficult leg to win. This should be the leg where every mistake cost you. I mean seriously for all but two seasons this has been the easiest leg to win, and thats just monumentally stupid. Sure it gave us a great finish (even if you disagree with the results) in season 2. But that same format (almost a direct copy of how it was laid out) was season 10, and look how completely anticlimatic. I hope this season continues that.
Since season 10, the show has increased the number of clue that teams have had to figure out, it still isn't close to season one but its nice to see.
I think they made a huge step in the good direction when they started having the final Detour and/or Roadblock in the final destination. What's the point of having all the "big" task in another city if teams will most likely bunch for a flight (All-Stars) and in the end is just a race for the fittest?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on May 03, 2009, 08:02:25 PM
I agree with cdfe88 on this. Casting several teams all about equal in their performance potential is the key to the most successful amazing Races. In AR14, we have the final 4, but we also had Amanda and Kris and Brad and Victoria who bit the dust early but could have gone all the way.
This i really agree with. But i guess producers could have never guess which teams would go far or what. I would have expected Aja and Ty and Anthony and Stephanie of last season to go far as well..
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on May 03, 2009, 08:04:00 PM
Quote
Tasks - I know budget has been a huge issue for the show. First get rid of the Fast Forward it truly serves no purpose. Originally with it being in all but the last episode it gave every team the chance to use it and did make teams actually think. With it just being one (or two) a season its simply a reward for being first. I mean seriously since the end of season 4 how many times did the team that used the Fast Forward really need it? So since it was cut to save money, cut it completely save a little more.
This i completely agree with!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TARAsia Fan on May 03, 2009, 08:05:25 PM
Yeah, either do it all the way, a FF in every episode, or none at all. When no team takes it, it's a waste of money.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on May 03, 2009, 08:12:38 PM
Yeah, either do it all the way, a FF in every episode, or none at all. When no team takes it, it's a waste of money.
And it's just somehow weird teams are not taking the FF this season for no reason.. the first place team would not have taken the FF because they think they're in the lead.. while the last place team won't take the FF because they believe they're at the back and someone have gone before them.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on May 04, 2009, 06:13:05 AM
Yeah, either do it all the way, a FF in every episode, or none at all. When no team takes it, it's a waste of money.
And it's just somehow weird teams are not taking the FF this season for no reason.. the first place team would not have taken the FF because they think they're in the lead.. while the last place team won't take the FF because they believe they're at the back and someone have gone before them.
I'd suggest to put the FF right next to the Cluebox, but make it extra difficult/embarassing/gross/etc. That way teams will know if someone's already attempting it, but it also won't be such an easy decision to take it
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on May 04, 2009, 06:19:56 AM
Yeah, either do it all the way, a FF in every episode, or none at all. When no team takes it, it's a waste of money.
And it's just somehow weird teams are not taking the FF this season for no reason.. the first place team would not have taken the FF because they think they're in the lead.. while the last place team won't take the FF because they believe they're at the back and someone have gone before them.
I'd suggest to put the FF right next to the Cluebox, but make it extra difficult/embarassing/gross/etc. That way teams will know if someone's already attempting it, but it also won't be such an easy decision to take it
I know this would work.. but i believe editors like it better when the Terence/Sarah and Nick/Starr battle for the FF occurs (travelling to a place on a taxi race).. so that they have more things to include on their show.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on May 04, 2009, 09:57:16 AM
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
And for some positive comments -
In the last two seasons the producers have corrected (in my mind one of the biggest flaws the race has had).
The final leg: This should be the most difficult leg to win. This should be the leg where every mistake cost you. I mean seriously for all but two seasons this has been the easiest leg to win, and thats just monumentally stupid. Sure it gave us a great finish (even if you disagree with the results) in season 2. But that same format (almost a direct copy of how it was laid out) was season 10, and look how completely anticlimatic. I hope this season continues that.
Since season 10, the show has increased the number of clue that teams have had to figure out, it still isn't close to season one but its nice to see.
I have a couple of comments. Mswood, I completely agree with you on driving stick shift and rading maps. If an individual is not proficient in both, they should not be cast.
On finales since AR10 (which I agree was just a series of tasks before and after a transatlantic flight, I think World Race Productions has been doing an excellent job: AR11 - the Old Mint match game was a bit lame, but it was totally innovative and somewhat interesting AR12 - the scale was one of the most clever endings I have ever seen AR13 - the placement of task pictures onto the correct slots on the game board was really interesting AR14 - it looks like this will be a "place surfboards with episode detail into the correct order" task; that will be fun to watch
Going back a bit, other interesting finale tasks were: AR3 - twirl the animals into the correct sequence they appeared AR8 - fill in the map of the U.S. with the shape of states
In order words, I like to see the finale decisive task testing the brainpower and memory of the teams. The more of this we get, the better.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Kogs on May 04, 2009, 07:44:38 PM
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
And for some positive comments -
In the last two seasons the producers have corrected (in my mind one of the biggest flaws the race has had).
The final leg: This should be the most difficult leg to win. This should be the leg where every mistake cost you. I mean seriously for all but two seasons this has been the easiest leg to win, and thats just monumentally stupid. Sure it gave us a great finish (even if you disagree with the results) in season 2. But that same format (almost a direct copy of how it was laid out) was season 10, and look how completely anticlimatic. I hope this season continues that.
Since season 10, the show has increased the number of clue that teams have had to figure out, it still isn't close to season one but its nice to see.
I have a couple of comments. Mswood, I completely agree with you on driving stick shift and rading maps. If an individual is not proficient in both, they should not be cast.
On finales since AR10 (which I agree was just a series of tasks before and after a transatlantic flight, I think World Race Productions has been doing an excellent job: AR11 - the Old Mint match game was a bit lame, but it was totally innovative and somewhat interesting AR12 - the scale was one of the most clever endings I have ever seen AR13 - the placement of task pictures onto the correct slots on the game board was really interesting AR14 - it looks like this will be a "place surfboards with episode detail into the correct order" task; that will be fun to watch
Going back a bit, other interesting finale tasks were: AR3 - twirl the animals into the correct sequence they appeared AR8 - fill in the map of the U.S. with the shape of states
In order words, I like to see the finale decisive task testing the brainpower and memory of the teams. The more of this we get, the better.
the maze in tar5 was pretty cool
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on May 04, 2009, 07:50:26 PM
In conclusion, AR 6 Pizza eating, AR 7 Little Havana and AR 10 running around everywhere, was just plain lame. :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Pedaler on May 04, 2009, 08:16:22 PM
Quote
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
I really miss the driving and self-navigation. They really only drove once this season in Siberia and that was just around the city. Last year, they really only drove around New Zealand. Think of all of the great driving episodes from the past. It seems like the race is stuck in a plane-taxi cab rut.
On the bright side, many viewers must like the new style since the show is now consistently outpacing Extreme Makeover in the ratings. That definately is a good sign.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on May 04, 2009, 08:37:29 PM
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
I really miss the driving and self-navigation. They really only drove once this season in Siberia and that was just around the city. Last year, they really only drove around New Zealand. Think of all of the great driving episodes from the past. It seems like the race is stuck in a plane-taxi cab rut.
On the bright side, many viewers must like the new style since the show is now consistently outpacing Extreme Makeover in the ratings. That definately is a good sign.
If there's loads of driving.. i doubt the all-female teams will do well. Look at how Kisha and Jen nearly died in Siberia.. not being a sexist here.. but it seems like all-female teams always have navigation problems. (Meredith/Maria, Debbie/Bianca, Danielle/Dani, Godlewskis.. -_-)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mister RC on May 04, 2009, 10:49:23 PM
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
And for some positive comments -
In the last two seasons the producers have corrected (in my mind one of the biggest flaws the race has had).
The final leg: This should be the most difficult leg to win. This should be the leg where every mistake cost you. I mean seriously for all but two seasons this has been the easiest leg to win, and thats just monumentally stupid. Sure it gave us a great finish (even if you disagree with the results) in season 2. But that same format (almost a direct copy of how it was laid out) was season 10, and look how completely anticlimatic. I hope this season continues that.
Since season 10, the show has increased the number of clue that teams have had to figure out, it still isn't close to season one but its nice to see.
I have a couple of comments. Mswood, I completely agree with you on driving stick shift and rading maps. If an individual is not proficient in both, they should not be cast.
On finales since AR10 (which I agree was just a series of tasks before and after a transatlantic flight, I think World Race Productions has been doing an excellent job: AR11 - the Old Mint match game was a bit lame, but it was totally innovative and somewhat interesting AR12 - the scale was one of the most clever endings I have ever seen AR13 - the placement of task pictures onto the correct slots on the game board was really interesting AR14 - it looks like this will be a "place surfboards with episode detail into the correct order" task; that will be fun to watch
Going back a bit, other interesting finale tasks were: AR3 - twirl the animals into the correct sequence they appeared AR8 - fill in the map of the U.S. with the shape of states
In order words, I like to see the finale decisive task testing the brainpower and memory of the teams. The more of this we get, the better.
the maze in tar5 was pretty cool
Yeah, I loved that maze as well. Probably one of my two favorite final tasks of all time (the one in TAR4 with the riddle they had to solve to find their seat with the clue in it @ Sun Devil was also awesome IMO)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on May 04, 2009, 11:15:28 PM
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
And for some positive comments -
In the last two seasons the producers have corrected (in my mind one of the biggest flaws the race has had).
The final leg: This should be the most difficult leg to win. This should be the leg where every mistake cost you. I mean seriously for all but two seasons this has been the easiest leg to win, and thats just monumentally stupid. Sure it gave us a great finish (even if you disagree with the results) in season 2. But that same format (almost a direct copy of how it was laid out) was season 10, and look how completely anticlimatic. I hope this season continues that.
Since season 10, the show has increased the number of clue that teams have had to figure out, it still isn't close to season one but its nice to see.
I have a couple of comments. Mswood, I completely agree with you on driving stick shift and rading maps. If an individual is not proficient in both, they should not be cast.
On finales since AR10 (which I agree was just a series of tasks before and after a transatlantic flight, I think World Race Productions has been doing an excellent job: AR11 - the Old Mint match game was a bit lame, but it was totally innovative and somewhat interesting AR12 - the scale was one of the most clever endings I have ever seen AR13 - the placement of task pictures onto the correct slots on the game board was really interesting AR14 - it looks like this will be a "place surfboards with episode detail into the correct order" task; that will be fun to watch
Going back a bit, other interesting finale tasks were: AR3 - twirl the animals into the correct sequence they appeared AR8 - fill in the map of the U.S. with the shape of states
In order words, I like to see the finale decisive task testing the brainpower and memory of the teams. The more of this we get, the better.
the maze in tar5 was pretty cool
Kogs, I just don't see it that way. That maze took a maximum of 10 minutes for Chip/KIm and Colin/Christie. A good task in the finale should be designed to take more than half an hour. In Amazing Race Asia , the best one (ARA2) was very quick only for the winning team of Collin/Adrian. For the other 2 teams, it did take over 30 minutes. The ARA3 final task at Rang Yai Beach near Phuket, digging in the sand took hours, but I don't consider to be a particularly effective decisive task.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: sharkshooter on May 05, 2009, 07:57:08 AM
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
I really miss the driving and self-navigation. They really only drove once this season in Siberia and that was just around the city. Last year, they really only drove around New Zealand. Think of all of the great driving episodes from the past. It seems like the race is stuck in a plane-taxi cab rut.
On the bright side, many viewers must like the new style since the show is now consistently outpacing Extreme Makeover in the ratings. That definately is a good sign.
I also have tired of the taxi sequences. I know taxis are cheaper than having cars available, but really, should someone win or lose based on whether they get a cabby who dosn't know where to go, or should someone win or lose based on their dirving or navigatign skills? For me, there is no question which would, at the same time, be more exciting and more fair.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Kogs on May 05, 2009, 09:14:34 AM
Navigation, Navigation, Navigation - Its a race around the world, I understand that the producers do need to keep some control over the race, but season 13 was simply unacceptable for how teams travelled. Driving should be huge (and if you can't drive a stick or read a map then you have no business being here). I also think you should not be able to pay a cab to direct you ever....Thats been a huge factor especially in season 10 and 11 (just a shocking amount of teams simply buying their way from one location to the next).
And for some positive comments -
In the last two seasons the producers have corrected (in my mind one of the biggest flaws the race has had).
The final leg: This should be the most difficult leg to win. This should be the leg where every mistake cost you. I mean seriously for all but two seasons this has been the easiest leg to win, and thats just monumentally stupid. Sure it gave us a great finish (even if you disagree with the results) in season 2. But that same format (almost a direct copy of how it was laid out) was season 10, and look how completely anticlimatic. I hope this season continues that.
Since season 10, the show has increased the number of clue that teams have had to figure out, it still isn't close to season one but its nice to see.
I have a couple of comments. Mswood, I completely agree with you on driving stick shift and rading maps. If an individual is not proficient in both, they should not be cast.
On finales since AR10 (which I agree was just a series of tasks before and after a transatlantic flight, I think World Race Productions has been doing an excellent job: AR11 - the Old Mint match game was a bit lame, but it was totally innovative and somewhat interesting AR12 - the scale was one of the most clever endings I have ever seen AR13 - the placement of task pictures onto the correct slots on the game board was really interesting AR14 - it looks like this will be a "place surfboards with episode detail into the correct order" task; that will be fun to watch
Going back a bit, other interesting finale tasks were: AR3 - twirl the animals into the correct sequence they appeared AR8 - fill in the map of the U.S. with the shape of states
In order words, I like to see the finale decisive task testing the brainpower and memory of the teams. The more of this we get, the better.
the maze in tar5 was pretty cool
Kogs, I just don't see it that way. That maze took a maximum of 10 minutes for Chip/KIm and Colin/Christie. A good task in the finale should be designed to take more than half an hour. In Amazing Race Asia , the best one (ARA2) was very quick only for the winning team of Collin/Adrian. For the other 2 teams, it did take over 30 minutes. The ARA3 final task at Rang Yai Beach near Phuket, digging in the sand took hours, but I don't consider to be a particularly effective decisive task.
yes it could have been done better but there was also another picture they had to find that was edited out. i would show it to you but the episode is on my other computer
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TARAsia Fan on May 05, 2009, 09:42:30 AM
It could be insurance issues or local merchants knowing that a US TV production company wants to use cars jacking up their prices, but the producers thinking about budget could think that having a taxi could be much cheaper.
I would prefer watching the racers self-navigate, but you have to look at the big picture. CBS is cutting back on everything.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on May 05, 2009, 10:07:51 AM
It would be nice to have decisive tasks in every leg of the race, but without luck based events, we would very rarely see an upset.
Look at season 13. The entire race was very much a race to get led by the nose to your next destination, with very little luck involved. And we saw the strongest team come out and dominate, winning all bar 3 legs.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on May 05, 2009, 04:53:04 PM
The TAR5 final task had a picture from every leg, but I guess Apskip's still right about it not being decisive - if it was it wouldn't have been edited out!
Still don't like the proportion of luck-based events. One way to mix things up is to give the racers more rope to hang themselves with (less spoon-feeding), or to have a variety of tasks that play to different strengths.
I'm not sure if Americans have a fixed mindset that it's got to be cars versus taxis, with public transportation being a novelty thing (in the race context). Apart from say a handful of major cities, everyone needs a car/taxi to get around, right? I'd dare say that public transport ridership is immensely low compared to the rest of the world, where (get this in your head, BvM) it is a very viable third option to taxis and cars.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on May 26, 2009, 05:02:37 PM
It would be nice to have decisive tasks in every leg of the race, but without luck based events, we would very rarely see an upset.
Look at season 13. The entire race was very much a race to get led by the nose to your next destination, with very little luck involved. And we saw the strongest team come out and dominate, winning all bar 3 legs.
I agree. As much as I hated the hay in Season 6 Leg 3, without luck tasks, the race would simply be too predictable. Lately, however, the producers have used taxis as a luck element that is present in every leg, so maybe they haven't felt the need for any luck tasks. I just wish that the tasks (rather than the taxis) had more bearing on the result.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: NoluckBoston on May 26, 2009, 05:22:04 PM
Does anyone else miss the Intersection? It would have been great towards the end of this season. What If Luke and Kisha had to work together.
I always loved the clues that just gave you a picture and you had to find out where it was located, or find the Local. I thinks a few clues should be hard. But not impossible like the final to Season 12. That was crazy!
For me I was always upset they brought in Big Brother/Survivor losers. We already saw these bums. Why do we need to see them again.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on May 27, 2009, 10:05:27 AM
Does anyone else miss the Intersection? It would have been great towards the end of this season. What If Luke and Kisha had to work together.
I always loved the clues that just gave you a picture and you had to find out where it was located, or find the Local. I thinks a few clues should be hard. But not impossible like the final to Season 12. That was crazy!
For me I was always upset they brought in Big Brother/Survivor losers. We already saw these bums. Why do we need to see them again.
I do miss the Intersection (it was a necessary evil for our entertainment's sake :snicker:)
And yeah I think they should make more difficult clues (maybe a couple like the 'find the monument' clues in S1). And IMO, the final task in S12 was total awesomeness, it didn't only test the memory but logic skills as well, best.final.task.ever
Agree on the celebreality recycling thing...I hated the fact that Romber got additional help due to their fame (something I hated in AS as well)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: woden on October 19, 2009, 10:16:49 AM
This season 15 is the epitome of what's gone wrong with the Race. Homogenous cast, total route control, and pre-packaged/barely cultural tasks. Haven't been this bored by a season since 12.
Here's hoping they shake things up with the Race at least one more time before the franchise dies.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on October 19, 2009, 11:54:48 PM
This season 15 is the epitome of what's gone wrong with the Race. Homogenous cast, total route control, and pre-packaged/barely cultural tasks. Haven't been this bored by a season since 12.
Here's hoping they shake things up with the Race at least one more time before the franchise dies.
I thought Seasons 13 & 14 were worse. Is that bad? :duno:
ETA: I am really not being sarcastic. I don't really see how TAR 15 is any worse than TAR 13/14.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on October 20, 2009, 12:06:59 AM
TAR14's Cheese Hill and the Bungee off the Verzasca Dam rocked! I loved Tina and Kens Fast Forward ( TAR13) in New Zealand, it was a lot better than the racecar by far. I admit the challenges are not all that this season but to me its about the contestants not really the challenges although it was sort of sucky that they used the tallest building in the world to get a clue? no rappelling no jumping? ... :wtf: ?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: michael on October 20, 2009, 12:12:52 AM
To me the only season that I felt had none of the "amazing" feeling of the Amazing Race was season 13. I just didn't like it and found it extremely boring.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on October 20, 2009, 01:06:48 AM
We all see it different, I thought season 12 was boring. I've said it before and I'll sa it again, TAR has not had the same feel since season 7 but I really liked the cast of season 9, I never understood the season 9 hate? :hearts:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on October 20, 2009, 01:29:18 AM
We all see it different, I thought season 12 was boring. I've said it before and I'll sa it again, TAR has not had the same feel since season 7 but I really liked the cast of season 9, I never understood the season 9 hate? :hearts:
This I agree with. Season 7 was when something felt amiss. Even if I hated the TAR 6 outcome, it still had that good ol' TAR feel to it. Or maybe it's cause I used to watch not knowing 'spoilers' existed and ever since, the thrill of watching was more of, "Will the spoiler come true or not?". :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on October 20, 2009, 01:32:34 AM
Maybe we should stop doing spoilers Raymond? yeah right :lol: off topic! I'm officially bored with this seasons Survivor!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on October 20, 2009, 01:45:59 AM
Season 6 was one of the worst in my eyes. The problem was, in one word: Levelers.
There was a certain leg (I can't remember it off the top of my head) Where teams flew to one country, got an hours of operation, did a task, flew to another country to pick up a single route info directing them to another country.
I understand the ratings nightmare that is a Guido finish, but three levelers in one leg, and only one task being meaningful? Give us a break.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on October 20, 2009, 02:24:09 AM
Season 6 was one of the worst in my eyes. The problem was, in one word: Levelers.
There was a certain leg (I can't remember it off the top of my head) Where teams flew to one country, got an hours of operation, did a task, flew to another country to pick up a single route info directing them to another country.
I understand the ratings nightmare that is a Guido finish, but three levelers in one leg, and only one task being meaningful? Give us a break.
Was there a leg like this in Season 6 or any other season? I don't recall.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on October 20, 2009, 07:39:31 AM
I was actually mixing 2 legs together in that post. Oops.
Anyway, legs 8 and 9 are the ones I was referring to.
Leg 8 involved taking a ferry to Nice, France and getting a clue instructing teams to travel to Addis Ababa, Ethiopia. Once in Addis Ababa, teams had to sign up for yet another flight to Lalibela, Ethiopia. From there they completed their tasks and checked in.
Leg 9 involved flying back to Addis Ababa (bunching point number one), and running with 2 runners in a 4x400 meter relay. After that, they fly to Sri Lanka (bunching point number two) and perform a Detour between climbing coconut trees and riding elephants. After the detour, they all travel to the Temple of the Tooth, where an hours of operation provides bunching point number three. The Roadblock has one team member climbing up the mountain and searching with binoculars for the Pit Stop (Two memorable moments here: Bolo doesn't read the additional information, and three teams forget to swim before checking in.)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on October 20, 2009, 08:42:12 AM
A big part of the magic that made amazing race "amazing" is the cast. And i do agree that Season 15 teams, alike Season 13 teams.. are very homogenous and boring in a way.
And i also guess that a big part to whether you like a season or not is whether your favourite team wins. I loved TAR 14 because Tammy and Victor won. If Cara and Jaime won, i would not rank it as one of the best seasons of TAR. But i don't really think whether your favourite team winning or not contributes to TAR losing its magic, because it's completely 2 different things.. so lets not keep going in that direction. And to add to my point to prove that you may not naturally like a season because your favourite team won.. for me, i love Uchenna and Joyce like hell, but hated season 7 like hell because of all the "hatable" teams aka, Romber, Ron and Kelly, Lynn and Alex, Susan and Patrick and Ray and Deana... they made the season very hard to watch with all the squabblings. And with the route heavily based in the Europe and less of Asia, it made me like it even lesser because there was so little culture and tradition involved and every leg seemed almost the same. (Europe has this tendency of making every leg seemed the same for me?? It's easier to distinguish Asian countries IMO)
For me, i go with Phil, that Seasons 1,3,5,7 and 14 were the seasons he felt that it was different from the rest, because of the teams, the locations, the tasks and the maybe even the final results. The seasons with really bad teams were IMO TAR 4, TAR 7, TAR 9, TAR 13 and TAR 15 and these homogenous teams made the race hard to watch because they were more or less alike and boring to watch. We need memorable characters like Oswald/Danny, Charla/Mirna, Flo, Colin, Jonathan/Victoria, Romber, Dustin/Kandice, Ronald/Christina, Kynt/Vyxsin and Margie and Luke to distinguish a season from the rest and make it at least a season of its own.. and i would say that cast wise.. i really love Season 1,3,5,10,12 and 14 because there were at least more than one memorable team which you'll probably remember for long.
And sometimes you really need "surprises" to add to the fun/unexpecting factor to watch TAR. Imagine how badly it would suck if Charla and Mirna was eliminated instead of Romber and even though i don't really like them, but them making the final 3 was really unexpected and fun to watch. Same with teams like Lyn and Karlyn, Margie and Luke, Oswald and Danny, Chip and Kim, Ronald and Christina and a few other teams who were not expected to make it far but did so.. and when people get to root for the underdogs, they literally will like the show and enjoy the show more, thus liking the season more? I believe..
Also, route wise and tasks are also very important. One of the reason why TAR 5 revived the whole show after TAR 4 nearly killed the show and nearly caused it to be dropped, was not only because of the teams, but because of the locations that the race went to. Egypt? Philippines? New Zealand? Who can forget about the memorable meat/caviar/ostrich egg tasks, the ox roadblock in philippines, the puzzle pieces in Egypt, the mud detour and white water rafting in the season? Those are tasks which showed alot about the place that they're visiting and also the culture/tradition of the place as well...
IMO, i think equalizers and fixed routes are generally OKAY.. because at least all the teams will be together and it will be more exciting to watch, what i rather not have is the same teams coming in first every leg and make the race very hard and boring to watch. A fine example of it would be Season 9. Of course it applies to different people and if you're a BJ/Tyler or Eric/Jeremy fan.. you'll totally adore season 9..
But i'm not going to judge season 15 too quickly yet. I don't really like the cast, but the legs seemed quite good as of now.. and i believe it will get better.. will watch the whole season before i make the final comment that this season of TAR has lost its magic.. which i still do not think it has... :duno:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on October 20, 2009, 09:06:10 AM
Not quoting Joab's post since I don't want to clutter the thread with block quotes. :funny:
I agree with the cast comment. It can affect how you think about a season. But the route/tasks can affect the cast too, since it's the tasks that determine what comes out of the Racers' personalities. And I also agree that 'I like a season' =/= 'the season is great'. It may seem like they're the same, but it isn't.
Also, Joab, Season 14 was more Euro-centric than Season 7. Actually, Seasons 3, 4, 6, 9, 10 & 12 were all more Eurocentric than Season 7. They actually spent around half the Race below the equator, and that's sadder because it didn't feel like it. It felt like the race was just filmed in the back lot. Followed by a North America-based TAR 8 & the beginning of my spoiling days with Season 9, I just answered the question to "Why do I feel like TAR has lost the 'oomph' factor?" :funny: The magic though, will never go away. ;)
ETA: Yes, I just made this post a self-reflection thread. Now if you excuse me, I'm off to watch Glee. :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on October 20, 2009, 10:18:24 AM
Quote
IMO, i think equalizers and fixed routes are generally OKAY.. because at least all the teams will be together and it will be more exciting to watch
There's nothing wrong with an equalizer here and there, hell I'll even take one at the start of every leg if it gives every team a chance to survive. As Amber said in the commentary for S7 "Every leg is a race in itself" but 3 in a single leg, and then punishing a team that makes a mistake at the end, but essentially granting teams a free pass to screw up at any point before the very final task in a leg? IMO they should just put bunching points at the Pit Stop if they want to play like that.
For example, Freddy and Kendra in Sri Lanka took the slower Detour, even knowing that playing elephant polo would take longer than doing the ropes course. They took that task because they would probably never be able to ride an elephant again. Okay, that's fair enough. But what about all the other teams that worked to gain an advantage by doing the potentially scary task? They get royally screwed because they didn't arrive at the Temple of the Tooth within a four hour window, and eventually, Lori and Bolo, who (I think, don't quote me on this) arrived at the temple first, lose out because of a simple oversight.
And that, is my really roundabout way of saying levelers that late into a leg are stupid and evil.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on October 20, 2009, 10:25:33 AM
IMO, i think equalizers and fixed routes are generally OKAY.. because at least all the teams will be together and it will be more exciting to watch
There's nothing wrong with an equalizer here and there, hell I'll even take one at the start of every leg if it gives every team a chance to survive. As Amber said in the commentary for S7 "Every leg is a race in itself" but 3 in a single leg, and then punishing a team that makes a mistake at the end, but essentially granting teams a free pass to screw up at any point before the very final task in a leg? IMO they should just put bunching points at the Pit Stop if they want to play like that.
For example, Freddy and Kendra in Sri Lanka took the slower Detour, even knowing that playing elephant polo would take longer than doing the ropes course. They took that task because they would probably never be able to ride an elephant again. Okay, that's fair enough. But what about all the other teams that worked to gain an advantage by doing the potentially scary task? They get royally screwed because they didn't arrive at the Temple of the Tooth within a four hour window, and eventually, Lori and Bolo, who (I think, don't quote me on this) arrived at the temple first, lose out because of a simple oversight.
And that, is my really roundabout way of saying levelers that late into a leg are stupid and evil.
I remembered how Adam and Rebecca were dead last and saved by an Hours of Operation, and eventually won the leg with an FF... :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: woden on October 20, 2009, 12:18:54 PM
Dubai episode was this season's problem in a nutshell:
1. Go up a tall building. Do... nothing. Find a clue to go to... a parking lot. 2. Go sledding. Inside. 3. Preview for next episode: a waterslide at an amusement park. Which makes at least two amusement parks visited this season.
Really? This is all there is left to do? For all the talk about the race on a budget, Tokyo and Dubai aren't cheap. For the money, go somewhere I haven't seen and do something I can't do. Whole thing feels so touristy this season.
I agree, Puddin - I liked season nine. Might be my favorite of the post-family edition seasons. Season 10 had that incredible route but such a weak cast/finish.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on October 20, 2009, 01:14:57 PM
The whole problem with this season that I find to be a disturbing new occurence (and a little bit of last season, too) is just how stereotypically they are portraying the countries with the tasks.
Go to Japan and do...a game show (Phil: "The Japanese are well known for their wild and outrageous game shows."). Go to Vietnam and...get muddy. And herd ducks. In a course set up just for the race. Go to Cambodia...monkey this, monkey that, that's all that you can see in Cambodia. Go to United Arab Emirates...worlds tallest building, too much emphasis on the desert, indoor ski resort (which is cool but not when combined with everything else this leg).
And it looks like Leg 6 will be about waterslides and stereotypical oil barons. Great. I didn't already know about that. *sarcasm*
In short, I expect the race to portray something I didn't know about the countries, rather than what I already knew.
And the Legs are just too centralized in one location. It seems less amazing because there are no "24 hour train rides", no self-driving that can spread teams apart and make the race seem bigger. There is no mystery to it. Everyone knows that the teams will all end up safe in the end. Nowadays there are no risks. Older seasons had much more of the unknown to them.
And yes, Seasons 9 and 10 were still great. How Season 10 turned out can't be helped; they obviously had an excellent cast if you look at all of them together. 10 had a wonderfully unexpected route, unexpected results, and did seem "larger than life". It was very well planned; it just turned out lousy in execution. And I loved the tasks and locations in Season 9. They were beautiful! :hearts:
All-Stars had a lousy route, but all the crazy and unpredictable things that happened still make it one of the better seasons, in my opinion, regardless of the winners (and the fact that we already knew the boot order). The problems came with the major condensing of Season 12. (:;)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on October 20, 2009, 04:06:14 PM
And the Legs are just too centralized in one location. It seems less amazing because there are no "24 hour train rides", no self-driving that can spread teams apart and make the race seem bigger. There is no mystery to it. Everyone knows that the teams will all end up safe in the end. Nowadays there are no risks. Older seasons had much more of the unknown to them.
I agree with this point. For example, while I was lloking for a screenshot of Peach (Season 2) I went through the episode when they went to Langa in Cape Town, as I was trying to get a good shot I kept repeating a confessional where they said "the locals told me not to go there because I would die". It was exciting to watch then. I think the biggest problem of the current TAR is that tasks are becoming fake and safe. It's not that bad when done with moderation, I loved the "Build a snowman in the desert" challenge, I found it creative, but I think the epitome of lameness was the Lithuanian Detour in Season 12: stilts or counting pickets = BORING! On the Japan leg, OK, the sushi roulette was something unexpected, but it would've been better had it not been 70% of the whole episode (the starting line task shares the fault of showing too little of Tokyo). On the cast: Enough with Malibu mactors already. But I think the casting crew got better beginning S14.
Summing up: fire the new task designers and bring back the old ones. Don't let the new casting crew fall asleep. Bring back the charity tasks. Show more of the country (extend the show if you must). And no more starting line tasks.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on October 20, 2009, 04:35:19 PM
One of the biggest letdowns to me were the tasks TAR14 Romania, fake gypsy village, drag the coffins and break the plaques filled with blood to find a clue . .Tammy and Victor looking for the detour for what seemed like 30 minutes screen time. The Roadblock/Gymnastics was cute though.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on October 20, 2009, 05:04:44 PM
OH YES. Time for me to rant.
There is a trend that I've noticed in later seasons, which is the legs staying in one city -- ESPECIALLY this season. That makes for quite a bit of lost taxi situations, which I dislike. Compare TAR 5 with a whopping 31 cities to TAR 13 with only 18. (Looking at this season, we may end up with only 10-15 cities.)
What happened to the legs in which we traveled through the country and ended up in some place in the countryside? Take for example, TAR 14 Switzerland and TAR 13 Cambodia. We visited a whole bunch of cultural landmarks, traveled away from the city and took in some of the culture not usually thought of as being related to that country.
Unfortunately, I find that there is no one perfect TAR season. Most often, the season fizzles out towards the end, since I'm always feel odd about a certain team having a lot of screen time (That's why I say 6-8 teams make for the best episodes). From what I've watched about Season 9-15:
Season 9-11: The endings were all ruined because the teams ended up at their final destination midway through the episode, thus leaving them to only do one task at the final destination.
Season 9: An excellent race route with generally competitive teams. (What's so bad about this season? Alpha males were entertaining.) I shall compare the Tokyo leg of this and that season. Although TAR 9's visit to Tokyo was marred by an overnight stop at the capsule hotel, we did see not only the bustling city of Tokyo, but also the countryside. Compare that to an odd Japanese game show and herding tourists through Shibuya, where we've already been. You could remove this episode and I wouldn't care. This year's premiere would have been much better if they started with a double-length Vietman leg.
Season 10: The style was like Season 9, except the teams were like those from TAR 14 (more on that later). Dustin and Candace are the most competent FF racers I've seen on the Race. We got the horrid intersection (lucky it was removed after All-Stars). Once again, flights from Paris to NY ruined the last half of the episode.
Season 11: Too much time in South America! Otherwise, it wasn't too bad. Some old favorites brought their magic back. Worst TAR finish ever.
After Season 12, TPTB fixed the problem of the multi-area final legs. I don't have to see so much Alaska/Hawaii again! Then, we got the LA starts, the decline in tasks, and questionable casting (which has improved lately).
Season 12: This season gets a lot of flak for its bland cast and tasks. Still, I like this season better than 13/14/15. There were a few gems, as the boring team were eliminated quickly. Goths + Asian Family + Grandad = Awesome. Nate and Jen were good villains too. We had 5 new countries to visit, which is always good. I liked this season's finale (though I disagree with the winners), since I felt they actually went places and raced.
Season 13: The general route was pretty nice. There were a few gems in there, such as the Cambodia leg. In contrast to Phnom Penh this season, it felt like we saw a lot of the country (Tonle Sap and Angkor Wat). Boat-riding was fun! However, this season had terrible teams that I could care less about. Nick and Starr were too strong, and that took away a lot of the drama. And don't get started on Dandrew... :groan:
Season 14: At first, it seemed as if the race was revitalizing. The Europe legs did go places and had relatively interesting tasks (even though they're somewhat stereotypical, at least they were slightly challenging). Then, we got hit by boring Asia legs, especially after Mike and Mel left. There were some bright teams that brought quite a bit of action (it's your opinion whether it detraced from the show). The TAR 14 finale wasn't half-bad either, though I've grown tired of Hawaii. Why not Canada?
Season 15: Oh dear. Teams are slightly above those from Season 12/13, but the tasks! Despite the "indirect clues," I have not been intrigued by any of the detours so far. I would say only the duck task was fascinating so far.
For a change, why not have the race immediately start in the first country visited (and end on the East Coast/Canada)? This gets rid of the obligatory flight drama at the beginning of the season. Less blatant bunching as well please! Signs of improvement will include the countryside and boats/buses/trains/self-driving instead of cars/planes.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on October 20, 2009, 09:03:32 PM
Season 15 has included some lackluster areas, but lets remember that the race was run under the threat of swine flu, so WRP had to be very careful about where they went and what they did because obviously they didn't want racers or production crews getting infected.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on October 20, 2009, 11:11:15 PM
There are things I like and dislike about every single season.
I do agree that three of the largest things are Cast, Locations, and tasks.
On the cast aspect, that always seems to be the factor that has the largest disagreements on what makes a great cast. I know people who love the characters that are brash, over the top, or in your face. I am not one of those fans (though on occasion characters that fit that mold I do like or even love), and there are many people that hate the easy going racers (usually the ones I like). And not only is it the specific racing teams, but also how they interact on the race. I do think the smaller number of casting sessions in different cities is probably a budget choice.
The course. This is probably my single biggest complaint since season 11. After season 1, teh producers really have tried to make sure that teams remain together, but even after that they have allowed the teams episodes to go seriously off course, in either flights or more importantly to me driving. In a race around the world being able to navigate should be one of the most important aspects of the race (and for the first 11 seasons it was often a bigger factor then selection of tasks, and performance of tasks). But with the budget cuts, the producers have to fit as much travel in, and control teh time that travel takes. The best way to do that is limit driving. Its my single greatest complaint of what I would call "Budget TAR".
Tasks: This is often a mixed bad, each season and each season has had a few weak tasks. THough hell in season 13, who knew dressing as a cow or marching in formation would make such awesome tv. But I do miss the "wow" tasks. The "extreme Sports" type of tasks (Season 7 a season I really liked didn't have any of these type tasks. Tasks that are both rushes for the racers but offer beautiful sights for the viewer (like the Zip Line in the Alps). But they still do manage some great tasks (the cheese wheels last season, the ducks this season, searching for water in the desert. Again many of these could all be budget related. Oh on the tasks I also miss the interaction with authentic locals (we don't need many just one or two a season, but they had so much character to the show and the racers). On this leg for example I loved the roadblock, thought the detour was fine (Nice contrast), the Fast Forward was lame (like stunt driving or putting out a fire, YAWN!!!), and I like using the Burj, but they should have made it a spot the clue type of route marker, instead of just take an elevator and walk over and get the clue (that was a big mistake in my opinion) and one that probably wouldn't have cost hardly any more.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on October 21, 2009, 12:55:00 AM
Well said mswood. I understand that TAR is clearly on a budget, and buying wrong plane tickets does waste quite a bit of time and money (a la Brad and Victoria from TAR 14)! And of course, the racers do damage their cars on occasion. (They need to penalize them, shame on the racers! (:;) )
However, there are some obvious ways to save money:
Taxis from Narita to Tokyo? SERIOUSLY? (Another reason why the Japan leg was useless.) Taxis drain the most money on the show after plane tickets. Removal of Fast Forwards completely (there needs to be at least 3 per race or none at all). Replace the NEL penalty from Speedbump to mandatory U-turn. (Although speedbumps look pretty cheap, half of the time they're lame.). U-turns look cheap too since the tasks are already set up, and enough of them allows for strategic racing -> interesting TV. Fewer detours (a bit drastic though, let's not go there) Force teams to take public transport where it's possible (Europe, Japan, etc.). Navigation is paramount! Make two legs in same country into one to lessen the cost of pit stops. (You could've easily done that with this season's Dubai legs!)
This brings me to another issue this season: bring back the 12-hour pitstops! In Vietnam, you left half the teams waiting at the airport for half a day. That hardly makes for great television. (And cut it out with the "will this team get on the flight" unless a team does epically screw up or the teams go on different flights; go back to TAR 14).
And from that, there is an evidence issue about the planning of the races. A spotting task a la New Zealand TAR 13 would have been great at Burj Dubai (and force Mika to confront her issue of heights :groan:). As Josh Wolk over at EW says, the Burj was too anticlimactic.
TAR should take a few pointers from HaMerotz LaMillion. (They don't need that many destinations/tasks, but at least the teams do something!)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Zack. on October 21, 2009, 08:43:01 AM
The funny thing is they try to cut costs by going down to 11 legs and have two legs in one city, then they do this near the start of TAR 14:
1. Take a taxi ride to Zurich. 2. Fly from Zurich to Munich. 3. Drive (Mercedes'!) from Munich to Ruhpolding to Salzburg. 4. Drive from Schloss Helbrunn to the train station of Salzburg. 5. Travel by train from Salzburg to Munich. 6. Fly (Lufhansa!) from Munich to Bucharest.
in spite of the fact that they could've been given the cars at Stechelberg and easily driven from Switzerland to Germany to Austria (and then flown out of Salzburg) - Google Maps has the drive as 2 hours from Stechelberg to Zurich, 3:20 from Zurich to Munich, and 1:30 from Munich to Austria. They could've also given out the cars at Zurich's train station if they were concerned about driving in the dark, or had them continue traveling by train.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on October 21, 2009, 08:46:10 AM
I notice a general trend towards laziness on the part of TPTB.
Which always start with a discussion of LAX. Nothing much more that hasn't already been said here.
But behind the scenes, we see Phil getting rest days between practically every leg (which leads to the non-12h Pit Stops) and racers being directed which city to fly through to get to their destination. Add that to the general inability to look for good, genuine tasks.
With the Japan, Dubai, Europe legs and the over-reliance on taxis, costs are apparently not of concern to TPTB as much as it is made to be. They're just lazy.
Just hire me, CBS.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on October 21, 2009, 09:15:04 AM
One of the biggest letdowns to me were the tasks TAR14 Romania, fake gypsy village, drag the coffins and break the plaques filled with blood to find a clue . .Tammy and Victor looking for the detour for what seemed like 30 minutes screen time. The Roadblock/Gymnastics was cute though.
LOL, it turned out to be one of the best episodes though (followed by Leg 4)... :lol: (Even though I love T/V so much <333)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on October 21, 2009, 09:52:29 AM
Season 6 was one of the worst in my eyes. The problem was, in one word: Levelers.
There was a certain leg (I can't remember it off the top of my head) Where teams flew to one country, got an hours of operation, did a task, flew to another country to pick up a single route info directing them to another country.
I understand the ratings nightmare that is a Guido finish, but three levelers in one leg, and only one task being meaningful? Give us a break.
I think it's not cross country but it may be Sri Lanka...
Ethiopia's baseball thingy, then off to Colombo, only to find out an hours of operation, eliminating Lori and Bolo the next day, even with Adam and Rebecca's 2 hour delay the previous day. :(
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on October 21, 2009, 09:57:18 AM
Well said mswood. I understand that TAR is clearly on a budget, and buying wrong plane tickets does waste quite a bit of time and money (a la Brad and Victoria from TAR 14)! And of course, the racers do damage their cars on occasion. (They need to penalize them, shame on the racers! (:;) )
However, there are some obvious ways to save money:
Taxis from Narita to Tokyo? SERIOUSLY? (Another reason why the Japan leg was useless.) Taxis drain the most money on the show after plane tickets. Removal of Fast Forwards completely (there needs to be at least 3 per race or none at all). Replace the NEL penalty from Speedbump to mandatory U-turn. (Although speedbumps look pretty cheap, half of the time they're lame.). U-turns look cheap too since the tasks are already set up, and enough of them allows for strategic racing -> interesting TV. Fewer detours (a bit drastic though, let's not go there) Force teams to take public transport where it's possible (Europe, Japan, etc.). Navigation is paramount! Make two legs in same country into one to lessen the cost of pit stops. (You could've easily done that with this season's Dubai legs!)
This brings me to another issue this season: bring back the 12-hour pitstops! In Vietnam, you left half the teams waiting at the airport for half a day. That hardly makes for great television. (And cut it out with the "will this team get on the flight" unless a team does epically screw up or the teams go on different flights; go back to TAR 14).
And from that, there is an evidence issue about the planning of the races. A spotting task a la New Zealand TAR 13 would have been great at Burj Dubai (and force Mika to confront her issue of heights :groan:). As Josh Wolk over at EW says, the Burj was too anticlimactic.
TAR should take a few pointers from HaMerotz LaMillion. (They don't need that many destinations/tasks, but at least the teams do something!)
Caelestor, I like most of your thinking. Specifically, I agree with these cost-cutting measures:
1.Use of public tranportation in high-cost situations (like the 77 mile trip from Narita to downtown Tokyo; it was a case of hurry up and wait using the taxis and probably would have been quicker with the train). However, when you are in HoChiMinh City or Kolkata, taxis are cheap enough that it does not make much difference.
2. Force teams to use public tranportation. Self-navigation is always the hallmark of a great Amazing Racer and seeing more of this on both public tranportation and in U-drive cars is desirable.
3. Eliminate FAST FORWARDs - I would like a return to the way it was in the first 4 seasons of the Amazing Race, but FAST FORWARDs have been lame and uninteresting, so I agree with you to get rid of them.
SPEEDBUMPs have been totally lame (particularly making pho in Cai Be). However, logistically I think your proposed solution of using a U-Turn make no sense. all the setup for a DETOUR is removed once teams have gone through them. Doing a U-Turn on the following leg, the way it is currently done, is clearly impossible and even doing it as an extra task at check-in is very problematical. You need to invent something more appropriate because U-Turn in this situation is not the answer.
Pit Stop length is determined mostly by the logistics coming out of the pit stop. Let me give you the base case against mandatory 12 hour pit stops: AR11 Episode 2 returning from Hacienda Yanahurco to Quito Airport. With less than a 18 hour pitstop teams would have had to navigate that terrible road in the dark, which would have been extremely hazardous. The Racers obviously need one or two breaks in the middle of these very physically demanding races, so the extended 36 hour pit stop is the best way to accomplish that. Demanding 12 hour pit stops from WRP is not a viable solution.
On the problems of the apparent 8 to 10 hour pit stop in HoChiMinh City, this looks like it was deliberately designed to hold teams back, as no nonstop flights were available until the next afternoon and even if a team had done the Bangkok connection they would have arrived only slightly earlier. The 12 hour pit stop would have made no difference. When a leg begins and ends in the morning, the normal release will be that evening and you have exactly the same conceptual problem of waiting aroudn for a very long time. The solution would have been a much longer leg in the HoChiMinh City area.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on October 21, 2009, 10:23:51 AM
To be frankly honest... TAR planners need to
1. Read the forums sites... Get their frickin ideas here! Isn't our voice enough? 2. take a look at the many many many fantasy games that produce better, realistic and crazier tasks and racecourses... (see: Vicdemort, Mooyou, Sam's, Uycocoa's (But it's insane) ) :funny: :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on October 21, 2009, 11:32:21 AM
One of the biggest letdowns to me were the tasks TAR14 Romania, fake gypsy village, drag the coffins and break the plaques filled with blood to find a clue . .Tammy and Victor looking for the detour for what seemed like 30 minutes screen time. The Roadblock/Gymnastics was cute though.
LOL, it turned out to be one of the best episodes though (followed by Leg 4)... :lol: (Even though I love T/V so much <333)
I'm going to have to call you out on that. There are faster ways to go from Austria to Bucharest than by plane via Munich. (Ditto for Interlaken to Munich.) Surely if they went by plane, they wouldn't have that mid-leg bunching (though I am a fan of the train, I don't want teams waiting for one). The Point: When in Europe, drive or take the extensive train system there!
apskip, glad to see I'm not making a total fool out of myself. It seems as if TPTB can never find an appropriate penalty for NELs. The only other way I could see is to make every pit stop an elimination, but extend some same-country legs into TBCs (for this season, they could've gotten rid of Japan easily and made a long leg in Vietnam/Dubai/Prague). The pit stops can be longer to accommodate Phil.)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: michael on October 21, 2009, 09:21:06 PM
HELL....ALL I KNOW IS THAT I'M LOST WITHOUT YOU... *memories*
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on October 21, 2009, 09:54:10 PM
I disagree with removing the Fast Forwards and starting in a foreign country. The race should definitely start and end in the US (it is the US edition of TAR!), just not constantly LA. And the Fast-Forwards haven't always been uninteresting. I liked the TAR 9 crickets, the TAR 11 stunt sequence, and the charity one in TAR 14 also sounds interesting; too bad we couldn't at least find out about it on the show! Plus it is always fun to wonder when it will come up. Remove that and there is less of interest to look forward too. Fast Forwards are classic and important to the weaker teams (as long as there are 3 or more of them).
But the tasks have been lame. And I thought the All-Stars tasks was bad with that Bishop or whatever his name was. :groan: And the route maps certainly don't make the race look more amazing.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on October 21, 2009, 11:54:00 PM
1. CBS needs to hire Neobie as the mapmaker. :yess: 2. They need better race design and planners. :groan: 3. It's about time, imo, for TPTB to introduce a new type of task/twist into the race (not the Switchback).
It would be nice if we are really back to 13 episodes (according to Futon Critic). Still, quality is more important than quantity.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on October 23, 2009, 07:01:52 AM
10 teams, 7 eliminations, Fast Forwards on every leg if they have to. If not, the FF has to be something "bad" or sacrificial that involves making a decision for the team taking it, or luck based. And not just first come first serve. Getting a tatoo, shaving head, shoving down gross food... beats racing an F1 car in Dubai... which is basically first come first serve.
10 teams, 10 legs, with 7 eliminations and 2 NEL if they really have to cut down on cost. Go to less expensive country like Japan, Dubai... and visit places with greater local culture. I missed those African legs already.. the last time we seen that was in Season 12. :(
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: password on October 23, 2009, 04:10:29 PM
Moo actully it wasnt sri Lanka and Lori and Bolo got eliminated for not reading their clue. This leg was pne of e best legs in the history of the race. I think the worst eg was season 15 leg 1 in Tokyo.
I agree the Race has lost its magic.Why? No more funny teams such as Ken and Girard and Steve and Dave. Same three continents being visited. Asia Europe and North Ameria. Fast Forwards only avalible on 1 leg.
I watched an episoide of the Amazing Race 4 and I miss those days.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: password on October 23, 2009, 04:15:43 PM
Season 6 was one of the worst in my eyes. The problem was, in one word: Levelers.
There was a certain leg (I can't remember it off the top of my head) Where teams flew to one country, got an hours of operation, did a task, flew to another country to pick up a single route info directing them to another country.
I understand the ratings nightmare that is a Guido finish, but three levelers in one leg, and only one task being meaningful? Give us a break.
I think it's not cross country but it may be Sri Lanka...
Ethiopia's baseball thingy, then off to Colombo, only to find out an hours of operation, eliminating Lori and Bolo the next day, even with Adam and Rebecca's 2 hour delay the previous day. :(
Moo get our facts right baseball ishardly played in Sri Lanka.
In Sri lanka they arived in Colombo travlled to galle did detour thentravlled to Kandy overight thengave rice to a monk then travleld to Dambulla were they did the road block where they had to find the pit stop through binoculars then swim across a pool and finih. One of the best legs ever!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Snooky on October 23, 2009, 05:03:16 PM
Season 6 was one of the worst in my eyes. The problem was, in one word: Levelers.
There was a certain leg (I can't remember it off the top of my head) Where teams flew to one country, got an hours of operation, did a task, flew to another country to pick up a single route info directing them to another country.
I understand the ratings nightmare that is a Guido finish, but three levelers in one leg, and only one task being meaningful? Give us a break.
I think it's not cross country but it may be Sri Lanka...
Ethiopia's baseball thingy, then off to Colombo, only to find out an hours of operation, eliminating Lori and Bolo the next day, even with Adam and Rebecca's 2 hour delay the previous day. :(
Moo get our facts right baseball ishardly played in Sri Lanka.
In Sri lanka they arived in Colombo travlled to galle did detour thentravlled to Kandy overight thengave rice to a monk then travleld to Dambulla were they did the road block where they had to find the pit stop through binoculars then swim across a pool and finih. One of the best legs ever!
He was talking about Ethiopia not Sri Lanka, they did the task and then flew to Sri Lanka...It was at a multipurpose stadium where they ran, and I can hardly understand what you wrote about Colombo... But anyway, for TAR to be more magical again, they need to let teams get hopelessly lost again.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on October 23, 2009, 10:33:05 PM
Season 6 was one of the worst in my eyes. The problem was, in one word: Levelers.
There was a certain leg (I can't remember it off the top of my head) Where teams flew to one country, got an hours of operation, did a task, flew to another country to pick up a single route info directing them to another country.
I understand the ratings nightmare that is a Guido finish, but three levelers in one leg, and only one task being meaningful? Give us a break.
I think it's not cross country but it may be Sri Lanka...
Ethiopia's baseball thingy, then off to Colombo, only to find out an hours of operation, eliminating Lori and Bolo the next day, even with Adam and Rebecca's 2 hour delay the previous day. :(
Moo get our facts right baseball ishardly played in Sri Lanka.
In Sri lanka they arived in Colombo travlled to galle did detour thentravlled to Kandy overight thengave rice to a monk then travleld to Dambulla were they did the road block where they had to find the pit stop through binoculars then swim across a pool and finih. One of the best legs ever!
He was talking about Ethiopia not Sri Lanka, they did the task and then flew to Sri Lanka...It was at a multipurpose stadium where they ran, and I can hardly understand what you wrote about Colombo... But anyway, for TAR to be more magical again, they need to let teams get hopelessly lost again.
YES. Hopelessly lost, but not hopelessly stranded.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on October 24, 2009, 12:47:31 AM
In Sri lanka they arived in Colombo travlled to galle did detour thentravlled to Kandy overight thengave rice to a monk then travleld to Dambulla were they did the road block where they had to find the pit stop through binoculars then swim across a pool and finih. One of the best legs ever!
One of the WORST, DESPICABLE, WORTHLESS legs ever in that season of giving an hours of operation in a clue slot before the Pit Stop. The other tasks became SENSELESS.
We can't tell about JAPAN because TPTB CUT OUT THE LEG INTO HALF AND THE OTHER HALF NOT BEING SHOWN TO US. It was unappealing but at least there wasn't an hours of operation that blew away everyone's lead.
P.S. Read the posts before you reply and verify things first.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on October 27, 2009, 08:50:56 PM
Another factor to add to our discussion - noticeable set-ups which I HAVE noticed in the past but have remained silent on. Pinstrip brought up a good point in another thread:
What is it about this season that feels so wrong? Why are the challenges so lame and easy? I'm starting to believe that the producers of the show are slanting the show to benefit one team over the others and that team would be Maria and Tiffany, the poker players. We have an all female team and none of the challenges have been physically challenging so far, something that's been know to do in the women in past seasons. What city did the producers choose as the final destination, Las Vegas, the one city Maria and Tiffany will know like the back of their hand.
Last year felt much the same way with so much time spent in China which benefited the eventual winners.
I'm almost willing to bet this years race will not end in a foot race just to help push Maria and Tiffany across the finish line without the traditional last challenge.
This season certainly does seem to be geared toward physically weaker teams rather than strong ones. Look what happened to the strong teams in the last two seasons. I'm going to even propose that these set-ups may have been going on much earlier than now. Let's see:
Season 9: This is the first season that looks like a potential (not very strong) set-up to me. Japan as the penultimate destination gave BJ & Tyler a huge advantage, assuming they could make it that far. I can't find evidence of any other favoritism in this season, though (thank goodness).
Season 10: The finale seemed to be an obvious attempt in favor of Tyler & James. And I just barely got a new idea: with all the physically challenging tasks that season, could it be possible that the intended winners were in fact Tyler & James?
Season 11: Honestly, this one shouldn't be here. The tasks were varied and didn't seem to favor any one team more than the others. Good thing, too, as it is the All-Stars race.
Season 12: To me the "favored" team this season was Ronald & Christina, for much the same reason as Season 9. But again, other than that, no further evidence to me.
Season 13: I can't see evidence in favor of any one team here, either. Feel free to argue if you have any.
Season 14: I would have to say that this seasons team was (rather obviously) Tammy & Victor, with all the China this, China that, once again in the penultimate (and likely most critical) legs of the race. I can't think of more evidence at the moment, but I remember thinking that there was more than just this.
Season 15: Pinstripe summed it up. There is only one female team, which to me seems rather odd. Likely because they don't want the "wrong" female team to win, so if a female team were to win, it would be the poker girls. There have been a lot of tasks and challenges that seem designed specifically for them. By far the most obvious promotion of any season.
Feel free to add to my list, 'cause I can't remember a lot right now.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Zack. on October 28, 2009, 08:48:43 AM
The only issue with that is that there's no guarantee of those favored teams making it far enough to benefit from the route. Tammy/Victor could've been eliminated in Romania, leaving a final four of teams with varying degrees of communication issues in Beijing. BJ/Tyler could've been eliminated in Greece (not to mention, even thought they made it to Tokyo all three teams were bunched on the final flight to Denver). Ron/Chris could've been eliminated in Amsterdam. Tiffany/Maria could've been eliminated in Phnom Penh (or Tokyo could've resulted in their elimination). The prevalence of (or lack of) physical tasks might be a better indicator of who they don't want to win; TAR 14 comes to mind immediately re: a female team victory.
Not to mention, teams don't always do well in legs placed in areas they've resided (Schroders, Tara/Wil, Frank/Margarita).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: River on October 28, 2009, 04:35:40 PM
With me, The Amazing Race still hasn't lost its magic, the only thing I'm really not that happy about, is that they need more self driving... :colors
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on October 29, 2009, 06:58:20 PM
TAR should take a note from Rick Steves and go off the beaten path and interact with the locals in cultural villages.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on October 29, 2009, 10:57:54 PM
If they want to cut the fat out of The Amazing Race budget, maybe they should just look at the locations of the people on the forums. I'm sure lots of people here would gladly put up WRP and the contestants for free.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: DeafRacer on November 02, 2009, 10:18:05 PM
With me, The Amazing Race still hasn't lost its magic, the only thing I'm really not that happy about, is that they need more self driving... :colors
I agree. I was disappointed that there weren't a lot of self-driving on my season. Bring it back!!! I like how teams weren't checking in so close to each other when we all did self-driving on my season. My mom and I totally rocked at self-driving! The elimination order probably would have been a little different if there were more self-driving...
Only one season that required teams to self-driving on every leg was Season 10 right?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on November 02, 2009, 10:30:12 PM
With me, The Amazing Race still hasn't lost its magic, the only thing I'm really not that happy about, is that they need more self driving... :colors
I agree. I was disappointed that there weren't a lot of self-driving on my season. Bring it back!!! I like how teams weren't checking in so close to each other when we all did self-driving on my season. My mom and I totally rocked at self-driving! The elimination order probably would have been a little different if there were more self-driving...
Only one season that required teams to self-driving on every leg was Season 10 right?
That was the season where there were loads of self-driving tasks and probably the reason why the Lyns made it that far into the race as well, Luke!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 02, 2009, 10:46:39 PM
Actually, I thought it was Season 9.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 02, 2009, 11:53:40 PM
Actually, I thought the stretch of seasons from 8 to 11 had ample self-driving. 8 & 9 had one on every leg I believe (counting those legs where the only self-drive was to the airport), Season 10 had self-drive in Legs 2, 6, 7, 9 & 10, Season 11 had self-drive in Legs 1-3 & 11-13.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TARAsia Fan on November 03, 2009, 12:04:47 AM
With me, The Amazing Race still hasn't lost its magic, the only thing I'm really not that happy about, is that they need more self driving... :colors
I agree. I was disappointed that there weren't a lot of self-driving on my season. Bring it back!!! I like how teams weren't checking in so close to each other when we all did self-driving on my season. My mom and I totally rocked at self-driving! The elimination order probably would have been a little different if there were more self-driving...
Only one season that required teams to self-driving on every leg was Season 10 right?
Hi Luke!
Yeah, I would love to see more self-driving instead of having to depend on the taxi. Although tuks tuks are the exception to the rule! I love the tuk tuk!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: redwings8831 on November 03, 2009, 12:06:58 AM
I'm going way back to Season 2, but the New Zealand leg (Leg 11) contained the most I've ever seen. According to maps.google, it was about 450 km from the pitstop (Canterbury Plains, South Island) to the Picton Ferry, the car Ferry to Wellington, and then another 450 km to the Maori Arts & Crafts Institute in Rotoura (North Island). About 6 to 6 and a half hours sandwiched around a three hour ferry, all which occurred within one clue.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 03, 2009, 12:13:20 AM
I'm going way back to Season 2, but the New Zealand leg (Leg 11) contained the most I've ever seen. According to maps.google, it was about 450 km from the pitstop (Canterbury Plains, South Island) to the Picton Ferry, the car Ferry to Wellington, and then another 450 km to the Maori Arts & Crafts Institute in Rotoura (North Island). About 6 to 6 and a half hours sandwiched around a three hour ferry, all which occurred within one clue.
I think the second longest drive occurred in Season 4 (though likely I'm wrong :P), when they drove from Paris to Marseilles. :P
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 03, 2009, 12:15:13 AM
I'm going way back to Season 2, but the New Zealand leg (Leg 11) contained the most I've ever seen. According to maps.google, it was about 450 km from the pitstop (Canterbury Plains, South Island) to the Picton Ferry, the car Ferry to Wellington, and then another 450 km to the Maori Arts & Crafts Institute in Rotoura (North Island). About 6 to 6 and a half hours sandwiched around a three hour ferry, all which occurred within one clue.
I think the second longest drive occurred in Season 4 (though likely I'm wrong :P), when they drove from Paris to Marseilles. :P
The drive in Season 7 where Debbie and Bianca got lost was a fair stretch as well from what I remember.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: DrRox on November 03, 2009, 01:37:52 AM
Season 3...........Dieselgate...........Portugal to Spain......
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 03, 2009, 02:28:35 AM
I went on Google Maps and it came up with this info: (might be an unreliable source, but ohwells)
Season 2 drive (from Canterbury Plains to Rotorua): around 930 km Season 3 drive (from Cabo da Roca to Algeciras): around 680 km Season 4 drive (from Le Mans to Marseilles): around 900 km Season 7 drive (from Santiago to Mendoza): around 370 km (meaning the drive to Puente Viejo might be shorter)
Of course, chances are I might have missed other underestimated long drives.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on November 03, 2009, 11:18:01 AM
I'm going way back to Season 2, but the New Zealand leg (Leg 11) contained the most I've ever seen. According to maps.google, it was about 450 km from the pitstop (Canterbury Plains, South Island) to the Picton Ferry, the car Ferry to Wellington, and then another 450 km to the Maori Arts & Crafts Institute in Rotoura (North Island). About 6 to 6 and a half hours sandwiched around a three hour ferry, all which occurred within one clue.
I think the second longest drive occurred in Season 4 (though likely I'm wrong :P), when they drove from Paris to Marseilles. :P
You are close, Raymond. It was LeMans to Marseilles. Leg 4 of Season 4 started with a flight that I assume was Vienna to Paris or Prague to Paris (for the purposes of this calculatino it does not matter which one). Then teams had to drive 114 miles mostly west to the LeMans racetrack to do the laps there. After that they started from LeMans and drove mostly south to Marseilles, which is 410 miles. So it depends on how you look at it whether it was 410 miles or 524 miles.
The infamous Dieselgate drive through Portugal and Spain in Season 3 from Cabo de Roca to Algeciras leg was 300 miles.
For the New Zealand trip in Season 2, there are assumptions that have to be made. The distance from the sheep farm at Inverary Station, Mt. Somers on the Canterbury Plain to Rangiora is an add-on of about 60 miles to the distance from Christchurch. The distance from Christchurch to the ferry at Picton is 209 miles, then what shoudl be done about the length of the ferry crossing. Since it is not driving, I ignored it. I actually drove from Mt. Cook to Picton taking many of the same roads once far enough north on the South Island. From Wellington to Rotorua, a trip I made on a bus, the disance is another 270 miles. that gives a total of 539 miles, a little shorter than you have estimated but close enough.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on November 03, 2009, 03:49:20 PM
Raymond, I've got another one that could be in the running depending on the criteria for inclusion. It is the limo ride (not self-drive) that Dennis and Andrew took from Duxford Imperial War Museum near Cambridge England to Stonehaven Scotland. It is about 500 miles.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on November 03, 2009, 09:48:28 PM
D'oh, how far was that drive from Phoenix to Billings? :lol:
(I see everyone has washed TAR 8 out of their heads...)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: DrRox on November 03, 2009, 09:59:30 PM
Mapquest says 1204 miles.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: DeafRacer on November 03, 2009, 10:31:49 PM
With me, The Amazing Race still hasn't lost its magic, the only thing I'm really not that happy about, is that they need more self driving... :colors
I agree. I was disappointed that there weren't a lot of self-driving on my season. Bring it back!!! I like how teams weren't checking in so close to each other when we all did self-driving on my season. My mom and I totally rocked at self-driving! The elimination order probably would have been a little different if there were more self-driving...
Only one season that required teams to self-driving on every leg was Season 10 right?
Hi Luke!
Yeah, I would love to see more self-driving instead of having to depend on the taxi. Although tuks tuks are the exception to the rule! I love the tuk tuk!
My mom and I went on a tuk-tuk in India!! It was AWESOME!!! My mom and I had to ditch our cab when we got to the Shaker detour since there was no parking nearby. Soon as we were done with dance task, we met an Indian guy that could speak English, he led us to tuk tuk and told our driver that we need to go to the pit stop. Our driver do not speak a bit of English at all! We were grateful for that Indian guy to help us out!!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: redwings8831 on November 04, 2009, 12:09:17 AM
Yes, but that was spread over three legs. All of the other one's are within one leg.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 04, 2009, 12:44:36 AM
I think the last 10-something post have now been about self-driving. Maybe we can move this to a new thread? You know, for formality/off-topicness sakes? :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 04, 2009, 01:45:18 AM
Then let's get back on track!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlHqhu9Fn-g
Wow. Amazing intro and voiceover by Phil. TAR needs to return to this style.
I think I've realized a major issue with recent seasons: editing. Recent seasons look very frantic, partially since every season has a reduced amount of episodes. We need more tranquility! Take some time back and revel in the awesomeness of the world. (I sound like Emerson)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 04, 2009, 01:59:43 AM
^^I miss the slow pace too. I'm watching Seasons 2 & 4 right now & I am feeling nostalgic remembering the old clue style, the team interaction & the leisurely pace. The pace during the more recent seasons feels like everyone is only just out to beat each other.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on November 04, 2009, 07:38:35 AM
D'oh, how far was that drive from Phoenix to Billings? :lol:
(I see everyone has washed TAR 8 out of their heads...)
Neobie,
Who cares, as it was not one continuous segment. It was broken down into these segments:
Phoenix to Glen Canyon/Lake Powell Lake Powell to Monument Valley Monument Valley to Moab UT Moab UT to Park City UT Park City to Salt Lake City UT Park City to Bonneville Salt Flats UT Bonneville Salt Flats to Yellowstone N.P., Old Faithful Geyser Yellowstone N.P. to Dubois WY Dubois WY to Cody WY Cody WY to Red Lodge Mountain MT Red Lodge Mountain to Green Meadow Ranch MT
So, the longest segment on this trip is Bonneville Salt Flats to Old Faithful Geyser. The part from Bonneville back to Salt Lake City is about 100 miles depending on precisely where it was. From Salt Lake City to Yellowstone southern entrance is 369 miles. From the southern entrance to Old Faithful is about 30 miles. Add it all up and you get 499 miles. That's certainly enough to put it on this list, but not enough to win the prize.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on November 04, 2009, 09:07:39 AM
I thought we've been having some good tasks this year that were both somewhat culturally-relevant and difficult (gold-counting, hookah-building), though I feel that all tasks should be that way. They managed to do it in the early seasons, why not now?
We're still pandering to the ADD audience that demands that debased excitement and wackiness we see now: let's make them cross-dress and strip to their underwear! let's put them on a Japanese game show! let's rehash the haybales just because! let's put them on a theme park ride for no good reason!
It's becoming more of a wacky game show and less of an adventure...
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on November 04, 2009, 09:52:22 AM
I do care that we've forgotten about TAR 8 and mostly left that season out of most TAR talk. Was Family Edition that bad?
Besides NOT flying out of North America, the teams were good, tasks were interesting and overall, the season was enjoyable, wasn't it?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 04, 2009, 10:22:44 AM
I never watched TAR 8, but from what I've heard:
We want exoticness! 40 people starting a competition also gets out of hand.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 04, 2009, 10:59:27 AM
I thought we've been having some good tasks this year that were both somewhat culturally-relevant and difficult (gold-counting, hookah-building), though I feel that all tasks should be that way. They managed to do it in the early seasons, why not now?
We're still pandering to the ADD audience that demands that debased excitement and wackiness we see now: let's make them cross-dress and strip to their underwear! let's put them on a Japanese game show! let's rehash the haybales just because! let's put them on a theme park ride for no good reason!
It's becoming more of a wacky game show and less of an adventure...
I thought doing the haybales again was a good idea...
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on November 04, 2009, 11:02:11 AM
I think the haybales challenge was memorable because Lena and Kristy got stuck for so long. They made the Roadblock famous.. besides rather than the Roadblock itself being challenging. Imagine if all the racers went into the field and found a clue within ripping 2 haybales apart.. nobody would have bothered to give this challenge a second thought.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 04, 2009, 11:04:15 AM
I would love it if the haybales was the "bonus task" this leg. If there was another roadblock on this leg, then I wouldn't say that the race planners got lazier.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Squall on November 08, 2009, 07:33:52 PM
The one thing i really missed is when the race would travel through countries. Just think back to Season 2 when the teams traveled from the South Island of New Zealand all the way up to the north Island. Or when the teams raced a bit through Namibia. Now it's pretty much "Fly to this city; pretty much stay in this city; leave for next city" That's the on thing i truly miss about the amazing race.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on November 08, 2009, 08:25:56 PM
^^I miss the slow pace too. I'm watching Seasons 2 & 4 right now & I am feeling nostalgic remembering the old clue style, the team interaction & the leisurely pace. The pace during the more recent seasons feels like everyone is only just out to beat each other.
I think that could be fixed if they went back to the old 4-NEL politics, then the editors wouldn't have to rush all the "character development" and we could enjoy the scenery
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: supergoten on November 09, 2009, 08:46:13 AM
The one thing i really missed is when the race would travel through countries. Just think back to Season 2 when the teams traveled from the South Island of New Zealand all the way up to the north Island. Or when the teams raced a bit through Namibia. Now it's pretty much "Fly to this city; pretty much stay in this city; leave for next city" That's the on thing i truly miss about the amazing race.
To be fair, there's still an awfully lot of driving around, just look at what happened to Gary/Matt last night, they got their fair share of driving around the Swedish countryside. :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 09, 2009, 11:17:36 AM
The tasks are getting a bit lackluster. However, I liked how Sweden presented train, ferry, car (plus one very awesome-looking taxi driver!), and running. The only thing lacking were the bicycles from the Netherlands.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on November 09, 2009, 11:06:07 PM
I missed public transportation options, good to see it return for at least a while this one leg!
And see? You get bunching/debunching opportunities that aren't contrived and could create some drama. Do this more, CBS!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 11, 2009, 07:55:52 AM
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on November 11, 2009, 09:47:48 AM
Raymond:
You have made an excellent case, but the reality verges on teh height of the ridiculous. You need to extend your ditty to include both Vietnam and Cambodia. The flights Tokyo to HoChiMinh City and HoChiMinh City to Phnom Penh were totally bunched jsut as the ones you have covered.
There is another bunch coming for sure, the Silja line ferry from Stockholm to Tallinn. The only leg of this race not covered by total bunching was the initial flight from Los Angeles to Tokyo. It idd not matter since they almost certainly bunched at the faux-pit-stop overnight and again at the beginning of the Wasabi Sushi game.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 11, 2009, 09:58:02 AM
You have made an excellent case, but the reality verges on teh height of the ridiculous. You need to extend your ditty to include both Vietnam and Cambodia. The flights Tokyo to HoChiMinh City and HoChiMinh City to Phnom Penh were totally bunched jsut as the ones you have covered.
There is another bunch coming for sure, the Silja line ferry from Stockholm to Tallinn. The only leg of this race not covered by total bunching was the initial flight from Los Angeles to Tokyo. It idd not matter since they almost certainly bunched at the faux-pit-stop overnight and again at the beginning of the Wasabi Sushi game.
Also Dubai II
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 11, 2009, 10:32:35 AM
^ However, Dubai I had a FF, which guaranteed the 1st place team from last leg to come in first again this leg. Not a very good design.
I still believe that the Dubai legs could've been easily merged into one super-leg (then again, the Dubai Ministry of Tourism clearly was actively involved in production).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 11, 2009, 10:45:57 AM
The Dubai leg was completely linear. Had there been another team right behind Meghan and Cheyne, they may have moved a bit faster and held first.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 11, 2009, 11:05:11 AM
True. Meghan and Cheyne did waste a lot of time at the hookahs. I think it may be better to completely eliminate the FF from the race.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on November 11, 2009, 06:29:15 PM
Yes the Fast Forward needs to go. It really only served a true purpose in seasons 1-4. After that it truly became next to meaningless.
In all honest I can't think of a single leg after season 4, where the Fast Forward had a direct impact in a team remaining in the race.
In fact the only real lasting impact ( since the end of season 4) was Terrance & Sarah losing after being the 2nd team to go for a Fast Forward.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: 2old4tech on November 11, 2009, 07:07:40 PM
Yes the Fast Forward needs to go. It really only served a true purpose in seasons 1-4. After that it truly became next to meaningless.
In all honest I can't think of a single leg after season 4, where the Fast Forward had a direct impact in a team remaining in the race.
In fact the only real lasting impact ( since the end of season 4) was Terrance & Sarah losing after being the 2nd team to go for a Fast Forward.
David and Mary. marked for elimination-fast forward-1st place
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on November 11, 2009, 07:57:58 PM
But look at that leg, do you honestly think they would have been eliminated. Peter & Sarah were literally hours later then the next team ad the still hadn't found the detour let along got to the Pit Stop.
Peter 7 Sarah had worst leg in race history for driving such a small distance. No team has even come close to how much time they lost in such a close area to the city.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on November 11, 2009, 08:11:05 PM
I don't think it is a valid approach to look at how another team screwed up to determine if one team benefitted from a FAST FORWARD. David and Mary are one of 3 teams (note that feedback on Uchenna/Joyce AR11, ep. 5 and Eric/Danielle AR11. ep. 10) in Amazing Race history to not be eliminated after being MARKED FOR ELIMINATION. That happened primarily because they were hours ahead due to the FAST FORWARD, which allowed them to avoid the 30 minute penalty which in close episodes sends teams to their doom. We will never know if David and Mary would have screwed up in navigation around Kuwait City because they did not get the opportunity to do the crucial DETOUR, but we know for sure they finished first that AR10 leg. Note that their navigation in AR11 was faulty enough to put them in jeopardy by turning right toward San Pedro de Atacama at the unmarked fork in the second episode and to totally screw up in the third episode, so the potential to have underperformed navigating around Kuwait City was real.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on November 11, 2009, 08:23:44 PM
Very True apskip, but there is a very large difference. In season 10 they relied heavily upon two teams Erwin & Godwin and Lynn & Karlynn now if David & Mary hadn't taken the Fast Forward Dustin & Kandice or Erwin & Godwin were keen on going for it.
If they hadn't done it they most likely would have stayed grouped with which ever "Six Pack" team would have let them.
And even taking the last team, that still would have let them complete said tasks and take the 30 minute penalty and still beat two teams at the mat. And since the last team was over 4 hours later before getting (according to interviews) directed (they had never found it using locals or on their own) to the Detour to get the clue to head to the Pit Stop. I think it is very safe to say that it is unlikely that David & Mary would have lost that much time (in fact since they never did find the location of the detour, without production help, Peter & Sarah could have been out there hours upon hours longer).
While it is true that it is mathematically possible that Peter & Sarah would have eventually found in and completed the detour and found the Pit Stop and that David & Mary would have been later, it isn't likely.
Again in 15 cycles no team has ever been as lost (or lost as much time) as Peter & Sarah when being so close to the city they were supposed to be in (at least 8 full hours). It hasn't happened. Hell they lost more time then any team that have been lost when driving across multiple countries. In fact while many teams have gone further off course (Debbie & Bianca, Meredith & Maria and Lake & Michelle as poster children for this), None lost as much time.
And only one other team (and this was over some distance) that I recall ever got directed by production to their destination (first season's Paul & Amie in the desert), though I don't know how much time they in fact had lost.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on November 11, 2009, 08:28:23 PM
Oh and I don't know if you meant it the way you worded it (because as you certainly know, I do that all the time), but this statement, "David and Mary are the only team in Amazing Race history that I know of to not be eliminated after being MARKED FOR ELIMINATION" isn't true.
The very next season Eric & Danielle were marked for Elimination, suffered the a Yield and the 30 minute penalty and weren't eliminated.
In fact, after removing the time of the penalty and the estimated (20 to 30 minute) yield, they did all the tasks of that day faster then any team (Dustin & Kandice made a very good choice on who to try and Yield both times).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on November 11, 2009, 08:30:39 PM
Oh and on the general topic. I actually liked that penalty for the non elimination the best out of every one the show has had.
I hated both forms of mugging, I disliked that early seasons it was just a start as normal, and I like it better then a speed bump. It was far, and equal.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 11, 2009, 09:46:10 PM
I think also Uchenna and Joyce survived a marking in All-Stars.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on November 11, 2009, 10:02:46 PM
Oh and on the general topic. I actually liked that penalty for the non elimination the best out of every one the show has had.
I hated both forms of mugging, I disliked that early seasons it was just a start as normal, and I like it better then a speed bump. It was far, and equal.
I prefer TBC without airport bunchings (or any for mid-leg). If the teams are too bunched, this could pose a problem for the team marked for elimination.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on November 12, 2009, 06:01:02 PM
Caelestor,
I do not understand what you might by "If the teams are too bunched, this could pose a problem for the team marked for elimination." You apparently are saying that if the teams all leave the bunched condition at close to the same time, then a Marked for Elimination team will be at a disadvntage. According to my logic, that is precisely when a Marked for Elimination team has the best chance of getting ahead of at least one team by 30 minutes. When teams are less bunched then fewer teams start just more than 30 minutes than the Marked for Elimination team. There is clearly LESS opportunity for that team to when teams are less bunched.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 13, 2009, 05:33:27 PM
Sorry apskip, by bunching I meant tasks like luck roadblocks. Now that I look at it again, the MFE penalty is actually quite fair, since it makes teams strive for first instead of aiming for the middle. Plus, it saves the cost of setting up an extraneous task.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Neobie on November 16, 2009, 12:54:31 PM
Draw your own conclusions.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: redwings8831 on November 16, 2009, 02:52:09 PM
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 16, 2009, 07:12:47 PM
Wow, that's a lot of flights. I think TPTB has chosen the "direct flight" approach (almost every single flight this season has been non-stop). The only flight that doesn't scream bunching was Amsterdam to Stockholm.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on November 17, 2009, 12:31:28 AM
TPTB should be ashamed :ascared but I'm done complaining about TAR because I never want it to end and don't want to jinx it :hearts:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 17, 2009, 12:50:25 AM
Off-topic, but why is there a black cloud over Europe? :colors
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 17, 2009, 01:03:54 AM
I think its just the bordering of the names and lines. Europe was just so connection heavy it comes out as a black cloud.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 17, 2009, 01:37:37 AM
TPTB had a lot of money to spend back then.
Based on the flights, I think TAR 2 should have had one leg in Europe (for a six-continent race!). The leg in Maui should've become part of the finale, with Alaska gone.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 17, 2009, 06:25:50 AM
Have they had a race that doesn't cross into the Southern Hemisphere before? (Besides FE of course.)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on November 17, 2009, 07:12:48 AM
Have they had a race that doesn't cross into the Southern Hemisphere before? (Besides FE of course.)
Not too significant trends here, but it seems to be happening more frequently...
TAR 3 (Southernmost point: Singapore 1°N) TAR 6 (Southernmost point: Galle 6°N) TAR 12 (Southernmost point: Ouagadougou 12°N) TAR 14 (Southernmost point: Phuket 7°N) TAR 15 (Southernmost point: Ho Chi Minh City 10°N)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Zack. on November 17, 2009, 09:24:17 AM
What's odd is that, even with the reduced budget, TAR12 managed to be a very good season in terms of quality and ratings. Plus there was enough geographic diversity (we managed to get *5* new countries plus 2 new cities in 11 legs).
Not to mention there was still a good bit of airport maneuvering that could be done (Ouagadougou to Vilnius/Vilnius to Dubrovnik).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 17, 2009, 09:48:49 AM
Have they had a race that doesn't cross into the Southern Hemisphere before? (Besides FE of course.)
Not too significant trends here, but it seems to be happening more frequently...
TAR 3 (Southernmost point: Singapore 1°N) TAR 6 (Southernmost point: Galle 6°N) TAR 12 (Southernmost point: Ouagadougou 12°N) TAR 14 (Southernmost point: Phuket 7°N) TAR 15 (Southernmost point: Ho Chi Minh City 10°N)
More southern hemisphere countries please. :P
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on November 17, 2009, 09:59:15 AM
I actually like the African legs alot more because the self driving in those country is always a killer. :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TARAsia Fan on November 17, 2009, 02:55:22 PM
Going to Central America is kind of tough. Lots of political upheaval, but going to Brazil, Argentina, Peru or Chile would be nice.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 17, 2009, 02:58:44 PM
Instead of Brazil, let's have Belize. Instead of China, let's try Indonesia/Singapore/Phillipines/South Korea. Instead of India, let's go to any country in Africa.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on November 17, 2009, 11:26:32 PM
Instead of Brazil, let's have Belize. Instead of China, let's try Indonesia/Singapore/Phillipines/South Korea. Instead of India, let's go to any country in Africa.
True enough. Though most of them are of high risk countries because of profiling thus TAR might have a harder time to guard the teams, especially that security crews are even included in a team, aside from the sound and camera man.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 18, 2009, 04:56:08 AM
Instead of Brazil, let's have Belize. Instead of China, let's try Indonesia/Singapore/Phillipines/South Korea. Instead of India, let's go to any country in Africa.
True enough. Though most of them are of high risk countries because of profiling thus TAR might have a harder time to guard the teams, especially that security crews are even included in a team, aside from the sound and camera man.
If they had "If you go there, they will kill you" in Season 2 and near-jail instances in Morocco & Tanzania during Seasons 3 & 5, they can do risky legs again. :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: maxjla on November 20, 2009, 01:51:38 PM
I don't know, i love the show, don't focus on the tasks as much as people and where they are in the world but that is me.
I think this season has a strong final four, and nobody that shouldn't have gotten that far.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on November 20, 2009, 05:56:34 PM
:hithere: maxjla! Welcome to RFF!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on November 20, 2009, 06:20:04 PM
Instead of Brazil, let's have Belize. Instead of China, let's try Indonesia/Singapore/Phillipines/South Korea. Instead of India, let's go to any country in Africa.
True enough. Though most of them are of high risk countries because of profiling thus TAR might have a harder time to guard the teams, especially that security crews are even included in a team, aside from the sound and camera man.
If they had "If you go there, they will kill you" in Season 2 and near-jail instances in Morocco & Tanzania during Seasons 3 & 5, they can do risky legs again. :funny:
Switchback? :funny: They must find a way to try and get into jail like Colin? :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on November 20, 2009, 07:32:47 PM
Instead of Brazil, let's have Belize. Instead of China, let's try Indonesia/Singapore/Phillipines/South Korea. Instead of India, let's go to any country in Africa.
True enough. Though most of them are of high risk countries because of profiling thus TAR might have a harder time to guard the teams, especially that security crews are even included in a team, aside from the sound and camera man.
If they had "If you go there, they will kill you" in Season 2 and near-jail instances in Morocco & Tanzania during Seasons 3 & 5, they can do risky legs again. :funny:
Switchback? :funny: They must find a way to try and get into jail like Colin? :funny:
Maybe they should go back and repair Colin's Ox :lol3:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 20, 2009, 11:18:33 PM
I also miss the old great dollars to dinars moments (Dave & Margarette losing :'( Linda & Karen mishearing 'dinars' for dollars' :funny:)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 22, 2009, 07:40:42 AM
Rewatching the early season finales. Loved Phil's "Previously On..." segments. :funny: MUCH more than the ones recently.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 22, 2009, 12:17:01 PM
Rewatching the early season finales. Loved Phil's "Previously On..." segments. :funny: MUCH more than the ones recently.
Why did they change the epic music? Even in TAR 13, I looked forward to listening the awesome score. Now, not so much...
Yep. It certainly doesn't feel right.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Moo on November 22, 2009, 11:48:01 PM
I believe this week's episode brought back old TAR. Gotta hand it to the producers!
And a point of opinion, we have seen in previous seasons the taxi racing, or too much dependence on taxis, could it be that it was the team's decision to take taxis all the way instead of riding buses or the metro from recent seasons (12, 13, 14, some 15)? I thought of that once I saw Brian and Ericka and the Globetrotters take buses and metro to risk their placements... - which completely made a GREAT SHOW.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on November 23, 2009, 03:13:14 AM
Rewatching the early season finales. Loved Phil's "Previously On..." segments. :funny: MUCH more than the ones recently.
Why did they change the epic music? Even in TAR 13, I looked forward to listening the awesome score. Now, not so much...
Yep. It certainly doesn't feel right.
This. I miss the old music now. :'(
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: WalterC on November 30, 2009, 03:40:36 PM
Speaking of taking public transportation and cutting costs, I think teams should do that, from the starting line to LAX. Either that, or start in some place near LAX, saving money from using cars.
I just don't find it interesting to see teams drive to LAX and book tickets there, and think the race really begins when they arrive at their first destination.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on November 30, 2009, 04:54:01 PM
Speaking of taking public transportation and cutting costs, I think teams should do that, from the starting line to LAX. Either that, or start in some place near LAX, saving money from using cars.
I just don't find it interesting to see teams drive to LAX and book tickets there, and think the race really begins when they arrive at their first destination.
well, for once, they can't risk the exposure of the race beginning, so public transportation is out of the question. And I think the drive to LAX is the time when teams finally realize it's on. I wouldn't mind seing the race begin in the first country, but it would probably lose the effect of a real start and a real finish. It works for other editions because teams are from different countries, but I thinkbeginning and ending in the U.S. is a vital part of the original edition.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on November 30, 2009, 06:48:00 PM
Another problem: Casting. The growing number of "celebrities" or those on the "fringe" of celebrity status.
Probably been mentioned before, but I needed a place to complain. :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on November 30, 2009, 06:54:05 PM
well, for once, they can't risk the exposure of the race beginning, so public transportation is out of the question. And I think the drive to LAX is the time when teams finally realize it's on. I wouldn't mind seing the race begin in the first country, but it would probably lose the effect of a real start and a real finish. It works for other editions because teams are from different countries, but I thinkbeginning and ending in the U.S. is a vital part of the original edition.
I don't mind beginning and ending in the US. I just thought they could save money by not using cars.
The thought came up after watching the first part of Season 14, after the intro, they skipped through the LAX part and went straight to show teams arriving at their first destination in Switzerland.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on November 30, 2009, 08:08:51 PM
well, for once, they can't risk the exposure of the race beginning, so public transportation is out of the question. And I think the drive to LAX is the time when teams finally realize it's on. I wouldn't mind seing the race begin in the first country, but it would probably lose the effect of a real start and a real finish. It works for other editions because teams are from different countries, but I thinkbeginning and ending in the U.S. is a vital part of the original edition.
I don't mind beginning and ending in the US. I just thought they could save money by not using cars.
The thought came up after watching the first part of Season 14, after the intro, they skipped through the LAX part and went straight to show teams arriving at their first destination in Switzerland.
I do think they really f***ed it up with the start line elimination challenge taking up most of the episodes. I think they should really avoid doing that (taking air time away from a foreign country).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on December 01, 2009, 07:11:51 AM
Another problem: Casting. The growing number of "celebrities" or those on the "fringe" of celebrity status.
Probably been mentioned before, but I needed a place to complain. :lol:
The stunt-casting is growing, but remember, celebrity teams help bring the ratings. (And of course, good leg structure and interesting tasks.)
As long as the celebrities bring it (skills/entertainment), but the editors don't shove them down our throats, I don't care. :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TARAsia Fan on December 01, 2009, 09:40:56 AM
If they do just two Mactor teams a season, I wouldn't mind. Just don't make it like Asia where every team is a Mactor team.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Glamazon Racer on December 23, 2009, 01:48:56 AM
I've read a lot of this, and I must say for me personally, one of the biggest disappointments is the recycling of countries that have already been visited more times than the fingers on my hand, *cough* India *cough* China *cough*. Those countries might be great and produce some great legs, but there are 300+ countries in the world and I don't enjoy seeing the same ones over and over. It really is like watching a horror movie over and over and over... :cmas12
I also personally don't like many recent winners, but that might just be me. :cmas28 :cmas5
What I want to see above all else is something like TAR3 (a route with NO countries previously visited, more self-driving and a great cast with great challenges). :yess:
I also think TAR15 brought back the drama that was lacking somewhat in previous seasons. Mika & Canaan and Maria & Tiffany quitting and Zev & Justin losing passports were incredible drama. I really hate it when one team is so far behind that it is so obvious who is going to be eliminated in each leg (aka 6/8 TAR14 eliminations, with the exceptions of the first and last elims).
However, the one thing I love above the more recent races are the memory challenges, which are SO great! Too bad TAR15 didn't have one. :groan:
Anyway, I'm done ranting :cmaslol what do you guys think? :cmas5
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: RichInSydney on December 23, 2009, 06:29:08 PM
1. Cut the teams down to 10 maximum so we get to know the teams a bit better during the race.
2. No more non-elimination legs when it gets down to 5 teams left. Final 5 teams must be told that in the remaining legs, one team WILL be eliminated.
3. No fast forwards.
4. Visit more remote Islands in the middle of the ocean and less mainland countries.
5. No Taxis allowed in the final leg. No following Taxis when they have to drive themselves.
5. During the editing of each episode, don't give away the result by clues in the post leg interview! (eg. its nightime in the background!)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Kiwi Jay on December 23, 2009, 06:41:35 PM
I don't agree with 1,2 and 3 but do like 4 and agree with 5
Don't you find though that the first couple of episodes are too rushed and you have no idea which team is which due to the 11 or 12 teams competing? I personally would like to see only 8 teams in it from the start but I know thats not going to happen due to the number of legs in each season.
The Fast Forwards are only good if its a hard task or at least 2 teams are going for it.
Non eliminations are too predictable. If teams know they will be eliminated in the final few legs, it would make it more of a race.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on December 23, 2009, 07:24:33 PM
I don't agree with 1,2 and 3 but do like 4 and agree with 5
Don't you find though that the first couple of episodes are too rushed and you have no idea which team is which due to the 11 or 12 teams competing? I personally would like to see only 8 teams in it from the start but I know thats not going to happen due to the number of legs in each season.
The Fast Forwards are only good if its a hard task or at least 2 teams are going for it.
Non eliminations are too predictable. If teams know they will be eliminated in the final few legs, it would make it more of a race.
I agree with your first point of reducing the number of teams. If we lost enough airtime in Japan due to the Elimination Challenge, maybe reducing the teams would give enough time both to introduce the teams and have a decent first leg. I would disagree with your NELs point. They are only predictable when we get the confessionals. Besides teams never know when it's going to be a NEL and IMO teams are always racing like there's an elimination ahead, I think there has never been a case in which a team decided to relax knowing that they'd be NEL'd.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: RichInSydney on December 23, 2009, 07:33:14 PM
I would disagree with your NELs point. They are only predictable when we get the confessionals. Besides teams never know when it's going to be a NEL and IMO teams are always racing like there's an elimination ahead, I think there has never been a case in which a team decided to relax knowing that they'd be NEL'd.
Yeh good point. What I should have said is that its more predictable for the viewer. 4 teams left, 3 episodes to go, you do the maths.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 23, 2009, 08:51:34 PM
^This feels like we're reiterating points we've already made. Just to throw in my two cents:
1. I don't care how many teams start the race, as long as each get an appropriate amount of screentime (in other words, no early eliminations). I do agree that often the first legs feel rushed since we don't know anybody. Conversely, the later legs feel empty because there are only a few teams left.
To fix that, make the first leg a straight-up 2 hour premier. Have the first half set in one region, then have teams sign up on charter buses to another reasonably near location for the second half. Only one team goes home at the end of the second hour.
2. There needs to be some episodes where no one is eliminated; otherwise, we'd have a really short season. I personally believe that NELs just incite debate because no one can agree on what the appropriate penalty should be. Speedbumps are getting lamer each season. I advocate TBCs for legs in the same country or city. As an example, this is how TAR 15 could have gone:
Leg 1 (scrap the entire useless 1st episode and have teams go directly to Cai Be): 12th team eliminated. Leg 2: 11th team eliminated. Leg 3: 10th team eliminated. Leg 4: Dubai TBC, 9th team eliminated. Leg 5 (Somewhere in Africa): 8th team eliminated. Leg 6 (Back to Netherlands): 7th eliminated. Leg 7: 6th team eliminatd. Leg 8: 5th team eliminated. Leg 9: Prague TBC, 4th team eliminated Leg 10: Finale.
3. Agree with it. Either one per leg (up to a certain point), or none at all.
4. Can't argue with that. Of course, make the islands big enough so that there are enough places to visit. It should also not be too hard to get there.
5. The only way to fix this is to give teams their own car (which the producers should; it reduces spoilers). Unfortunately, teams can't run on foot or take public transport, as the producers are trying to limit the amount of spoilers that escape out.
6. True on that. Have the confessions indoors!
And my other major point: teams must depart 12 hours after they arrive. Viewers do notice these details.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on December 23, 2009, 09:11:22 PM
Speedbumps are getting lamer each season. I advocate TBCs for legs in the same country or city.
I have to disagree with that. I don't understand why people would want the Speedbump to be something über complex. Come on, the team is most probably already last. IMO having them waste 20 minutes in an easy, yet difficult-to-find task is enough of a penalty. The point is not to make the teams complete another challenge, but to put more pressure on them by forcing them to waste race time. In essence it's the same thing as the begging, usually teams were over it pretty fast.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on December 23, 2009, 10:10:21 PM
RichInSydney,
I think your proposal on no taxis in the final leg is a bit lacking in appreciation for the difficulty of self-navigating when coming off a transoceanic flight (usually either the Pacific or Atlantic and usually at least 13 hours) to reach the Final City. It is a safety hazard for teams to drive themselves in those conditions. Why would World Race Productions want to put the teams at risk unnecessarily? The fact that taxi rides more often than not decide the final results is unfortunate but probably not avoidable unless WRP uses hired drivers in marked cars.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Zack. on December 24, 2009, 12:45:18 AM
I think your proposal on no taxis in the final leg is a big lacking in appreciation for the difficulty of self-navigating when coming off a transoceanic flight (usually either the Pacific or Atlantic and usually at least 13 hours) to reaach the Final City. It is a safety hazard for teams to drive themselves in those conditions. Why would World Race Productions want to put the teams at risk unnecessarily. The fact that taxi rides more often than not decide the final results is unfortunate but probably not avoidable unless WRP uses hired drivers in marked cars.
Not to mention if you let teams drive themselves when they're close to the money, they might do (illegal) things that taxis wouldn't have the nerve to do.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Glamazon Racer on December 24, 2009, 04:36:01 AM
I have to say that reducing the number of teams is not the way to go, in my opinion. Rather - a 2-hour premiere for the first leg alone is much better. That made the premieres of TAR6-9 some of the best. :xmas146
I also have to add that Fast Forwards should NOT be removed, because of the strategy that is involved in deciding to use them or not. I personally enjoy seeing that. :yess:
And I think the positioning of NELs should be shuffled around a bit more every season, rather than having similar positioning, but they should have one towards the end.The only team I ever recall racing slowly because they knew it was a non-elimination was Flo & Zach in Vietnam. One of the best legs ever, in my opinion.
Above all, what TAR needs to do is go to new places that haven't been done before! :flirt:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: 2old4tech on December 24, 2009, 07:49:07 AM
Quote
Not to mention if you let teams drive themselves when they're close to the money, they might do (illegal) things that taxis wouldn't have the nerve to do.
Unless they hire "Earl". Earl had nerve. :cmaslol
Gee, I hope I remembered his name right. TAR5 finale.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on December 24, 2009, 09:05:57 AM
Not to mention if you let teams drive themselves when they're close to the money, they might do (illegal) things that taxis wouldn't have the nerve to do.
Unless they hire "Earl". Earl had nerve. :cmaslol
Gee, I hope I remembered his name right. TAR5 finale.
Yes, Earl provided an extra element of excitement in the AR5 finale driving Colin and Christie from BFW to the Fort Worth Stockyards. However, driving on the shoulder resulted in a flat which cost them 10 minutes, more than the final margin of victory for Chip/Kim. We'll never know if Earl's driving actually cost Colin/Christie the win.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 24, 2009, 12:09:36 PM
Speedbumps are getting lamer each season. I advocate TBCs for legs in the same country or city.
I have to disagree with that. I don't understand why people would want the Speedbump to be something über complex. Come on, the team is most probably already last. IMO having them waste 20 minutes in an easy, yet difficult-to-find task is enough of a penalty. The point is not to make the teams complete another challenge, but to put more pressure on them by forcing them to waste race time. In essence it's the same thing as the begging, usually teams were over it pretty fast.
To be honest, I was voicing my opinion and not really looking at it objectively. In a cost standpoint, it might be more effective to just have a 15-minute yield.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: ImANewUser on December 24, 2009, 10:33:11 PM
Speedbumps are getting lamer each season. I advocate TBCs for legs in the same country or city.
I have to disagree with that. I don't understand why people would want the Speedbump to be something über complex. Come on, the team is most probably already last. IMO having them waste 20 minutes in an easy, yet difficult-to-find task is enough of a penalty. The point is not to make the teams complete another challenge, but to put more pressure on them by forcing them to waste race time. In essence it's the same thing as the begging, usually teams were over it pretty fast.
To be honest, I was voicing my opinion and not really looking at it objectively. In a cost standpoint, it might be more effective to just have a 15-minute yield.
Or turn all these Speed Bumps into Fast Forwards, remove the NEL penalty & then turn it back to the way it used to be. :funny:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 24, 2009, 11:41:33 PM
One FF per leg as in earlier seasons. I didn't like how some teams managed to escape elimination without penalty, though. :groan: *cough Flo*
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on December 25, 2009, 10:00:22 AM
Caelestor,
Which earlier season are you referring to? Certainly not Amazing Race 3, which had 6 FAST FORWARDs! Here are the number of FAST FORWARDs per season (source - "Circumnavigating the Globe", the new book on the Amazing Races after AR9):
1 - 5 2 - 6 3 - 6 4 - 7 5 - 2 6 - 2 7 - 2 8 - 1 (the earliest season you could be referring to) 9 - 2 10 - 3 (including unaired at Grand Baie, Mauritius) 11 - 2 12 - 1 13 - 2 14 - 1 (unaired at Phuket Zoo) 15 - 1
The trend is obvious after Amazing Race 4, but there was only one Fast Forward for AR8 and for AR12 through 15.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 25, 2009, 01:57:48 PM
I meant in the earlier seasons, where in most of the legs (Except usually one of the middle legs and the later ones, of course), you could find an FF, aka S1-4. This provided an element of strategy: when to use the FF to avoid elimination.
Now with one FF per race, the FF is pretty much just a reward challenge. Whoever gets there first can win the prize for that leg.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mister RC on December 25, 2009, 02:39:33 PM
Apskip, there were 2 Fast Forwards in TAR13. Those include the Sky Tower one that Ken/Tina won in Auckland, and then the Korduk-eating FF that Nick/Starr earned later on during the final run as part of them winning 6 out of the final 7 legs for the win.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Glamazon Racer on December 25, 2009, 05:46:54 PM
A Fast Forward per leg would be awesome, but I think it would be too costly setting up all those extra challenges, and they are on a 'budget'... :cmas11
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 25, 2009, 06:54:20 PM
apskip's list also does not include unaired FFs.
Nowadays, the first-place teams see the FF and go for it, since they won't get another chance. Teams behind them will think they can't go for it because someone earlier would have gone for it. Hardly good strategy.
The race can function fine without the FF. As we saw in TAR 15, however, it gave M+C not only a win in the first of the Dubai legs, but a big enough lead to arrive in first place again the next leg, despite M+T's better performance.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on December 25, 2009, 09:39:53 PM
Apskip, there were 2 Fast Forwards in TAR13. Those include the Sky Tower one that Ken/Tina won in Auckland, and then the Korduk-eating FF that Nick/Starr earned later on during the final run as part of them winning 6 out of the final 7 legs for the win.
revengefullycreative, The book lists both of those for AR13; you are right. I just can't do 1 + 1 = 2 and get the right answer every time. Thanks, as I have corrected my earlier post for the AR13 line.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: theschnauzers on December 25, 2009, 10:18:39 PM
In TAR 1 to TAR 4, a Fast Forward was available for every leg, except the final leg, with the proviso that if all remaining teams had used a fast forward at the beginning of a leg before the second to final leg, then the FF was no longer available as of that point for the remainder of the Race.
On average, the FF was used about one-half of the time in thpse early seasons. The even odder thing is that since that time, the FF has continued to be used about one-half of the time. (I have the numbers filed away somewhere but I'm not in the rush to get precise at the moment.)
The primary reason why the FF is only offered once or twice a Race now is financial. The cost for some unused FF was significant, and that's one reason why their frequency was reduced. The problem is that it also changed the strategic value of th FF, and for several seasons after the change, the lead teams would always take the FF. At this point, it's rare for any team other than a lead team to take a FF, and it has ended up offering little strategic value. If it were to completely disappear, I don't think its absence would have an impact any more.
The penalties for the NELs and the U-Turns are more problematic for me. I'd rather be rid of the NEL penalties altogether, and I don't like the element of the U-Turn that smacks of the Yield, and I totally hated the Yield and was happy to see its demise.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 25, 2009, 10:41:49 PM
I don't like NEL penalties, but I can't stand the bunching after an NEL that can save some last-place teams which deserved to be eliminated earlier. The TBC, if used properly, can fix that.
The U-turn, if it was available more often, would provide an extra element of strategy.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on December 26, 2009, 01:01:49 AM
I don't like NEL penalties, but I can't stand the bunching after an NEL that can save some last-place teams which deserved to be eliminated earlier. The TBC, if used properly, can fix that.
The U-turn, if it was available more often, would provide an extra element of strategy.
I'd think that to make the U-Turn more user-friendly, they should include the number tags the Yield had. At least then, the teams would have more things to base their decision on.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Glamazon Racer on December 26, 2009, 05:27:19 PM
I don't like NEL penalties, but I can't stand the bunching after an NEL that can save some last-place teams which deserved to be eliminated earlier. The TBC, if used properly, can fix that.
The U-turn, if it was available more often, would provide an extra element of strategy.
I'd think that to make the U-Turn more user-friendly, they should include the number tags the Yield had. At least then, the teams would have more things to base their decision on.
I totally agree with that. At least if Kynt & Vyxsin knew they were fourth, they might've been able to realise that Nathan & Jennifer were behind them. I do love the Blind U-Turn though - I can't wait to see a team actually survive that and then be in surprise.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on December 26, 2009, 09:29:42 PM
I don't like NEL penalties, but I can't stand the bunching after an NEL that can save some last-place teams which deserved to be eliminated earlier. The TBC, if used properly, can fix that.
The U-turn, if it was available more often, would provide an extra element of strategy.
I'd think that to make the U-Turn more user-friendly, they should include the number tags the Yield had. At least then, the teams would have more things to base their decision on.
I totally agree with that. At least if Kynt & Vyxsin knew they were fourth, they might've been able to realise that Nathan & Jennifer were behind them. I do love the Blind U-Turn though - I can't wait to see a team actually survive that and then be in surprise.
The reason K & V decided not to U-Turn Nate and Jen is because N & J left the Detour end point well before them, so it only stood to reason that the pair would be in front of K & V.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Aualagi on December 27, 2009, 01:45:58 AM
Hi! First post here.
When I do my own fantasy Amazing Race seasons, I've suffered, often, a incredible lack of creativity planning fast forwards and stuff. So, to do the strategic role the FF used to do, I've inserted a twist called "Free Pass": Before a detour, once in a game, you may choose skip the task and go to the next clue. That's not so advantageous as a FF, but you don't need to accomplish any task either. It may be developed, though.
And I think since a leg had already a task to be done, there will never be a bunching point: It make that task senseless.
But after all, just the "Amazing Race - travel around the world, trivial people, and do stuff that you never was able to do" always shiver me a lot.
(sorry this brazilian messy english :))
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: puddin on December 27, 2009, 02:00:54 AM
Welcome to the forum Aualagi :hithere:, you sound just fine to me.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: RichInSydney on December 28, 2009, 05:06:06 PM
So, to do the strategic role the FF used to do, I've inserted a twist called "Free Pass": Before a detour, once in a game, you may choose skip the task and go to the next clue.
I think this is a great idea! All teams at the start of the race get 1 "Free Pass" that they can use any time during the whole of the race. So for example, they can get stuck on a detour task so they decide to use the free pass to skip the task and go to the next clue. It can only be used once so its best to keep it as long as you can (excluding the last leg of course).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: smiley on December 28, 2009, 05:59:28 PM
So, to do the strategic role the FF used to do, I've inserted a twist called "Free Pass": Before a detour, once in a game, you may choose skip the task and go to the next clue.
I think this is a great idea! All teams at the start of the race get 1 "Free Pass" that they can use any time during the whole of the race. So for example, they can get stuck on a detour task so they decide to use the free pass to skip the task and go to the next clue. It can only be used once so its best to keep it as long as you can (excluding the last leg of course).
so would you be able to skip the roadblock..?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: RichInSydney on December 28, 2009, 07:57:20 PM
Either roadblock or detour not sure? What do you think? Maybe a detour because its a task for both team members.
I think it will make good TV as the team arriving at the detour last, can skip it and overtake teams that are already there. Could make for some close finishes.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 28, 2009, 08:09:44 PM
^Now that's a good twist that can't cost production money.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: smiley on December 28, 2009, 11:03:03 PM
Either roadblock or detour not sure? What do you think? Maybe a detour because its a task for both team members.
I think it will make good TV as the team arriving at the detour last, can skip it and overtake teams that are already there. Could make for some close finishes.
OMG! "Person 1 & Person 2, currently in last place" They use the Free Pass "Person 1 & Person 2, currently in 1st place"
^Now that's a good twist that can't cost production money.
True.
Oh, and they could change the name possibly. Cuz all the clues are 'street ish' names. E.g. Roadblock, detour, yield, u-turn, pitstop. They could change it too Side Road...highway....Express Way or even car pool lane haha.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: RichInSydney on December 29, 2009, 12:20:16 AM
OMG! "Person 1 & Person 2, currently in last place" They use the Free Pass "Person 1 & Person 2, currently in 1st place"
AHA! All in a matter of seconds LOL!
Ummm not quite... if they were the last 2 teams that means all the others could have finished that task already and already heading towards the next pitstop so how could they get to 1st place?
Also, if there were a bunch of teams on the same task, 1 teams uses the free pass so the rest may get the urge to use theirs as well. I honestly think this is a good idea.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: realshowfan on December 29, 2009, 01:47:28 AM
^Now that's a good twist that can't cost production money.
True.
Oh, and they could change the name possibly. Cuz all the clues are 'street ish' names. E.g. Roadblock, detour, yield, u-turn, pitstop. They could change it too Side Road...highway....Express Way or even car pool lane haha.
All except Fast Forward that is (Switchback is in fact, a 'street ish' name). And I think Highway sounds like the best name for it. Should there be limitations to how many teams use it at once, though?
And they should have 'Toll', where a team forces a team to give up some of their money, the twist I used. :cmaslol
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: chill_sd on December 29, 2009, 10:26:55 AM
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Coutzy on December 29, 2009, 10:40:39 AM
Call it the EZ-Pass! Then they could work in a sponsorship deal, easing some budget concerns, and it would be a glorious shout out to the decisive factor in Tyler and James' season 10 win!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mister RC on December 29, 2009, 02:12:44 PM
^Now that's a good twist that can't cost production money.
True.
Oh, and they could change the name possibly. Cuz all the clues are 'street ish' names. E.g. Roadblock, detour, yield, u-turn, pitstop. They could change it too Side Road...highway....Express Way or even car pool lane haha.
All except Fast Forward that is (Switchback is in fact, a 'street ish' name). And I think Highway sounds like the best name for it. Should there be limitations to how many teams use it at once, though?
And they should have 'Toll', where a team forces a team to give up some of their money, the twist I used. :cmaslol
Actually, with the mention of the Toll and the EZ-Pass, I think it would make sense for the teams to give up all of their money in order to skip a task. That way, it would be rather difficult for multiple teams to go for it simultaneously. Plus, they have to factor in whether the task they are skipping is the last one before the pitstop. FWIW, they might think their RB or Detour is the final one (having done the other earlier), but all of a sudden, they run into a random task that everyone has to do. It may be challenging.
I think a FasTrak kinda item would be nice. I could see them adding this. However, soon after in the following season or subsequent seasons, they'd make a rule stating which legs teams can or cannot use them. Hopefully not, since they could make that rule in a leg with a very difficult task. It should be reserved for a leg in which one couldn't get their money back in a certain country that prohibits begging. Finally, they would make a rule stating that it's valid thru the final 5 (while there are at least 5 teams remaining in the race). While there have been FFs (used) in the penultimate episode/leg three times from TARs 2-9, I doubt TPTB would have someone earn a free pass to the final dash to the Finish Line. Especially if the three eventual finalists all end up using theirs (even if they saved theirs until the last minute)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on December 29, 2009, 02:26:11 PM
Bypass or Fastrak sounds nice. Giving up all your money sounds harsh though, especially if a team bypasses a task and then realizes they have to take a taxi to the pit stop.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: smiley on December 29, 2009, 04:54:40 PM
OMG! "Person 1 & Person 2, currently in last place" They use the Free Pass "Person 1 & Person 2, currently in 1st place"
AHA! All in a matter of seconds LOL!
Ummm not quite... if they were the last 2 teams that means all the others could have finished that task already and already heading towards the next pitstop so how could they get to 1st place?
Not true. What if all the teams are pretty close together...and the team that uses it are last or whatnot and use it and they skip ahead.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: RichInSydney on December 29, 2009, 05:03:17 PM
Not true. What if all the teams are pretty close together...and the team that uses it are last or whatnot and use it and they skip ahead.
Well then the other teams will see that they are going to skip so they will have to decide whether to use their free skip or not. If they do, then it will be a close race to the finish line or to the next task.
They only get 1 free pass remember in the whole race so it brings a lot more strategy into it.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: theschnauzers on December 29, 2009, 05:08:23 PM
The amounts of money the teams seem to be getting nowadays doesn't seem to be enough as it is, as teams appear to be begging for cash, and I hate, hate, hate, teams having to beg. I didn't like stripping teams of their cash as an NEL penalty, so I don't like it for any other aspect of the Race.
Another name could be "Bypass."
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mister RC on December 29, 2009, 05:22:49 PM
Fair enough. But there has to be something else that the racers could do to earn Fastrak, bypass, etc. I personally do not believe that these things should come to them for doing nothing. IMO, they shouldn't automatically get it at or near the start, they need to earn it.
They could do a small questionnaire. Could be a multiple choice on the events that has happened during the AR series so far, or during their race (as future teams would catch on). Whoever gets it right (the fastest) get the pass to be used whenever. Or if all the teams get it all right, then all the teams can claim that pass (with one team using it per leg).
Or, if that doesn't work, it could be like Survivors Hidden Immunity Idol, where teams would have to search around the area to find it, which would bring in "real" clues more often during the course of the race. BTW, I also think that it shouldn't be made available until the third leg or until they lose two teams, whichever comes second. With 10+ teams, if you can't beat at least one of them, then you don't deserve to continue racing. Yeah, bad luck happens and someone has to go first, but OTOH, the bypass or whatever won't guarantee a win, the F3, or a high finish outside the F3 (5th or 4th).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: slayton on April 20, 2010, 06:20:51 PM
What makes a season magical, special, or memorable, to me, are once-in-a-lifetime spectacles where real-life or real-emotion takes over and reality-tv or the race becomes almost an afterthought.
Locations, tasks, and race routes only meant something to me in TAR1. After the first season, I never cared much about where they went as long as I saw a spectacle somewhere along the way.
Even though I might not be a huge fan of certain seasons, like TAR2/TAR4/TAR6, I give them credit for at least being memorable to me because they all had an event or moment that I consider to be unique.
I appreciate TAR1-TAR7 and TAR14 for having these special moments, and that's how I remember seasons.
TAR1: Everything was unique.
TAR2: Oswald & Danny go shopping.
TAR3: Diesel-gate, and Andre & Damon getting what I consider to be the scariest and worst taxi ride in the history of the race.
TAR4: Female racers getting molested on Indian trains.
TAR5: Colin and the police.
TAR6: Jonathan & Victoria's blow-up.
TAR7: Brian & Greg flipping and crashing their vehicle, and Meredith & Gretchen getting bloodied and battered.
TAR14: Margie collapsing at the Pit-Stop, Margie & Luke and Kisha & Jen's physical and verbal explosion, and Kisha & Jen taking a bathroom break.
I thank TAR13 for having Toni & Dallas lose their passports and for them to not be able to recover their passports in time to avoid elimination, but it's no longer unique because the same thing happened to Zev & Justin in TAR15.
The problem that I have with TAR8 to TAR12, TAR15, and TAR16 through 9 episodes, is that I haven't seen anything new that I consider to be on the same level as the events from TAR1 to TAR7 and TAR14. To me, the TAR8 to TAR12, TAR15, and TAR16 casts were/are just going through the motions and mailing it in.
I'm not expecting, and I don't want, another Brian & Greg-level crash every season.
I want to see fresh and exciting moments, which is what I love about TAR: US and TAR: Asia and what I think makes the show special and magical. If nothing happens in a season, then it's partly the fault of the casting directors, but the rest of the blame is entirely on the cast.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on April 20, 2010, 08:21:05 PM
I personally watch for the locations, because it's a foregone conclusion that one or more of the teams will be annoying on the TV. (Who specifically is your opinion.) The shifting of the emphasis from the locations and route to the teams and tasks is arguably what's strangling the show imo, although the quality has transitioned into better ratings (what does this say about society :groan:). Viewers are very picky when it comes to their favorites, but they genuinely agree that the locations chosen (well mostly in early seasons) are beautiful.
However, on the flipside, the cast did partially redeem the second half of TAR 14, which probably had the most unoriginal planning out of all the editions. I like competitive teams that respect each other and don't argue amongst themselves.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mr. Seattle on April 23, 2010, 01:08:07 PM
Bypass or Fastrak sounds nice. Giving up all your money sounds harsh though, especially if a team bypasses a task and then realizes they have to take a taxi to the pit stop.
I totally agree with this. Begging is awful and mean (IMHO), but I think that if TPTB gave each team an Express Lane (my favorite name for it) at the beginning of the race and told them to use it whenever or exchange it. That could make for some interesting drama. Say, a team lost/used theirs, but their ally was willing to give them theirs in exchange for some money.
I think that the other good idea for how to use the Express Lane would be to hide it in the general vicinity of the cluebox, but give them a few clues. Then, if someone took it, teams could waste time looking in the correct spot, but still believe that it is there.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: DeafRacer on April 23, 2010, 03:30:39 PM
What makes a season magical, special, or memorable, to me, are once-in-a-lifetime spectacles where real-life or real-emotion takes over and reality-tv or the race becomes almost an afterthought.
Locations, tasks, and race routes only meant something to me in TAR1. After the first season, I never cared much about where they went as long as I saw a spectacle somewhere along the way.
Even though I might not be a huge fan of certain seasons, like TAR2/TAR4/TAR6, I give them credit for at least being memorable to me because they all had an event or moment that I consider to be unique.
I appreciate TAR1-TAR7 and TAR14 for having these special moments, and that's how I remember seasons.
TAR1: Everything was unique.
TAR2: Oswald & Danny go shopping.
TAR3: Diesel-gate, and Andre & Damon getting what I consider to be the scariest and worst taxi ride in the history of the race.
TAR4: Female racers getting molested on Indian trains.
TAR5: Colin and the police.
TAR6: Jonathan & Victoria's blow-up.
TAR7: Brian & Greg flipping and crashing their vehicle, and Meredith & Gretchen getting bloodied and battered.
TAR14: Margie collapsing at the Pit-Stop, Margie & Luke and Kisha & Jen's physical and verbal explosion, and Kisha & Jen taking a bathroom break.
I thank TAR13 for having Toni & Dallas lose their passports and for them to not be able to recover their passports in time to avoid elimination, but it's no longer unique because the same thing happened to Zev & Justin in TAR15.
The problem that I have with TAR8 to TAR12, TAR15, and TAR16 through 9 episodes, is that I haven't seen anything new that I consider to be on the same level as the events from TAR1 to TAR7 and TAR14. To me, the TAR8 to TAR12, TAR15, and TAR16 casts were/are just going through the motions and mailing it in.
I'm not expecting, and I don't want, another Brian & Greg-level crash every season.
I want to see fresh and exciting moments, which is what I love about TAR: US and TAR: Asia and what I think makes the show special and magical. If nothing happens in a season, then it's partly the fault of the casting directors, but the rest of the blame is entirely on the cast.
Now, can I give you a big hug for thinking TAR 14 as one of special seasons!!! I still wish that Mom and I won the footrace against Kisha & Jen. That would have been so priceless.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: slayton on April 23, 2010, 08:17:11 PM
Luke, when you get the chance, please ask Phil what his criteria is for his favorite seasons.
In his EW blog for the TAR14 finale (http://popwatch.ew.com/2009/05/11/phil-keoghan-1/), Phil listed your season, 14, along with 1, 3, 5, and 7 as some of his "personal favorites." I would like to know because those five are also my favorites.
There's no way that Phil wouldn't answer you or Margie. In that blog, he also said, "Luke and Margie were definitely one of my favorite Teams we’ve ever had on the show."
Thanks.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: targamer on April 23, 2010, 09:33:31 PM
We had former racers here!! Cool!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on July 08, 2010, 08:25:16 PM
Enough with casting all the showbiz fringies, the people that TPTB wish all of us ordinary people would constantly act and look like. Enough with recruiting. I want a real race, not some watered down show intended to launch someone's star career. THIS is why TAR has lost it's magic.
In all seriousness, my motivation to watch this next season (TAR 17) is next to zero. The route really doesn't seem unique enough (or good enough to meet expectations), the casting is terrible (as usual), and the prospects are bleak. I truly don't care if a female team ever wins if it means sacrificing what truly makes this show great: Exotic and unique locations, interesting and relevant tasks, and a cast of ELEVEN, TWO-PERSON TEAMS OF ORDINARY PEOPLE. Yes, Lynne Spillman, it's time to actually start casting the way Phil and BvM say you are. Thanks for once again not delivering.(:;)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on July 08, 2010, 09:04:06 PM
The moment I saw TAR 14's new intro sequence and route map, I knew something was up. TAR 13, though not as action-packed as I would have liked it to be, still had that classic feel and some innovation. The last two seasons have confirmed to me that TAR is just aiming for ratings (and unfortunately that means dumbing down the show and bringing in familiar faces). Personally, I blame CBS and the fact that shows simply age.
At least I've got Latin America! :yess:
P.S. You should never judge a season until the intro though. Personally, I thought 14 was gonna suck until I saw the premier (of course, the second episode then came...)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Hooky on July 09, 2010, 07:19:09 PM
The moment I saw TAR 14's new intro sequence and route map, I knew something was up. TAR 13, though not as action-packed as I would have liked it to be, still had that classic feel and some innovation. The last two seasons have confirmed to me that TAR is just aiming for ratings (and unfortunately that means dumbing down the show and bringing in familiar faces). Personally, I blame CBS and the fact that shows simply age.
At least I've got Latin America! :yess:
P.S. You should never judge a season until the intro though. Personally, I thought 14 was gonna suck until I saw the premier (of course, the second episode then came...)
Yes. And I'm fed up with all of it. TAR is no longer a "classy" show. Now it's just appealing to the masses, even though it really doesn't need to do that to succeed ratings-wise.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: GreeneTeam on July 11, 2010, 04:43:58 PM
AR13 truly was the last of the classics;)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on July 11, 2010, 06:53:41 PM
Hi Tina and Ken!! TAR 13's cast is the tightest one I know. Y'all are special!! :hearts:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: CuddlyClaudia on July 12, 2010, 09:39:49 AM
This show is clearly huge in the US. I'm looking for new reality shows to watch. Does anyone know if it airs in the UK at all. It sounds like it could be a good one to watch, although maybe ealier series were better. Thanks huys :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Paron on July 12, 2010, 10:17:11 AM
It does, but I think it's a couple of seasons behind in the U.K.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on July 12, 2010, 07:10:53 PM
:welcome2: to RFF CuddlyClaudia!
Let's ask Sam....
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Sam‽ on July 13, 2010, 05:49:20 AM
This show is clearly huge in the US. I'm looking for new reality shows to watch. Does anyone know if it airs in the UK at all. It sounds like it could be a good one to watch, although maybe ealier series were better. Thanks huys :lol:
Ooooh...a question I can answer! :yess:
They're not currently showing any in the UK but if you want to watch, keep an eye on Living TV and Challenge because those two channels own the rights to show it.
The last time it was on TV was on Living in February, and it was on daily at 9pm. Challenge usually hide it away where nobody can find it. They were showing some series at 3.30am daily, but they haven't done that in a while either. (:;)
They also just show the same series over and over, so I would recommend you just maybe find them on youtube because if you do that you'll see some that you'll never see on TV. If I find out it's on TV here again, I'll post the times for you in this thread. ;D
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: CuddlyClaudia on July 14, 2010, 04:01:32 PM
Hey guys,
Thanks so much for this. Any other US shows you recommend. I'm a big fan of US drama and find it is seriously lacking here in the UK.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on July 14, 2010, 04:08:14 PM
You might what to take a look through the home page, claudia? We have a whole list of reality and non-reality shows to follow. :jam:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: docol on August 28, 2010, 06:27:05 PM
The Amazing Race has NOT lost its magic..! IT's the best rality ever...!!!!!!!! Go TAR.....!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :hearts: :jumpy:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on August 29, 2010, 12:07:00 PM
I thought TAR 15 and TAR 16 went downhill.. but i gotta give credit to the finale of TAR 15.. it kept me on the edge of my seat.. it was so exciting and you really didn't know who will win until the last 5 to 10 minutes. But the entire season was hard to get through, i gotta admit.
TAR 16 was boring as a whole for the entire season. The only storyline that they can focus on was the fight between the lesbians and the detectives + CAITE. All the other teams lived in their shadows. As compared to TAR 14 where although there was animosity between Kisha/Jen and Margie/Luke, Margie/Luke, Cara/Jaime, Tammy/Victor had their own individual stories and also all the other teams had their fair share of edit and story as well.
I still believe in TAR, having waited 7 seasons from Season 7 to Season 14 to find back my passion for the show.. what's 2 seasons of downhill?? :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mister RC on August 29, 2010, 12:57:55 PM
I'm in pretty much total agreement with Joab. At least as it stands now. It's funny, because I didn't think TAR14 was super-awesome when it aired. It was very good, but nothing like TAR7 or the like. Of course, fast forward to a year and 2 seasons later, and TAR14 looks like super-awesome. Following a season full of one team dominating most of the race and another team dominating most of the other part of the race the winning team didn't dominate, it was pretty competitive, while full of back stories and very awesome people (who were very awesome outside of the race).
Then came TAR15, and yet another season where one team dominated. I guess I enjoyed it before the season since Maria & Tiffany were racing. Sadly, they got screwed as much as they got very lucky to survive on a couple of occasions. TAR16 was okay compared to 15, as it was a spring season and it was a near-even level playing field. What sucked was the bad blood that was injected into the season; the very end was pretty much the last straw (which I meant so much upon the conclusion of TAR16, more than today). Fortunately, we're at the 10th anniversary of TAR, or will be sometime this TV year.
Now, what am about to say might sound dumb, but I think TAR needs to lose the Emmy in order to win in the long run (like losing the battle in order to see and fix what went wrong so that you can win the war). What I mean is that there hasn’t been a lot of effort put into the show over the past few seasons. However, if TAR keeps winning, no one is going to change anything because they think that they're doing something right. OTOH, with a loss, it might be a sign for the producers to restart and put a spark back into the show to best bring TAR back to its glory days.
Of course, TAR would be on life support if they lost tonight (8/29) or whenever. However, an Emmy win doesn't guarantee its survival, but just helps it a lot (and has 7 years later after nearly getting canceled).
ETA: Should've been clearer on this elsewhere, but when saying TAR needs to lose the Emmy, I didn't actually mean I want to see TAR lose (in order to win). I just think it's necessary as a wake up call to get the show back to better days. Hopefully there are other ways to get this done, sans losing the Emmy. Of course, with mswood reminding me of something I've made mention to in the past, if the criteria is based on what you submit, then TAR really can't lose. If it's the overall picture? no guarantees.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Cocoa on August 29, 2010, 08:22:45 PM
I'm in pretty much total agreement with Joab. At least as it stands now. It's funny, because I didn't think TAR14 was super-awesome when it aired. It was very good, but nothing like TAR7 or the like. Of course, fast forward to a year and 2 seasons later, and TAR14 looks like super-awesome. Following a season full of one team dominating most of the race and another team dominating most of the other part of the race the winning team didn't dominate, it was pretty competitive, while full of back stories and very awesome people (who were very awesome outside of the race).
Then came TAR15, and yet another season where one team dominated. I guess I enjoyed it before the season since Maria & Tiffany were racing. Sadly, they got screwed as much as they got very lucky to survive on a couple of occasions. TAR16 was okay compared to 15, as it was a spring season and it was a near-even level playing field. What sucked was the bad blood that was injected into the season; the very end was pretty much the last straw (which I meant so much upon the conclusion of TAR16, more than today). Fortunately, we're at the 10th anniversary of TAR, or will be sometime this TV year.
Now, what am about to say might sound dumb, but I think TAR needs to lose the Emmy in order to win in the long run (like losing the battle in order to see and fix what went wrong so that you can win the war). What I mean is that there hasn’t been a lot of effort put into the show over the past few seasons. However, if TAR keeps winning, no one is going to change anything because they think that they're doing something right. OTOH, with a loss, it might be a sign for the producers to restart and put a spark back into the show to best bring TAR back to its glory days.
Of course, TAR would be on life support if they lost tonight (8/29) or whenever. However, an Emmy win doesn't guarantee its survival, but just helps it a lot (and has 7 years later after nearly getting canceled).
ETA: Should've been clearer on this elsewhere, but when saying TAR needs to lose the Emmy, I didn't actually mean I want to see TAR lose (in order to win). I just think it's necessary as a wake up call to get the show back to better days. Hopefully there are other ways to get this done, sans losing the Emmy. Of course, with mswood reminding me of something I've made mention to in the past, if the criteria is based on what you submit, then TAR really can't lose. If it's the overall picture? no guarantees.
GOOD JOB. NOW YOU GET YOUR WISH. :res: :res: :res:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: The Queen V on August 29, 2010, 10:31:26 PM
I'm in pretty much total agreement with Joab. At least as it stands now. It's funny, because I didn't think TAR14 was super-awesome when it aired. It was very good, but nothing like TAR7 or the like. Of course, fast forward to a year and 2 seasons later, and TAR14 looks like super-awesome. Following a season full of one team dominating most of the race and another team dominating most of the other part of the race the winning team didn't dominate, it was pretty competitive, while full of back stories and very awesome people (who were very awesome outside of the race).
Then came TAR15, and yet another season where one team dominated. I guess I enjoyed it before the season since Maria & Tiffany were racing. Sadly, they got screwed as much as they got very lucky to survive on a couple of occasions. TAR16 was okay compared to 15, as it was a spring season and it was a near-even level playing field. What sucked was the bad blood that was injected into the season; the very end was pretty much the last straw (which I meant so much upon the conclusion of TAR16, more than today). Fortunately, we're at the 10th anniversary of TAR, or will be sometime this TV year.
Now, what am about to say might sound dumb, but I think TAR needs to lose the Emmy in order to win in the long run (like losing the battle in order to see and fix what went wrong so that you can win the war). What I mean is that there hasn’t been a lot of effort put into the show over the past few seasons. However, if TAR keeps winning, no one is going to change anything because they think that they're doing something right. OTOH, with a loss, it might be a sign for the producers to restart and put a spark back into the show to best bring TAR back to its glory days.
Of course, TAR would be on life support if they lost tonight (8/29) or whenever. However, an Emmy win doesn't guarantee its survival, but just helps it a lot (and has 7 years later after nearly getting canceled).
ETA: Should've been clearer on this elsewhere, but when saying TAR needs to lose the Emmy, I didn't actually mean I want to see TAR lose (in order to win). I just think it's necessary as a wake up call to get the show back to better days. Hopefully there are other ways to get this done, sans losing the Emmy. Of course, with mswood reminding me of something I've made mention to in the past, if the criteria is based on what you submit, then TAR really can't lose. If it's the overall picture? no guarantees.
GOOD JOB. NOW YOU GET YOUR WISH. :res: :res: :res:
theres no room for negativity right now. sorry. but it's not even the last emmys we're ever gonna get.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on August 29, 2010, 10:51:39 PM
Well one thing to remember seasons 12 and on are going to have serious disadvantages from any previous seasons in that they have less episodes to develop stories (with the same number of teams) and for budget reasons they have to get the shots filmed quicker. Meaning driving (especially long term) is going to be rare, more travel near transportation hubs (ie most tasks near cities) and tasks are in general going to be more controlled (as that is usually easier to film, thus normally, though not always cheaper).
And of course as the show gets older, it is harder and harder for producers to come up with new tasks and new exciting places (not impossible but certainly harder).
Many things I like about seasons 1-11 have to do with the actual production of the show, completely separate from casting.
Many, many, many people complain about casting (And I am one of them) I am not against some stunt casting but I think its gone a little too far. As for conflict between teams I don't mind healthy honest competition, but I utterly hate unsportsmanship.
For example I really liked season 14 (probably my favorite from since season 10). But I hated the conflict between Kisha & Jen and Margie & Luke. I hated it no matter who was at fault.
Season 15 I hated the behavior between the Trotters & Sam and Dan, and Trotters and Mika (go down the damn water slide for christ sake), and this season I hated the conflict between well Brent & Caite and Brandy & Carol. I hated how Brent & Caite would talk to and about Brandy & Carol to others (If you are going to talk bad I would rather it be in the confessional footage or when you are alone in a cab, which is normally where most of Brandy & Carol's was. But I was appalled at Brandy & Carol at the finish line. Utterly appalled. I hated that Michael & Louie were pushing teams to go after each other.
This show isn't survivor. Nor should it want to be.
To me here are two good examples of teams who were very competitive against each other, who went all out against each other but rarely got ugly with each other. BJ & Tyler and Eric & Jeremy. Both teams gave it their all almost every single episode but both teams could still work around and be nice to each other. The other example was Dustin & Kandice and Tyler & James. Yet as competitive as these four teams got with each other, don't think you could ever say they really crossed the line with each other.
I miss that type of racing. I miss it alot.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on August 29, 2010, 10:55:31 PM
Enough with casting all the showbiz fringies, the people that TPTB wish all of us ordinary people would constantly act and look like. Enough with recruiting. I want a real race, not some watered down show intended to launch someone's star career. THIS is why TAR has lost it's magic.
In all seriousness, my motivation to watch this next season (TAR 17) is next to zero. The route really doesn't seem unique enough (or good enough to meet expectations), the casting is terrible (as usual), and the prospects are bleak. I truly don't care if a female team ever wins if it means sacrificing what truly makes this show great: Exotic and unique locations, interesting and relevant tasks, and a cast of ELEVEN, TWO-PERSON TEAMS OF ORDINARY PEOPLE. Yes, Lynne Spillman, it's time to actually start casting the way Phil and BvM say you are. Thanks for once again not delivering.(:;)
I have to disagree to an extent. I don't have a problem in general with this. Just the excess of this. If they cut this down 50% I think I would really, really be impressed.
But there have been many teams that are what I call fringe entertainers that I really, really do like. And many teams that haven't applied normally, either seen by casting and told they should apply, or applied but told to get another partner by casting that I really liked.
I just think we have to many of them, and with those types of teams usually doing at least good (meaning making it through about 2/3rds of the race and with getting about two hours less then what we used to get we don't get much development from some of the more "normal" teams.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: The Queen V on August 30, 2010, 01:37:38 AM
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: kadilahopper on August 31, 2010, 05:12:24 PM
I miss season 1. You can tell they had a low budget by the camera shots and filming, but it was without a doubt the only season that showcased ALL the contestants and you got to know them in an intimate way. You saw their laughter, their fear, their comraderie, their competitveness, their humor, their strengths and their weaknesses. Today, we only get glimpses of the regular Joes and all the emphasis is on the semi-celebs until they get eliminated. Compared to season 1, today's TAR sucks in comparison. Any one have a roadma; back to the "thunder that roars"?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: TARdevotee on September 01, 2010, 05:45:14 AM
Just curious, what exactly are people's definition of ORDINARY folks? While I wish that the show would have less mactors, I think they've still had a few non-entertainment industry people lately (even if some of them are recruited). Season 16 had "regular" in Dana & Adrian, Jody & Shannon, Monique & Shawne, Joe & Heidi, Louie & Michael and Dan & Jordan. You can even argue Steve & Allie and Jet & Cord in there (as I personally don't see them as mactors and quite a few sports figures are still pretty "normal" to me). And Season 15 had "regular" in Garrett & Jessica, Marcy & Ron, Zev & Justin, Lance & Keri, Gary & Matt, Sam & Dan and Meghan & Cheyne (that's more than half the teams).
What bothered me about Season 16 was the drama with the U-turns and the editing focusing on the rivalry between the lesbians and Caite. Reminded of how Season 7 bothered me with the editing focusing on Rob & Amber vs. everyone else.
Anyway, I just really hope that by ORDINARY, people aren't suggesting that ORDINARY only applies to those who are overweight or deemed "unattractive." Good-looking folks can still be ordinary and NOT be trying to get into the entertainment industry (Kris & Jon, Joseph & Monica, Amanda & Kris). Chip (TAR5) and Joyce (TAR7) are good examples of people who look to fulfill the "ordinary" mold, yet have quite a few film and/or TV credits to their names from when they were younger, and so I consider them mactors, which isn't a bad thing.
If anyone should be complaining, it's those who want to be on TARA! Now THERE'S a cast of MACTORS! I counted 15 out of 20 for TARA4 who are actors, models, musicians or people involved with media entertainment in some way (or at least trying to be). The most I've counted for TAR US has usually been around 5-10 mactors. Let's consider ourselves a little lucky, shall we?
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: DrRox on September 01, 2010, 06:54:41 AM
I miss season 1. back to the "thunder that roars"?
I remember that quote as "the smoke that thunders." But I am probably adled brained and dont remember it right.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: inomu on September 01, 2010, 08:56:20 AM
something i noticed: there is no conflicts inside the teams anymore but between the teams. In earlier seasons it looks like teams are mostly friends with each other but now they just want to kill each other. Of course there was conflicts between the teams in earlier seasons but they focused more on conflicts inside the teams and vice versa.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on September 01, 2010, 09:03:56 AM
That is production, they are keeping the teams apart as much as possible and feeding that inter-team rivalry.
They seem to think we like artificial drama. :groan:
I agree, focus on the REAL little mini-dramas with in and among the teams...not the ones fueled by production.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: kadilahopper on September 01, 2010, 09:14:50 AM
Doc, you are probably right, but I hope you got the gist of my soapbox. TAR is Nothing like it used to be. And it is a doggone shame!!!!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on September 01, 2010, 12:44:54 PM
I really think it's because the show's priorities changed. The show has become more focused on strategy and interteam drama. Personally, I prefer travel and intrateam relationships.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Kiwi Jay on September 25, 2010, 06:14:08 PM
I miss Pre-Family-Edition. As many have stated it focused so much more on the teams of ordinary people, the comraderie, the little inter-couple tiffs (ILY Teri and Ian!), the drama, each country being showcased with it's best locales, best tasks and vibrant feel. I miss hearing the teams say "Travel to Egypt, to the Sphynx (totally spelt wrong, LOL)" and things like that where you get excited to see what each country has got to offer. I miss each team's relationship being explored. More driving, more game-talk, more strategy and wonder if 90-mins for each episode would be better (IDK). I really feel casting has changed as well...Idk, getting certain teams from TAR10-16 well they all seem wannabe's basically...Not many teams excited me much...I've being trying to tell myself I'm wrong but I'm not...
Who remembers teams from TAR3 travelling in the middle of the night (love night starts) to the Jet D'Eau, then getting a flag telling them to travel to Singapore. What about those exciting Alpine episodes in that season with the long drives, hell even the Flo/Drew romance! The whole idea of roadtrekking through Europe excited me, and the teams were great..Kenny and Gerard, the fierce Twins, Whiner and Zach, Teri and Eyen (LOL) the team you loved and hated and yet really hoped they stayed in and JV and Jill as well!
You don't get that anymore. Every leg seems like its overgone plastic surgery and all you see is quick snappy shots of 3 day time tasks (which usually are all boring), not really any suspense, too much cruelty amongst the teams ala TAR16...And sometimes I wonder if it isn't the teams at all its the way their portrayed. I sometimes wonder if TAR3 would be just as good if you put the latter casts in that season...and I think it is the race itself thats died a little. What about TAR4 Episode1 in the Alps and how exciting that was (though it was obvious Debra and Steve weren't going to make it bless them). And then Episode 2 starting with a night time taboggon down the mountain!
New seasons really feel plastic and polar to me. All you get is quick check out. Airport. All teams booked on same flight (damn production, and as people said about TAR1-7 when teams really got to chose what they wanted to do ala TAR1 with all the teams scheming to get off at Bologne and taking a taxi to the next pitstop!!). Arriving, mad dash which seems boring as well not at all exciting, Detour (kinda irrelevant to the country) Roadblock (10 mins away) All taxi's, not alot of driving! 1 stupid task and then pitstop. Its all about the stupid tasks as well. None of the airing time for stuff in between tasks like in TAR3, remember all the great moments we got when teams weren't racing? like the Europe legs with the full on self driving? When teams were booking flights, driving, on a 24 hour train, Flo whining, Teri yelling "Eeyen"! It's gone, all we get is that listed above, every leg with no real "polish". No development of characters, just full on race to this and that and not be last...
I'm starting to face the music...As so many programs...Early seasons>Late Seasons pale in comparison :( :(
TAR has lost its magic...I feel like I want to go into CBS Studios and get a really great season outta them! It has become plastic (Lynne Spillman, lol) just like Survivor as well although with the firing of Erika Shay its better...but back to TAR lol!
Sorry for my big speech but it just started and wouldn't stop lol! I hope some agree, where's all the polish gone, all the comraderie, the "real" drama not the production concocted crap and the great tasks, location-showing, team development and making the race full on like TAR1,3,5,7 and even 2,4,6 at times! 8,12,13,14,15,16 and 9,10,11 close behind them are all (watching again) paling in comparison...and I know costs are low, but damn costs, just go for it!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on September 25, 2010, 07:27:29 PM
Well we all have to understand part of it is simply the fact that we have had 16 seasons of what is basically the same thing. Some erosion of freshness and novelty is going to natural diminish.
Add to that a cut back (of typically) either two legs or 2 hours of filmed material and you are going to lose precious time spent getting to know the teams (and that aspect isn't any fault of the show, but of CBS).
But I think seasons like 10 and 14 have been excellent seasons for the most part (really the main negative aspect of season 14 was the whole Luke & Margie and Kisha and Jen that soared the ending of that season.
But heck earlier seasons 5, 6 and 7 got very nasty at times between racers.
I do agree though that while the show has always had conflict, I think the producers are really trying to bring it out that is an aspect I don't like at all).
I also think that while some tasks have been absolutely great (and there have always been crappy tasks) what I miss is the really interacting with locals on a task. But with needing to save money, means keeping tasks a little more controlled, less driving, and a little more isolation from the general population.
Again part of that is strictly due to budget cuts from CBS, but part is also design and what type of teams the producers cast. If I had a say I would certainly work with that.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Kiwi Jay on September 25, 2010, 09:03:24 PM
Keep in mind I didn't watch TAR from the start...and I can SPOT the difference! 10-11-12 were fine but since then it has become a bit worse every season imo.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Valkyrian on September 25, 2010, 11:58:40 PM
Kiwijay. I agree with absolutely everything you've said, and I've been watching from the start, but to add my opinions.
Why I believe The Amazing Race has lost it's magic.
1. Models and Beauty Queens
Firstly they're not exciting to watch, they may add the *Beauty* factor but a lot come accross as being fake and playing to the camera at times. This bugs the heck outta me, CBS, heck even World Race Production needs to cast regular members of society, they need to get this beautiful people mindset out of their minds. Normal everyday people even the unattractive can be just as exciting and add more to the race. More people like say Linda & Karen for example, these people may not win awards for beauty but they come accross as good people, good racers and show a lot of heart.
2. Stop casting Celebs/Semi famous people
They need to like stop overloading the race with Celebs/Semi Famous people. You lose the magic of a race with *Ordinary* people in a race around the world. 11 teams of average members of society who aren't famous are more likely to be tactical and passionate about winning. Less Maria And Tiffanys, more Dan and Jordans, Louie and Michaels, Margie and Lukes etc (Nothing against M&T, just listed them as an example)
3. Removal of teams setting their own flights Producers need to bring back the ability for teams to gain a massive lead on the others, if a team gets to the airport first, let them board a plane and leave the country, less bunching more ACTUAL RACING. It's not a proper race if production is holding your hands.
4 Loss of Friendships and developments in that area
Seems the producers forgot that people love seeing the banter and communication between teams during and after tasks, like in Airports. Removing this you lose a lot of the *Reality* feel, and it becomes a *Teams go to task* *Teams complete task* *Teams occasionally talk* *Pitstop* They need to seriously consider the way they edit this show, seems from TAR 13 onwards the banter and excitement is gone at times. Teams cant be THAT Boring can they?
Give me a TAR season with at least 10 non beauty queens and celebs and to me that'l be a race to watch. Bring the Ordinary people into TAR, the non famous, the everyday average Joe who works from 9 till 5, has an average life and you'l have a damn good race.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: redskevin88 on September 26, 2010, 04:03:18 AM
deleted by author
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on September 26, 2010, 06:35:37 AM
I think KiwiJay is right. He didn't say it precisely this way, but the changes from the first 9 seasons to the past 7 amount to dumbing the Amazing Race down. However, I do not attribute any of this to the inclusion of beauty queens in every season since then, as AR5 had two of them.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on September 26, 2010, 10:17:06 AM
Kiwijay. I agree with absolutely everything you've said, and I've been watching from the start, but to add my opinions.
Why I believe The Amazing Race has lost it's magic.
1. Models and Beauty Queens
Firstly they're not exciting to watch, they may add the *Beauty* factor but a lot come accross as being fake and playing to the camera at times. This bugs the heck outta me, CBS, heck even World Race Production needs to cast regular members of society, they need to get this beautiful people mindset out of their minds. Normal everyday people even the unattractive can be just as exciting and add more to the race. More people like say Linda & Karen for example, these people may not win awards for beauty but they come accross as good people, good racers and show a lot of heart.
2. Stop casting Celebs/Semi famous people
They need to like stop overloading the race with Celebs/Semi Famous people. You lose the magic of a race with *Ordinary* people in a race around the world. 11 teams of average members of society who aren't famous are more likely to be tactical and passionate about winning. Less Maria And Tiffanys, more Dan and Jordans, Louie and Michaels, Margie and Lukes etc (Nothing against M&T, just listed them as an example)
3. Removal of teams setting their own flights Producers need to bring back the ability for teams to gain a massive lead on the others, if a team gets to the airport first, let them board a plane and leave the country, less bunching more ACTUAL RACING. It's not a proper race if production is holding your hands.
4 Loss of Friendships and developments in that area
Seems the producers forgot that people love seeing the banter and communication between teams during and after tasks, like in Airports. Removing this you lose a lot of the *Reality* feel, and it becomes a *Teams go to task* *Teams complete task* *Teams occasionally talk* *Pitstop* They need to seriously consider the way they edit this show, seems from TAR 13 onwards the banter and excitement is gone at times. Teams cant be THAT Boring can they?
Give me a TAR season with at least 10 non beauty queens and celebs and to me that'l be a race to watch. Bring the Ordinary people into TAR, the non famous, the everyday average Joe who works from 9 till 5, has an average life and you'l have a damn good race.
You understand that the criteria you listed above pretty much removes all seasons (save perhaps season 1).
1. We have had Beauty Queens and models going back to the third season, and nearly every season has had someone who has either modeled or who has performed in pageants. DO I think they work as racers, yes and no. I liked the following racers and they were either models or pageant persons. Derek & Drew, Tian & Jaree, Christie, Brandon, Lena & Kristy, ect, ect all these are all from seasons 6 and earlier. And there are several others.
2. They have also had actors, people have done tv work, film work, and worked in jobs that receive larger then normal media exposure going back to season two (perhaps season one, but I don't know if Paul started acting after TAR or if he did it before). From people like Allison, Rob & Amber, Brian (or was it Greg) who had all done some reality show work before TAR, to actors like Chip and Joyce (from Uchenna & Joyce), to actor/writers like Gary. There are more of course, but TAR has alway had some of that as well. I do agree that if you are going to do that please limit it. Season 15 for example had Mika & Canaan, The Trotters and Maria & Tiffany. Thats 3 out of 11 teams. Thats really unbalanced casting to a degree I haven't seen since season 6 (a season with a huge number of actors/ people waiting into media and pageant persons). I am not against stunt casting, because some I have really liked, but keep it to a dull roar.
3. This is something that even happened in season 1, but no a much, much lesser degree. They would let you set up many of your own flights, but they would design other aspects of the race to allow others to catch up. But even still a few situations have arisen to really stretch out teams (the producers hate that has it destroys any real drama of an episode. I don't mind bunching in general but I hate really arbitrary bunching. The show has also excluded many flight options going back extremely early into the shows life (letting them only use certain carriers for example). And we do know that teams can still take their own flights has this still happened last season, but there are fewer and fewer legs they are either able to (due to availability, or just to keep teams from getting really spread out). A good part of the reason the producers due this is to one keep the drama of the show up (which is part of their job) and the other is to better manage the amount of time it takes to film. Less time to film cheaper the show. I will be curious to see how much still happens in this coming season.
4. Yes and no. We still get a lot of team interaction. But we see a bit more of the negative side of that (and their has been several seasons were we have seen the real negative side of racers, seasons 5, 6 and 7 could be really bad). But as others have noted the producers have removed a lot of the pit stop time that racers can get to know each other. We still see teams that interact and form bonds. Jaime & Cara, Margie & Luke and Victor and Tammy. We have had Sam & Dan and Maria & Tiffany. We have had Dallas & Starr, ect, ect. But a part of this again is that we get fewer episodes thus less time to mix the teams in the first place. I do wish they still had the teams interact during the Pit Stop even if we don't see it just so teams get a better chance of getting to know each other.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Thames Pirate on September 26, 2010, 09:51:51 PM
Long time lurker/new poster chiming in here!
I think the things that have caused TAR to lose a bit of its magic are:
Handholding/shepherding teams: Any time teams drive themselves there's at least one team that ends up bickering--sometimes the unexpected team, too (Kynt/Vyxsin TAR 12). They have to make decisions about when to stop for directions (Erwin/Godwin TAR 10 were victims of this), when to follow other teams (Meredith/Maria TAR 6), and countless other things (Adam/Rebecca TAR 6 fighting about sunglasses, for example, or the many teams who can't handle a stick). Then there's the added fun of driving hazards such as getting stuck (Mary/Dave TAR 10, numerous teams in various sandy conditions, notably in TAR 2), accidents (Dustin/Kandice TAR 10, Brian/Greg TAR 7), breaking down (too many to list), taking a wrong turn (many, notably Debbie/Bianca TAR 7), diesel issues (most notably TAR 3, but others as well) and the general drama of driving in an unfamiliar place. In fact, self-driving (and to some extent navigating public transportation other than taxis) can help limit spoilers in European countries sometimes!
Additionally, as some have pointed out, finding better flights should be part of the game. While I can understand wanting to avoid another TAR 11 scenario with the Tanzanian leg, it's equally fun to watch teams struggle to make flights (notably Rob/Amber TAR 7 after the meat task), make critical decisions regarding flights, be clever finding alternatives (how great was it when Lynn/Karlyn found a flight to Orly instead of CDG?), etc. Some production control is great, but give the racers a chance to show their creativity and abilities! In fact, I'd advocate rewording clues in some cases from "fly to" to "get to" because it might be interesting to see who compares train schedules to flight schedules!
Isolation of teams from locals: I love watching teams try to find their way around confusing local markets (Rachel TAR 12, for example). I loved watching teams drive across a river under the guidance of a local in the Middle East (season/country escaping me ATM). I loved the interactions with cabbies in Senegal and the drunk locals in Iceland in TAR 6, and any time the language is an issue (typically in Asian countries) can get fun. Forcing teams to get help from those around them is a wonderful way to showcase the world, and isn't that the essence of the show? As Phil says, "the world is waiting for you." It isn't if you don't interact with it!
Isolation from each other: Teams no longer interact at pit stops, meaning they often don't even know who was eliminated until the next leg. This is part of the reason their relationships don't develop (Tara/Alex TAR 2) or deepen. Frequently in earlier seasons teams would be seen talking about how they get along with certain other teams. That's not as common now. There is no first night campout (hasn't been since TAR 14, and they didn't have one in 12) where teams get to know each other. There isn't a ton of time spent on charter busses (where the Sixpack/Backpack alliance was formed in TAR 10 and where Eric/Danielle got to know one another on TAR 9, for example). They're too busy doing a task, hopping in a taxi, and doing another task.
Shorter legs/seasons: While I understand the need to shorten the whole process and cut the budget, having legs that are just a few hours of taxi, task, taxi, task, taxi, pit stop is not exciting when that's all there is. Short legs are fine, but it seems lately there's an endless supply of them. I also don't mind the occasional two legs in one place, but season 15 did it THREE times, each time with minimal drama or changing of position. Legs with lengthy travel are great fun (overnight trains/ferries/whatever). An easy way to save money is to have tasks that require fewer people/materials and to do more in lesser traveled places (also reduces spoiler risk if that's a goal). Being more creative with locations/tasks is a better way to save time/money than a middle of the night leg in Prague.
Casting: I don't mind the beauty queen thing if they're actually competitive (D/K TAR 10), but I do mind stunt casting of gimmicks or based solely on looks. Give me people who want to be there badly--very, very badly. Linda/Karen or Teri/Ian were wonderful because they were competitive, while Jordan/Jeff or Maria/Tiffany, while somewhat competitive, didn't have the intensity that the more "ordinary" teams had. In general there seems to be less intensity--maybe because of the intense handholding? The less gimmicky and more ordinary, the better! A gimmick is only fine if that's just an aspect of one's personality.
Tasks: These aren't too bad other than being a bit too easy at times and not making a difference in standing. Real challenges that truly frustrate competitors or scare them are awesome. I loved watching BJ/Tyler, who had cruised through TAR 9, struggle on a roadblock and be humbled into last place.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on September 27, 2010, 12:05:03 AM
:welcome: to RFF Thames Pirate!!
I agree whole heartedly.
And with the earlier posters who bemoaned the lack of ESM (Eating, sleeping, mingling)...that is what I miss most. This artificial keeping the teams apart to ramp up the drama is having the reverse effect for me...less team interaction means less drama for me, not more.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: cosmophobia on September 27, 2010, 12:09:38 AM
Well we all have to understand part of it is simply the fact that we have had 16 seasons of what is basically the same thing. Some erosion of freshness and novelty is going to natural diminish.
Add to that a cut back (of typically) either two legs or 2 hours of filmed material and you are going to lose precious time spent getting to know the teams (and that aspect isn't any fault of the show, but of CBS).
But I think seasons like 10 and 14 have been excellent seasons for the most part (really the main negative aspect of season 14 was the whole Luke & Margie and Kisha and Jen that soared the ending of that season.
But heck earlier seasons 5, 6 and 7 got very nasty at times between racers.
I do agree though that while the show has always had conflict, I think the producers are really trying to bring it out that is an aspect I don't like at all).
I also think that while some tasks have been absolutely great (and there have always been crappy tasks) what I miss is the really interacting with locals on a task. But with needing to save money, means keeping tasks a little more controlled, less driving, and a little more isolation from the general population.
Again part of that is strictly due to budget cuts from CBS, but part is also design and what type of teams the producers cast. If I had a say I would certainly work with that.
I kinda don't agree. Cheaper challenges could bring better challenges, and saving money does not mean isolating the teams in any way, in fact, is the opposite. Guys, do you remind the Macchu Pichu leg in TARLA? Some task required simply finding some random dude all over the town. That required almost NO money at all and all teams ran francticly and spread everywhere, a lot where lost, frustrated, a team was proppelled to first place, there was a lot of drama, etc...
So, between the WW1 french task in TAR16 and the Macchu Pichu one, which one is more entertaining to watch, which one feels more real and which one was the cheapest? It's pretty clear to me at least.
I don't get the producers, why can't they realise this? Let the teams run everywhere like decapitated chickens, it's cheaper and cooler than a staged plastic task.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: WalterC on September 27, 2010, 09:07:57 AM
I did not mind rivalries during the race, but having it at the final mat when the race was already finished, was going too far. And I did think what Phil did was wrong, instigating and baiting the teams to go at each other's throats.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on September 27, 2010, 10:59:10 AM
Okay with TAR 17 starting today.. i'm just glad i'm still a big TAR fan.. :hearts: :lol:
But i missed the times where teams could be as memorable as Flo and Colin... :lol:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: slayton on September 30, 2010, 07:55:54 PM
When I do my own fantasy Amazing Race seasons, I've suffered, often, a incredible lack of creativity planning fast forwards and stuff. So, to do the strategic role the FF used to do, I've inserted a twist called "Free Pass": Before a detour, once in a game, you may choose skip the task and go to the next clue. That's not so advantageous as a FF, but you don't need to accomplish any task either. It may be developed, though.
And I think since a leg had already a task to be done, there will never be a bunching point: It make that task senseless.
But after all, just the "Amazing Race - travel around the world, trivial people, and do stuff that you never was able to do" always shiver me a lot.
(sorry this brazilian messy english :))
I found this after re-reading the entire thread. Maybe production does follow the board. Good work, Aualagi.
As an original fan, I still prefer the Fast Forward to the Express Pass.
Instead of spending money on additional tasks for the Fast Forward, they could try something like having both members of a team individually complete a Roadblock in order to get a Fast Forward for the team.
The only problem with something like this is the complexity of it. I realize that the show prefers to keep things simple, and, although it doesn't seem complex to me, production might think that the general audience would get confused with something like that.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on September 30, 2010, 10:27:12 PM
Well we all have to understand part of it is simply the fact that we have had 16 seasons of what is basically the same thing. Some erosion of freshness and novelty is going to natural diminish.
Add to that a cut back (of typically) either two legs or 2 hours of filmed material and you are going to lose precious time spent getting to know the teams (and that aspect isn't any fault of the show, but of CBS).
But I think seasons like 10 and 14 have been excellent seasons for the most part (really the main negative aspect of season 14 was the whole Luke & Margie and Kisha and Jen that soared the ending of that season.
But heck earlier seasons 5, 6 and 7 got very nasty at times between racers.
I do agree though that while the show has always had conflict, I think the producers are really trying to bring it out that is an aspect I don't like at all).
I also think that while some tasks have been absolutely great (and there have always been crappy tasks) what I miss is the really interacting with locals on a task. But with needing to save money, means keeping tasks a little more controlled, less driving, and a little more isolation from the general population.
Again part of that is strictly due to budget cuts from CBS, but part is also design and what type of teams the producers cast. If I had a say I would certainly work with that.
I kinda don't agree. Cheaper challenges could bring better challenges, and saving money does not mean isolating the teams in any way, in fact, is the opposite. Guys, do you remind the Macchu Pichu leg in TARLA? Some task required simply finding some random dude all over the town. That required almost NO money at all and all teams ran francticly and spread everywhere, a lot where lost, frustrated, a team was proppelled to first place, there was a lot of drama, etc...
So, between the WW1 french task in TAR16 and the Macchu Pichu one, which one is more entertaining to watch, which one feels more real and which one was the cheapest? It's pretty clear to me at least.
I don't get the producers, why can't they realise this? Let the teams run everywhere like decapitated chickens, it's cheaper and cooler than a staged plastic task.
Clearly a large scale tasks is expensive, but my point is that task that require a lot of traveling aren't going to be used much, tasks that give the teams a chance to really get spread out time wise are going to be use less. The whole point of getting rid of driving is to keep the show on a tighter time table, that can save the show a tremendous amount of money. We don't see teams driving that much lately, or taking mass transit, like buses short or long distance much. All of these allowed extended or even brief contact with locals.We still get some fairly simply tasks that keep racers among locals (and I do like this) the producers are in an industry that also pushes getting some visual bag for the money the spend. The problem is how to balance those on a shorter season.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: tarflyonthewall on October 01, 2010, 01:27:07 AM
Quote
I kinda don't agree. Cheaper challenges could bring better challenges, and saving money does not mean isolating the teams in any way, in fact, is the opposite. Guys, do you remind the Macchu Pichu leg in TARLA? Some task required simply finding some random dude all over the town. That required almost NO money at all and all teams ran francticly and spread everywhere, a lot where lost, frustrated, a team was proppelled to first place, there was a lot of drama, etc...
So, between the WW1 french task in TAR16 and the Macchu Pichu one, which one is more entertaining to watch, which one feels more real and which one was the cheapest? It's pretty clear to me at least.
I don't get the producers, why can't they realise this? Let the teams run everywhere like decapitated chickens, it's cheaper and cooler than a staged plastic task.
Agreed. Considering that one of the most popular tasks in Amazing Race history is the Swiss banking Detour from TAR3, the only costs of which were (1) hiring the vault and guard, (2) putting goldfish bowls of Swiss money out -- which would easily have been converted back into US dollars and reused to pay for something else, and (3) buying fifty yellow ribbons, it's ridiculous that these big expensive tasks that aren't great keep happening.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: georgiapeach on October 01, 2010, 03:09:50 AM
I never thought of that as a particular favorite though... ???
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: tarflyonthewall on October 01, 2010, 03:12:33 AM
No, neither did I. Just using it as an example of how a brilliant task can be done on a tight budget. (It seems to be one of those tasks that gets brought up when discussing Best Tasks Ever, though.)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on October 01, 2010, 05:36:31 AM
I kinda don't agree. Cheaper challenges could bring better challenges, and saving money does not mean isolating the teams in any way, in fact, is the opposite. Guys, do you remind the Macchu Pichu leg in TARLA? Some task required simply finding some random dude all over the town. That required almost NO money at all and all teams ran francticly and spread everywhere, a lot where lost, frustrated, a team was proppelled to first place, there was a lot of drama, etc...
So, between the WW1 french task in TAR16 and the Macchu Pichu one, which one is more entertaining to watch, which one feels more real and which one was the cheapest? It's pretty clear to me at least.
I don't get the producers, why can't they realise this? Let the teams run everywhere like decapitated chickens, it's cheaper and cooler than a staged plastic task.
Agreed. Considering that one of the most popular tasks in Amazing Race history is the Swiss banking Detour from TAR3, the only costs of which were (1) hiring the vault and guard, (2) putting goldfish bowls of Swiss money out -- which would easily have been converted back into US dollars and reused to pay for something else, and (3) buying fifty yellow ribbons, it's ridiculous that these big expensive tasks that aren't great keep happening.
I remember it! That tells something! Not a particular favourite but memorable! But i think racers make the tasks memorable too. Colin made the Ox task in The Philippines memorable, the bowling moms made the abseiling also in The Philippines extremely memorable too.
One memorable and cheap FF (doesn't involve bungee jumping or helicopter to scale the tower or something is the cheese FF JVJ took in TAR 3. LOL. Extremely creative. :hearts:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mug Costanza on October 01, 2010, 03:05:46 PM
The TAR3 Swiss Bank Detour IS one of my favorite tasks. I think it's because it was a task that reminded me of something I might see on "The Mole", which was another one of my favorite shows at the time. Tasks like those were what got me hooked on The Amazing Race in the first place. Compare that with the "Find a castle that is the opposite of Nor'Easter" clue from TAR17 Leg 1, and it goes to show how lame the puzzle tasks are getting!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: slayton on October 01, 2010, 11:57:28 PM
I think they could bring back the Fast Forward for every leg, except the last one, without spending extra money on an extra task.
All they would have to do is modify the early task in a leg, whether it's a Roadblock/Detour/general task, that they're already paying for.
Having a Fast Forward could have made Maria & Tiffany's and Joe & Heidi's elimination legs much more competitive and interesting.
In Maria & Tiffany's elimination leg, the early task was the Roadblock to count the church bells. Since they were already using that location, the Fast Forward could have been something as simple as having a team go up and down the church steps a certain amount of times within a certain time frame in order to win the Fast Forward.
In Joe & Heidi's elimination leg, crawling the trenches was already part of one of the Detours, so the Fast Forward could have been something like crawling across the trenches a certain amount of times within a certain time frame in order to win the Fast Forward.
Slight modifications like those shouldn't cost the show any extra money; they can open up the race by allowing teams that might be struggling a momentum swing, and I think it's a great way to counteract the 100% elimination factor of the U-Turn.
Other than extreme sports tasks, like bungee jumping and sky-diving, that would probably be difficult to modify, I don't know why production hasn't just modified existing tasks for the Fast Forward, unless they think that the Fast Forward winning team would have too big of a lead or the task itself would not be extreme enough for a Fast Forward. It's not like every Fast Forward used to be about head-shaving or tattooing. In TAR2, Oswald & Danny had to find a hotel and grab the Fast Forward from a shallow pool; Gary & Dave got their Fast Forward by finding Amelia Chow and getting a face reading and palm reading.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: DrRox on October 02, 2010, 06:56:04 AM
I thought of those same FFs slayton. The one I had orginally thought of was in TAR6 when Lori/Bolo had to drink the blood. How much extra could that have cost?
I think the water tower deal in TAR7 was pretty costly.....we dont really need FFs like that, do we? I remember thinking at the time, what a waste of money on a singular task.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: apskip on October 02, 2010, 10:06:23 AM
You might expect that Fast Forward use is the results of a carefully planned team strategy, but my observation is that they are mostly opportunistic. The team leading at the point where the Fast Forward card emerges gets the first chance to go for it. They are infrequently challenged due to the risks of losing if the leading team completes it and the challenging team has to go back and do regular tasks (example - Sarah and Terence in AR13 in Kazakhstan). Dustin and Kandice backed off in AR10 in Kuwait City because David/Mary had started for it and Erwin/Godwin appeared to be also doing so.
The only really important uses of the Fast Forward for strategic results were: 1. Frank/ Margarita being positioned to make the breakaway in Thailand's The King due to FF use going form Italy to India two legs earlier. 2. David/Jeff reaching the final 3 in AR4 as a result of Australia Sunshine Coast Water Rescue FF 3. David/Mary in AR10 in Kuwait City avoiding a Marked for Elimination penalty by getting the oil fire fighting Fast Forward
the most comprehensive listing of all Fast Forwards (in the first 14 seasons of the Amazing Race) can be found in "Circumnavigating the Globe: Amazing Race 10-14 and Amazing Race Asia 1-3."
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Caelestor on October 02, 2010, 03:30:25 PM
I have a feeling that the producers WANT to see the teams complete all the tasks so they have more footage + drama.
Personally, I think that FFs should be completely done away (the producers might have done so already) and every team given an Express Pass at the start. The Express Pass is far more useful imo because more strategy is involved; you can utilize it whenever you want. There could possibly be ways to earn additional Express Passes as well (perhaps an extension of a general task or by getting to the pitstop first enough times).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: slayton on October 02, 2010, 11:02:07 PM
If the Fast Forward has been retired, then, even though I think that the Express Pass is another bad idea from production, I agree that every team should get an Express Pass at the starting line. --------------------
There have been a lot of ideas thrown around about what went wrong with the show, but Phil described what made the show great in the TAR 1 theme:
Quote
It's the most daring competition ever attempted.
Eleven two-person teams bound by friendship, love or family will race around the world.
They have no idea where they're going, what dangers they may encounter or how the journey will affect their lives.
Most of the teams will be eliminated, but the team that reaches the finish line first will win a cash prize of one million dollars.
This is a race like no other in history.
This is The Amazing Race.
It's even more powerful when I listen to it.
Bad teams, bad tasks, and bad locations are just superficial problems with the show.
The fundamental problems with the show now are that it's no longer daring and that danger is virtually non-existent now.
I'll use my two favorite sequences in the history of the show as examples.
TAR2: Hong Kong to Sydney--Five teams remain. Four finish the detour and head straight to the Hong Kong airport. Another goes to a travel agent, decides to go shopping, and still ends up finishing in first place in Sydney.
TAR7: South Africa to Botswana--Brian & Greg flip and crash their vehicle, injuring a cameraman. After getting a replacement vehicle and getting to the Detour, Brian & Greg see teams still at the Detour. Brian & Greg hustle, finish their Detour, and see that Ray & Deana are just leaving. Brian & Greg jump in their vehicle and scramble to catch up. As Ray & Deana park their vehicle, Brian & Greg drive right by their door. Both teams jump out and run for their lives. Brian & Greg hit the mat completely winded, and the rest is (Emmy) history.
The problem that I have with every post-TAR7 season, except for TAR14, is that it seems to me like production has scrubbed the element of danger/daring/risk/unpredictability from the show by either not putting teams in situations conducive to it or casting teams that are risk averse. Whether production was lucky or good, TAR7 had a female racer daring enough to shave her head for a Fast Forward, an older racer getting a bloody head injury looking for a clue in a cave, and a team of mactor brothers responsible for one of the most thrilling sequences in television history.
Even if the casts from TAR15, TAR16, and likely even TAR17, re-ran the entire TAR7 course, with or without the current rules, I doubt that any of them would be able to produce even one moment as special or magical as those by the TAR7 cast. If the recent casts were put in the same situation as Oswald & Danny in Hong Kong, there would be no shopping; they'd all head straight to the airport.
Like with every season, I'll give TAR17 a chance, but someone getting hit in the face with a watermelon is something that belongs on "America's Funniest Home Videos" and not "the most daring competition ever attempted."
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on October 03, 2010, 12:37:37 PM
Yikes
Slayton, while the two moments you picked are great moments one was a team thinking outside the box (not as a way to shop but as a means to pass the other teams, they just needed something to pass the down time waiting when they went shopping).
Season 7 was simply a foot race where a team came from behind to beat another team (that still to this day happens), it just usually doesn't occur after a team is driving so recklessly that they cause an accident that injury's a cameraman. And lets be clear others racers have been in a hurry and caused accidents luckily done of them have caused injury.
Since those seasons we have had teams use travel agents (even those from hotels) to get ahead, we have seen teams use their down time to recharge. We have seen take risk driving out into the desert to gain a chance at first place (dumbest move that strong team ever made), we have seen teams take huge, huge flight risks (both in causing their elimination and in causing them great leads).
We have seen more teams push themselves into requiring medical assistance then we ever did before.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on October 03, 2010, 12:47:04 PM
On the Fast Forward and the Express Pass.
As long as multiple Fast Forwards are no longer a part of the race (and they were last available on all but the final leg what season 4) they are useless.
And I liked how they used to do the Fast Forward, something you could only do once, but you weren't just given one you had to earn it. I hate just giving teams an advantage.
Thats why I am very much against just giving each team an express pass (make them earn it).
My favorite racing team is Eric & Jeremy. What I loved about this team is their drive to always come in first. I mean look at the legs they didn't come it first (except for the leg that another team used a Fast Forward) they were always exceptionally hard on themselves. If they had to run from every point A to Point B then they ran. I like that. I like teams (and you don't have to win to do this) that push themselves all the time throughout the full race. We rarely (and this goes to the very first season) have teams that will go all out all the time (well most of the time).
So in that spirit I would love to see the Express Pass rewarded every leg (up to a certain leg say 6th or 7th) to which ever team comes in first. But keep it as something that can only be used once. That pushes all teams to always push themselves. Keeps teams who think they might need an advantage down the road to push for first, and pushes teams that already are doing great to keep other teams from gaining an advantage.
I would much, much rather see competition for something like this then the stupid U-Turn Yields. Still can't fully express how much I hate teams being able to hinder other teams (when at all other times its against the rules).
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: slayton on October 03, 2010, 06:36:35 PM
Thanks for responding, mswood.
Just to clarify, when I'm talking about teams being daring or putting themselves in danger, I'm referring to teams that are willing to make personal sacrifices that have real life consequences in order to stay in the race, like Uchenna & Joyce with the head-shaving, and teams like Brian & Greg who go, "To hell with safety. This is a race."
With the way the race is constructed now, and especially after doing things their own way happened to spectacularly blow up in both Tammy & Victor's and Brad & Victoria's faces in TAR14 Leg 3, I don't expect teams to take chances with flights because the upside is small and the downside is huge. I also don't expect production to allow sleep-deprived teams to drive themselves much anymore for insurance reasons.
If production now avoids casting potentially reckless teams in order to minimize insurance and other costs, then I'd prefer them doing what the TAR: Asia 3 producers did to their teams in their killer Leg 2.
I'm not trying to be sadistic when I say that moments like Margie collapsing at the mat in TAR14 are special moments. Production already dumped ESM; from some of the TAR14 interviews, they seem to be stirring the pot and starving racers also.
I don't understand why production doesn't seem to be willing to go all the way and try to completely break every team's mental and physical will. I'm not talking about a Mika & Canaan, Maria & Tiffany, or Joe & Heidi type of breakdown. I'm talking about a quasi-post-traumatic stress disorder state, like the TAR14 finale, where the final 3 teams were all in tears.
The new races will never be like the old races, but I think the show will be back on track if production makes the race an experience where all the losing teams are either psychologically damaged or carried off the race on a stretcher.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: mswood on October 03, 2010, 08:23:46 PM
Slayton
Brian & Greg simply lost control over their vehicle it wasn't I don't care if we wreck choice. Teams still do this, it s just with a shorter production schedule it really limits the amount of time teams are now driving.
As for Uchenna & Joyce shaving their heads. The race has only two tasks that would have a long term impact on the appearance of a team (the same task) and always done as an optional task. One team did it and in season 5 one team didn't). The only permanent change the race as ever had was in season 12 with the tattoo that Nicolas and Don got.
Seasons 10 and 12 also featured extremely rare long distance driving at night. Something even in the earlier years producers rarely let teams do.
The producers haven't lowered the number of racers who are brash or willing to take risks. I see nothing that points to that. They may have cut back on the number of tasks where racers have more direct control to behave recklessly (and that I would agree with), but teams still react rashly. Last season was really the only season where I felt teams didn't have (as a whole) a lot of drive (some teams yes but as a whole). And just look at the teams pushing their cabs this week, or dodging the traffic with their coffins and you see a lot more daring then a good portion of last year.
But even in the first 7 seasons you saw some cast that were more balls to the wall and some that were a little more laid back. They never know how teams will react until they start racing.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on October 05, 2010, 09:14:58 AM
Okay, TAR producers needs to stop bringing in new elements into this race. Sure it's exciting, but what the hell, we're loyal fans and we don't need a new twist every season.
The Switchback in TAR 15 was great but what the hell, just one season?! I want to see teams eat caviar, ostrich egg and pull the ox again!
What about the Intersection? It was done in Season 10, and it was really a good twist.. why did some season have them, then some season no?
I like the U-TURN better than the Yield, so i have no complains about that.
I still want the Fast Forward.. but MORE FAST FORWARD please! And not just one in every race.. which the first team will definitely get it?!?!! :groan:
The Speedbump is actually kinda creative, but it needs to be a creative task.. really!
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Dånooky on October 06, 2010, 04:05:29 AM
Okay, TAR producers needs to stop bringing in new elements into this race. Sure it's exciting, but what the hell, we're loyal fans and we don't need a new twist every season.
The Switchback in TAR 15 was great but what the hell, just one season?! I want to see teams eat caviar, ostrich egg and pull the ox again!
What about the Intersection? It was done in Season 10, and it was really a good twist.. why did some season have them, then some season no?
I like the U-TURN better than the Yield, so i have no complains about that.
I still want the Fast Forward.. but MORE FAST FORWARD please! And not just one in every race.. which the first team will definitely get it?!?!! :groan:
The Speedbump is actually kinda creative, but it needs to be a creative task.. really!
So do you expect a Season to have U-Turns, lots of Fast Forwards, Intersections and whatnots at the same time?
I'd rather have few and different twists every once in a while, like the Double roadblock in S16. Who's to say the Switchback won't come back? We all thought the Intersection was dead, but it came back at the perfect moment to shock the audience.
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on October 06, 2010, 10:10:40 AM
Okay, TAR producers needs to stop bringing in new elements into this race. Sure it's exciting, but what the hell, we're loyal fans and we don't need a new twist every season.
The Switchback in TAR 15 was great but what the hell, just one season?! I want to see teams eat caviar, ostrich egg and pull the ox again!
What about the Intersection? It was done in Season 10, and it was really a good twist.. why did some season have them, then some season no?
I like the U-TURN better than the Yield, so i have no complains about that.
I still want the Fast Forward.. but MORE FAST FORWARD please! And not just one in every race.. which the first team will definitely get it?!?!! :groan:
The Speedbump is actually kinda creative, but it needs to be a creative task.. really!
So do you expect a Season to have U-Turns, lots of Fast Forwards, Intersections and whatnots at the same time?
I'd rather have few and different twists every once in a while, like the Double roadblock in S16. Who's to say the Switchback won't come back? We all thought the Intersection was dead, but it came back at the perfect moment to shock the audience.
So which part of the message above explicitly pointed out i wanted a season to have loads of "U-TURNs, lots of FF, Intersections and whatnots at the same time"?
A season with 2 FF, 2 U-TURNs, 1 intersection and 1 Switchback, confusing much? No, i believe.
And which part of my message mentioned that "the Switchback won't come back"?
:res:
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Mug Costanza on October 06, 2010, 02:44:38 PM
Honestly, I do think they should increase the appearances of all these new(ish) twists. A perfect race for me would be 4 FF's, 4 U-Turns, and 2 Intersections (one with 10 teams left, one with 6). If the purpose of the U-Turn and the FF are to be used strategically, then give us enough to actually be used strategically! Ever since Season 12, almost every time, the first team that opens the clue giving them the option of the Fast Forward usually goes for it, whether they need it or not. There's no need to not go for it because there won't be any more for the rest of the game (in other words, teams can't pass on it and say "We'll save it for later" if there's no FF later!). Either add more Fast Forwards, or get rid of it altogether and give teams more chances to win the Express Pass. (Maybe have an overnight rest on Leg 1 like was common in the past and give the first four teams that arrive there the Express Pass.)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Cocoa on October 06, 2010, 06:38:04 PM
Okay, TAR producers needs to stop bringing in new elements into this race. Sure it's exciting, but what the hell, we're loyal fans and we don't need a new twist every season.
The Switchback in TAR 15 was great but what the hell, just one season?! I want to see teams eat caviar, ostrich egg and pull the ox again!
What about the Intersection? It was done in Season 10, and it was really a good twist.. why did some season have them, then some season no?
I like the U-TURN better than the Yield, so i have no complains about that.
I still want the Fast Forward.. but MORE FAST FORWARD please! And not just one in every race.. which the first team will definitely get it?!?!! :groan:
The Speedbump is actually kinda creative, but it needs to be a creative task.. really!
So do you expect a Season to have U-Turns, lots of Fast Forwards, Intersections and whatnots at the same time?
I'd rather have few and different twists every once in a while, like the Double roadblock in S16. Who's to say the Switchback won't come back? We all thought the Intersection was dead, but it came back at the perfect moment to shock the audience.
So which part of the message above explicitly pointed out i wanted a season to have loads of "U-TURNs, lots of FF, Intersections and whatnots at the same time"?
A season with 2 FF, 2 U-TURNs, 1 intersection and 1 Switchback, confusing much? No, i believe.
And which part of my message mentioned that "the Switchback won't come back"?
:res:
And they fight again. :lol:
I agree with Dan though (sorry Joab :ascared). I don't want to see a Switchback occurring almost every (or every after) season. The reason why? It might become boring and unexciting and overused.
And the return of the Intersection too shocked me during S16! I don't mind seeing it every race, though. :lol: But for the Switchback, I guess it would be best to save them, because they are infamous memories in the race, its come back must be superbly shocking and not expected.
As for the FF and U-Turns, more please! :lol: I want to see the Yield back too (and that might shock us again!)
Title: Re: Why the Amazing Race has lost its magic
Post by: Jobby on October 07, 2010, 09:11:57 AM
Okay, TAR producers needs to stop bringing in new elements into this race. Sure it's exciting, but what the hell, we're loyal fans and we don't need a new twist every season.
The Switchback in TAR 15 was great but what the hell, just one season?! I want to see teams eat caviar, ostrich egg and pull the ox again!
What about the Intersection? It was done in Season 10, and it was really a good twist.. why did some season have them, then some season no?
I like the U-TURN better than the Yield, so i have no complains about that.
I still want the Fast Forward.. but MORE FAST FORWARD please! And not just one in every race.. which the first team will definitely get it?!?!! :groan:
The Speedbump is actually kinda creative, but it needs to be a creative task.. really!
So do you expect a Season to have U-Turns, lots of Fast Forwards, Intersections and whatnots at the same time?
I'd rather have few and different twists every once in a while, like the Double roadblock in S16. Who's to say the Switchback won't come back? We all thought the Intersection was dead, but it came back at the perfect moment to shock the audience.
So which part of the message above explicitly pointed out i wanted a season to have loads of "U-TURNs, lots of FF, Intersections and whatnots at the same time"?
A season with 2 FF, 2 U-TURNs, 1 intersection and 1 Switchback, confusing much? No, i believe.
And which part of my message mentioned that "the Switchback won't come back"?
:res:
And they fight again. :lol:
I agree with Dan though (sorry Joab :ascared). I don't want to see a Switchback occurring almost every (or every after) season. The reason why? It might become boring and unexciting and overused.
And the return of the Intersection too shocked me during S16! I don't mind seeing it every race, though. :lol: But for the Switchback, I guess it would be best to save them, because they are infamous memories in the race, its come back must be superbly shocking and not expected.
As for the FF and U-Turns, more please! :lol: I want to see the Yield back too (and that might shock us again!)
Also, again, i didn't explicitly said that i wanted a Switchback every season. What i meant more was that it should not be a one time stint.