Survivor Live Internet Talk Show Transcript with
Angie and Willard: Episode 5 Survivor Palau Cast-Offs
(Transcript by SurvivorFever.net 3.19.05)
About Survivor Live: Every Friday join hosts Jenna Morasca and Dalton Ross for an exclusive interview with the Survivor voted off each week, fan phone calls and in-studio guests. Visit the official CBS website to hear live interviews with past Survivor: Palau cast-offs
Dalton: I'm Dalton Ross, senior writer of Entertainment Weekly magazine. The woman to my right, Jenna Morasca. How's it going Jenna?
Jenna: Good To be here. One of the best episodes ever. Both people went to Tribal Council.
Dalton: It was a great episode.
Dalton: Willard your team wins, you're psyched you're fired up but somebody has to get voted out and it ends up being you. How much of a bittersweet feeling was that?
Willard: We had figured out the day before that two people would get dropped fairly soon and we guessed that it was going to be on day twelve. That was not a surprise to us.
Jenna: You guys were getting some inside info.
Willard: We can can do the arithmetic, it's X number of days to shoot the show and there's Y number of people. We were hoping that we would get one of the more traditional twists where they mix up the tribes and we thought that we'd have the majority in both of the new tribes. We thought, that's going to make it easier to kill off Ulong because it won't matter who wins. We discussed the possibility that if we had a very unusual break where they had the majority in one tribe that the other tribe would throw it and just boot off Ulongs. We were very Ulong hungry.
Jenna: As you're saying that you're all talking together but where were the alliances?
Willard: I think the alliances were pretty well laid out last night.
Jenna: Early but was it early on that it started to be Gregg/Jenn, Ian/Tom/Katie thing and then there was everybody else?
Willard: I think it is more of a collection of dyads. Tom & Ian, Greg & Jenn, Coby & Janu, Caryn & Me.
Jenna: what about Katie?
Willard: Katie's strategy basically was to suck up to power would suck up to power, at that point in time it was Ian and Tom and they could bring in Greg and Jenn.
Jenna: It looks like it still is now that they have the power over Caryn and Janu and...
Willard: It may or it may not be.
Dalton: I'm still stuck on the fact that you guys wanted a merge or tribe break-up? You'd think the tribe with the numbers would to stay strong.
Willard: We didn't want it but we were anticipating it as one possible outcome that would allow for two people to go neither one of which would have been one of us.
Jenna: You said when you left "stick to the plan, finish them off". I love that. So Rambo.
Willard: You've got to understand that was designed to put a knife in Tom's back. I wanted Tom... I knew I was gone. I wanted to give Coby, Caryn and Janu their best chance. I talked to Coby and reminded him that when there's a merge, Ulong is no longer your enemy if there are five people on the other side. Tom is the one that had been pushing the Koror, finish them all off. I wanted him to keep in that mode so that he would ignore the possibility of getting taken out by a combination of the minority and some Ulongs. That wasn't a rah rah thing. I was going out and I knew I was going, I wanted to get one little twist in there so he would keep thinking the wrong way and miss the strategy Even though I'm going out, I did the best that I could to take care of the people I was allied with.
Jenna: I'm very afraid for Coby and Janu and Caryn. Janu looks like she's in trouble.
Dalton: Janu looks like she is physically breaking down?
Willard: Janu is breaking down more than you saw. They focused on me for fairly obvious reasons because I was going. Janu gets down but Janu is a very tough. Do not underestimate her because she's skinny.
Dalton: Angie you didn't seem like you were breaking down at all except until you lost that fifth immunity challenge. At that point was it like we've tried everything and this is ridiculous.
Jenna: How did you feel?
Angie: You feel like you are constantly getting kicked. I've never been on a team before, I've never played a sport. Everything I've ever done, I've been responsible for myself. If I didn't do something it was my fault. In this case I did everything I could and it wasn't my fault. You feel so hopeless not being able to control the situation and I think Stephanie felt the same way, she's not used to losing. I've never had to have that shared responsibility, we're all sharing blame, it was a totally new feeling to me and it was horrifying. You're just being kicked and losing the food challenge, that's what everybody wants.
Jenna: You weren't doing terrible, doing things well. I couldn't understand you guys looked like the stronger team from the start.
Willard: Ahhh, that's a mistake. They were a much more attractive team and they had prettier bodies but if you look at athletes, except for Stephenie and Jolanda, all the best athletes were on Koror. Tom, Ian, Gregg, Caryn is small, Caryn also runs marathons.
Dalton: That's true because look at body-builders. Ibrehem is incredibly built but that doesn't mean athletic.
Jenna: He was useless last night.
Dalton: (to Angie) You were on the outside of your tribe at first and the only way to get on the inside was to show them your worth and you were just dunking people and pushing people and going nuts. I loved it.
Jenna: I didn't like it because I was like "you're pissing the other tribe off" what are they going to do when you go to the merge.
Angie: To me it was one of those things where I wanted people to be a little bit intimidated by me. First I had to show the tribe, who was putting strength on this pedestal, which I didn't particularly appreciate, I thought it was silly. To me it wouldn't have mattered how much they disliked or liked me if I kept kicking all their butts continuing into the merge.
Jenna: But eventually at the merge you're going to have to interact with them.
Willard: I don't think anyone on Koror had bad feelings about Angie.
Jenna: What about Janu when she got dunked.
Willard: Janu got dunked, she had some problems with her eye from that. Janu understood that wasn't intentional.
Dalton: Koror would do whatever it takes to win and they saw that Angie was doing what she had to do to win? Talking a little smack.
Angie: We came back and people were like "that was bad sportsmanship". You don't see how long the challenge is. Each one of those sets is like 2 out of 3. They made it look like Caryn was easy to push off. The last one, it was not that easy. We came back. Us women pulled that out of nowhere. Ibrehem helped out on the last one Ibrehem pulled that out at the last minute. We came back, and tied. It was a thrilling moment. You get emotional
Jenna: Losing over and over again.... and then losing food is bad but having to watch, I would have went over and ripped their heads off.
<Tribal Council food clip>
Jenna: One of the worst days ever?
Angie: I was so ready to cry. You can smell the food
Jenna: I didn't like how they were gloating...Coby said before "let's not gloat". Then they were like "oh my God there's biscuits."
Willard: That lasted about one minute. I had not seen that until I saw the show last night. I remember Coby saying that and it made sense to me. When I saw that last night I said "that is one of the first times I saw Koror do something stupid".
Caller: When they gave Ibrehem the immunity, what made them decide to vote for you?
Jenna: There was no time to talk about it.
D: It was you or Bobby Jon. Why did Stephenie switch? Self preservation move I guess.
Angie: I think the way it worked out, we didn't have any tie to talk about it. It was jut like, who can we vote for, I'm an easy vote
Jenna: But why were you an easy vote? You're pulling your weight in the challenges and for the team. But you weren't an easy vote, why isn't James an easy vote, he is crazy?
Angie: Jolanda started it from the very first, she made it a point and an emphasis that power is going to be the key to our tribe. Men are power and strength.
Jenna: I was shocked that Bobby was getting votes over James. James is by far the most dishonest person there. You can see right through him.
Angie: The only reason that me and Stephanie didn't vote for James is we discussed it, and we thought that if we had to go into a merge, we would rather take James, someone shady and sneaky who other people aren't going to like vs Bobby Jon who everyone likes and who is a hard worker is going to kick butt in challenges. We were trying to think ahead.
Caller: Angie you're my favorite player. What made you decide to try out for Survivor in the first place?
Angie: I definitely was all about adventure...doing something different. I've done so many different things in my life, I was just trying to keep up.... I'm a huge fan. I total armchair quarterback.
Jenna: Guessing your favorites from past seasons would probably be Lex?
Angie: No, actually my favorite is Shii Ann. I looooove Shii Ann. I'm totally all about her honesty, she told it how it was. I wanted to try something new and different but didn't think I would get picked because I don't look like the average Survivor woman. There haven't been too many tattooed women. I'm not the most tattooed by far of any of my friends. But it is a little unusual to see on television. I thought I had no chance. I did it on a whim.
Jenna: Willard why did you apply?
Willard: I made a bet with his secretary and wife that I could get on the show. I think I won 10-12 years of life. I lost forty pounds. Changed my body fat composition, down to one third and cut my cholesterol in half.
Jenna: And he looks great, he's kept the weight off.
Dalton: We didn't see a lot of Willard til the last episode but this man is a sneaky bastard. He could have been the Jonny Fairplay of the season. Not only did he lie about being a lawyer but he also lied that he had dead children
Willard: I know that was terrible. I did it so subtly. I said I didn't want to talk about it, I have no living children which technically is true, I don't have any children. I had an excellent game plan, the problem was I had an unexpected physical breakdown that you didn't see on the show. I had heat exhaustion and a lot of problems with my feet. You see a feeble old geezer out there, that's because I could barely walk. I never recovered from the heat exhaustion.
Jenna: Were you a fan of the show before you went on?
Willard: No.
Jenna: Get out of the studio.
Willard: I watch almost no entertainment television. I find it repetitive and boring and I'm not talking about Survivor in particular. I think Survivor is a marvelously put together show. I've watched one episode, I have them on tape. It ruins the purity of the experience. I know what I went through and seeing it photographed from different angles does not add to that experience. If you are a live in the moment person and an experiential person, it's what you experience and not what it's turned into through editing. You have to have a story and conflict or nobody will watch it. Whether or not that relates to the experience I had, not necessarily so. One of the things I found frustrating is, there wasn't anybody in Koror that I really didn't like.
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Part Two
Caller for Willard and Angie: Are these twists, the double vote-off, are they planned ahead of time or thought up as the season goes along to even the tribes? Because it seems to me like that would be unfair to even out things.
Jenna: That's a production question, we don't know.
Dalton: They tell me they are all planned in advanced. They have them all mapped out the entire season from square one. If they didn't have them mapped out you'd figure maybe there would be the merge this time because they wouldn't want to get rid of another Ulong.
Caller For Willard (Louise from California aka Wezzie): Willard, your tribemates seemed to boss you around, particularly Tom and Katie. Was that because you're a postman or ageism? What do you think?
Willard: I didn't notice Katie but didn't pay much attention to her. It didn't bother me with Tom, because Tom served a role as our de facto leader.
Jenna: Did that bother you?
Willard: It didn't bother me because nobody ever gets point for being a leader. The only think you can do is ultimately screw yourself up. I know it bothered Caryn a great deal. Because Caryn doesn't like to have people tell her what to do. I don't know if they did it because I was a postman or what. If they did that would mean that part of my strategy worked. That I was seen as relatively non-threatening. Although I think people started figuring me out toward the end. They figured out that I might actually be smarted than I appeared.
Caller for Angie: Everyone voted off before you seemed to give up. Was that lack of desire a main contributor to your team losing so much.
Dalton: We saw both Ashlee and Jeff both literally ask to be voted off.
Jenna: That sucks. Don't go on Survivor and then quit that ticks me off. I didn't leave because it was hard. If Janu quits next week there's going to be a rumble in the jungle.
Angie: Once Jeff left, he was really happy go lucky and upbeat. We lost alot of our heart for our tribe. I was going to vote Kim. Jeff's martyr speech at tribal council was so off putting. We were willing to help him but he threw in the towel. I thought that was so lame. We really needed him and I felt like it wasn't the better for him to do. He had such a poor attitude. He should have been fighting. Bobby Jon totally volunteered to take all his work to pick up his slack.
Jenna: Ibrehem last night completely blew it.
Angie: We thought they were still going to be okay then Ibrehem completely blows it.
<clip of challenge>
Dalton: The shot of Jeff Probst shaking his head, that says it all. What did Ibrehem really cost you in terms of gameplay? James cost you the previous week.
Angie: It was everything about camp life. Ibrehem was like in the middle mark, never bad but wasn't over the top. Bobby Jon got almost all coconuts. Tended the fire. Me and James were always got firewood. He wasn't the biggest person doing these things. He was very nice, very polite but wasn't that talkative or social.
Caller for Angie: Brutal underwear this year. James was almost see-thru, filthy. Coby's - not good. Angie, initially you bonded with Coby, both being outsiders. How did you feel when he left you in the dust?
Angie: I was devastated by that pick 'em. I'm a pretty big Survivor fan, I totally had my strategy down. I wanted one other person. I saw how strong the Rob/Amber thing was. I wanted the loud mouth so I could sit back. I thought she found that in Coby. Look at him he's so dishy, he's gossiping with everybody, already kinda sneaky. He's perfect. What a great partner. I totally found my Rob. The pick 'em it all came down to me and Caryn. Coby, me, Caryn and Willard all had a tentative alliance. I think he picked her because she's a marathon runner he thought she would be stronger, more level-headed. I fit in just fine with my tribe.
Dalton: Willard you became friends with Coby and asked him to get into your pants.
Willard: I wanted to know if he wanted them. We had almost no clothing. I knew I was going.
Dalton: Did he want them?
Willard: No. I ended up with his shirt. He has that shirt now but it is terribly soiled so I'll buy him another one.
<Clip of Willard and Coby>
Dalton: Did you guys compare beards?
Willard: Coby had a 4 day growth of beard an hour after we got out of the boat.
Jenna: When you knew you were going you accepted it and didn't fight to stay in the game.
Willard: There is a myth about Survivor perpetuated by the producers that you can change things. You can't always change things. I'm 57 years old and I know what you can and can't change.
Jenna: Didn't you want to try to fight it?
Willard: You didn't see everything that went on there. I knew what was going to happen and I'm not going to provide an emotional display of desperation if I can't change something.
Caller for Willard: What Koror member would you have wanted to go home?
Willard: Short-term probably Katie. Long term probably Tom. I think Tom will get taken care of. Tom is too much "out there". But I really don't know what happens from here on.
Jenna: You say Katie is very lazy? Coby says she does nothing.
Willard: You have to understand Katie had a problem after the challenge that involved swinging on a rope and she hurt her hands. Her strategy was to suck up to power and it has worked so far it may take her a long way. If you get to the end you can say "I didn't do anything, I just sucked up".
Jenna: Like Matt? It depends on the jury.
Willard: We don't know if the jury will be Koror mostly or a mixture of Koror and Ulong.
Caller for Angie: That was a dirty, dirty trick, the 2nd part of the reward. The immunity and eating the food in front of Ulong.
Willard: Ulong had such a bad run. It was like stomping baby ducks in public.
Dalton: At first I didn't like it, you're winning a challenge but you're voting someone off. But when they added in the immunity bit I liked it.
Jenna: It was kind of like the outcast twist on Pearl Islands. Because Ibrehem was supposed to go but now he's still there and wonder if he makes it far?
Dalton: The people who voted to give Ibrehem immunity... all women... Katie, Caryn, Janu. Did they vote for him because he's a hottie?
Angie: He barely says anything and it was like a knife in the back.
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Part Three
Dalton: During the commercial break Angie is saying that Ibrehem was not happy with her.
Angie: I brought it all out, you can see it on my face. I'm a horrible liar and during Tribal Council, Jeff Probst said "what about Ibrehem". I said "ohhhh he lost it, he was the only person who lost it". Ibrehem was not happy.
Jenna: Ibrehem voted for James first because James was coming down hard on him.
Caller: Who do you think will win?
Dalton: I like Ian.
Jenna: I'm saying Ian because he has an alliance with Tom and Tom is more outspoken. Ian is playing like Ethan. I think Ethan and Tom are like Ian/Tom. He'll get by being the 2nd man in command. It's like the Boran Boys alliance.
Caller for Angie: You were first on the chopping block but became an unexpected power player. If Coby had ended up picking you for Koror how would you have done on that team?
Angie: I would have probably not been sitting here, sorry Willard. I would have done the same as with Ulong. In the balance beam challenge I would have been the first person across for Koror.
Dalton: Willard when Koror had to sit challenges out, you would sit out on the ICs as opposed to the reward ones.
Willard: That's not true. I did the first one and second IC, the popping up of devices and pulling the box.
Dalton: Why didn't they sit you out for immunities? If you're suffering from heat exhaustion.
Willard: The first one was before I got heat exhaustion and the second one I believe we did it because Katie's hands were hurting. That was my best challenge because you couldn't see what I was doing. I cheated on that challenge. I was slow swimming out to the boxes. We had to restart the challenge because they (Ulong) cheated. They had people trying to push the boxes as well as pull. My job was to take the slack. If you take the slack that Coby gave me then you would have one arm on the box and the box would go down. I wrapped my legs around the rope so they didn't give up the slack and the box didn't go all the way back down to the beginning.
Jenna: You cheater.
Willard: Absolutely.
Dalton: I love it. If you can get away with it that it is part of the game.
Dalton: Did your tribe realize that you cheated underwater?
Willard: Coby knew. Coby was next to me in the water.
Question for Willard: This goes back to earlier when you said you're an experiential person. I'm a Cherokee. Did any of you get to love or experience the land itself? Being in this extraordinarily beautiful place.
Willard: I have an answer that you will probably appreciate. There is an endangered species of sea turtle there and one night a female came up next to the Koror camp and dug a nest and laid her eggs and then went back out. We found out from a camera man with night vision equipment. We quarantined that area and put bamboo up so that no one would step on the turtle's eggs. That was not the experience that made me think about the land it was the fact that the rats on that island, they are not native rats, they came from ships years ago and are probably the prime predators of that turtle's eggs. You had the experience of seeing an endangered animal attempt to perpetuate itself the way it's supposed to in the great chain of life and yet you have mankind endangering that by allowing predators destroy that life. It was a very deep moment for me.
Angie: I felt really felt good in Palau. It is a matriarchal society and I'm a feminist myself. Plus it's traditional for women to be tattooed there. I felt completely accepted, nobody questioned. It was a big change. Coming from the States if you do one thing different from what you see on television. People there are like "my grandmother has tribal tattoos that tell the whole story our lineage and our whole family". They were totally interested in what I had. It was like cultures coming together to talk about an older way of life and newer way and meeting in the middle.
Caller: With lack of food and water, strategy would go down the hole because you're so fatigued. Why the focus so much on the team? Screw that.
Dalton: I hammered Jeff on that a few weeks ago. It's not a team game. It's individual.
Angie: I tried to focus on that team dynamic but it's insane.
Willard: It can be useful to focus on the team, if you can get other people to incorrectly focus on the team their in a position of weakness. There is some of that going on in Koror. I called Ulong the teabag tribe.
Caller for Angie: You were my favorite. You outplayed all the guys on your team. What person on your tribe did you not get along with?
Angie: We got along pretty well. People have their moments. Jolanda who is a wonderful person can be a little much to handle. On the first day she's like "I'm everybody's mom". I'm like "honey I left home at 16 I don't want a mom bossing me around." Kim got to me sometimes. Some of things she would say. She's intelligent, book smarts, school. Then she would say things like "we need to let the guys eat more food than us, they are bigger and they need more sustenance". I'm like "honey have you looked at my butt lately, I'm not skinny and I need to eat". She's so smart I just didn't' understand that concept at all
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