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Offline Kiwi Jay

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TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« on: June 05, 2016, 04:41:04 AM »
Hello RFF'ers :waves:

I was talking with Peach today about where The Amazing Race is going and wanted to post this. Would love to hear from others about what they think.

I feel as though the race has really been losing itself the past 4-5 years. It has lost its soul almost. I feel it could be good to do a mass letter to CBS and Bert, Elise, Phil etcetera. Not sure if it would do anything, but those of us that have watched and followed for 15 years should speak up. I do feel CBS has a big hand in the huge changes in this wonderful show.

I truly wish casting and editing would be more 'real' like older seasons. Diversity and all ages, ethnicities, body types and with strong characters. What happened to the editing, those old moments where it was light and shade. Now it all seems go, go, go. Look at the older seasons where hours of operation and race down times were also documented and aired. And what of the gimmick seasons. How is that going to help? People want to see real teams and real situations.

I think the formula is being warped. I don't mind little tweaks of course, but it feels totally polar to earlier seasons and it's sad. Gimmick wise, it has only been in the past five seasons really, although editing and casting one could argue has gone back a little longer. I miss the subtle moments, the slower pace editing at times to contrast, the REAL teams of all ages, sizes, relationships, and no added gimmicks! Sorry to spurt all this at you guys, but I just wish it could wind back a bit and look at it's roots. What has Survivor done right that TAR hasn't? And can we help to bring it back from this?

Love to hear what y'all think, and definitely feel a mass fan-letter should be propelled into the hands of CBS and the executive TAR team. I just love this show too much to see it going the way it is.

What do you all think needs to change? Please feel free to write something that we could compile in a letter or petition of sorts.

Addendum - Please see my post further down the page for more details!
« Last Edit: June 05, 2016, 04:01:37 PM by Kiwi Jay »
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Offline TARUSAFan

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2016, 04:54:37 AM »
Hello RFF'ers :waves:

I was talking with Peach today about where The Amazing Race is going and wanted to post this. Would love to hear from others about what they think.

I feel as though the race has really been losing itself the past 4-5 years. It has lost its soul almost. I feel it could be good to do a mass letter to CBS and Bert, Elise, Phil etcetera. Not sure if it would do anything, but those of us that have watched and followed for 15 years should speak up. I do feel CBS has a big hand in the huge changes in this wonderful show.

I don't like the gimmicks and wish casting and editing would be more 'real' like older seasons...as said above, what happened to the editing, those old moments where it was light and shade. Now it all seems go, go, go. Look at those older seasons where HOO's and race down times were also documented and aired. And what of the gimmick seasons. How is that going to help? People want to see real teams and real situations.

I think the formula is being warped. I don't mind little tweaks of course, but it feels totally polar to earlier seasons and it's sad. Gimmick wise, it has only been in the past five seasons really, although editing and casting one could argue has gone back a little longer. I miss the subtle moments, the slower pace editing at times to contrast, the REAL teams of all ages, sizes, relationships, and no gimmicks. Sorry to spurt all this at you guys, but I just wish it could wind back a bit and look at it's roots. What has Survivor done right that TAR hasn't? And can we help to bring it back from this?

Love to hear what y'all think, and definitely feel a mass fan-letter should be propelled into the hands of CBS and the executive TAR team. I just love this show too much to see it going the way it is.

What do you all think needs to change and feel free to write something that we could compile in a letter, of sorts.


Thank You Kiwi Jay for posting this. I think mine's gonna be long. I just have so much to say.

Offline fossil-racer

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2016, 03:38:43 PM »
During TAR 24, I started to give up on the show honestly because show turned bland. Cast was too basic, the route was horrendous, the finale leg was bland. Editing was actually ok. More on this later too...
The show lacks consistency now and I hope this long post to be will hopefully put help out there.
TAR 25 came and the show I loved was back. Everything was awesome this season. The cast was everything and one of my favorites all-time. Editing was ok. The twist of the open start line and find the express pass was great. The twist with the save was not. Route was great more countries and fun tasks.
Casting- Diversity
Best thing of the TAR 25 cast was diversity in a way. People from all walks of life/ethnicity.
Plus 4 FF teams. I would say don't cast too many types of one team. 4 be the max and for the FF teams in 25 it really came together.
Here's the thing; You want twists; that is great. Not big twists but small but subtle twists work best. The smallest thing can add layers and still provide something inventive and fresh and audience relatable (finding that express pass) and (open start line). Also, if you want twists, think it through. To make the save better, you can have a team turn it in before a team gets their placement revealed. This adds more layers/drama/whatever.
Side note; Route was pretty good. Throw in at least 1 new destination and return to destinations not visited from long ago.
TAR 26 was not that great imo.
Cast lacked diversity and 9 mf is too much and overwhelming. Also, no ff teams. Lesbians are also part of the America and the fact that one of this team type was not cast was puzzling. If you could put together a stellar cast in TAR 25 that was so diverse, then why did in Tar 26 it took a dip down. Consistency lacked.
The route was ok but the problem was too many double legs, just like 24. Even if it’s a different place in the same country, I wish there was more travel to different countries because that is what makes the show fun.  TAR 25 embodies that.
TAR 24 and TAR 26 were basically the same in terms of basic cast and bland route.
You didn’t need such a big twist (look at 25) and I don’t think most of the twist really resonated with viewers who were new to the show imo.
TAR 27
Editing was the problem. Focus on more than one team to develop the season. Do not give all the screentime to one team. Also, footrace in Leg 2. The editing was sloppy. The part when Jasmine/Danielle were saying come on, its a million dollars. I buy you new feet. Come on. It could have been edited better and it was weird because that part was not fully said I think. Parts of it were saide. When you exclude the come on part, you take out that old school nostalgia were everything was intense and fun.
TAR 28
Better but you don't need a big twist, unless you were aiming to attract new viewers. The live stream was that subtle but small twist that was cool. Route was stellar and tasks were ok.

I hope in the future you use 25 as an example for a good season. A 18+25 season would bring the show back. Also, consistency is huge. Always have good/diverse casts season to season and small but subtle twists moving forward. You don't need huge twists to succeed TAr 25.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2016, 04:31:45 PM by fossil-racer »
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Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2016, 03:39:43 PM »
:tu kiwi!!

Let's use this for a thoughtful, constructive discussion. What would you want to tell CBS/WRP if you could?  :tup:

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Offline Maanca

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2016, 03:52:24 PM »
A lot of it is CBS pressuring them to implement these gimmicks to "keep it fresh". This has caused Phil to lose of the personality he used to have since he's forced to act enthusiastic about these gimmicks (the Pit Stop interactions in the Dating season were just...facepalm...)

Two things I definitely don't miss from the classic seasons are the original Non-Elimination penalty of Phil essentially mugging the last place team, and the first 15-20 minutes of each episode eaten up by teams standing in an airport.

What I do miss is the less fit/over 50 people they don't cast anymore. They were always fun to root for, now the preference is on young, athletic types.

Tasks have become too easy, and legs too short, at times a leg is basically Roadblock, Detour, Pit Stop. The balloon shaving in season 24 is the example I keep going back to of cheap task design.

I also feel like they phone it in when routes get to Asia. There are lesser-seen/never-seen safe countries they could go there, but we get places like China, India, Indonesia etc over and over and over. The first 2 have spilled over onto a second line on the Wikipedia list of countries visited, that tells you something.


Offline Kiwi Jay

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2016, 03:55:53 PM »
No worries Miss Peach!

So if y'all want to post your suggestions and comments on our beloved race, I'd like to provide a platform for CBS/WRP to read our thoughts on current issues.

And go tell your forum friends, I'd love to have as much of our online community giving their opinions on this.

PLEASE talk about anything that has frustrated you recently! Gimmicks, editing, casting, locations, time-slot change. This could prove vital guys! Talk about what you don't like now, as well as why you first fell in love with the format of the show!

Go forth RFF'ers.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2016, 04:51:18 PM by Kiwi Jay »
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Offline Pi

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2016, 05:55:29 PM »
If it ain't broke, don't try to fix it. Instead of new twists and gimmick seasons, revert back to what has worked over the years.

Editing:
- Focus on the amazing places that the race is visiting and transportation/flight drama rather than dumb things like Blodie which don't contribute to a good show.

- Sometimes, the race feels like it's moving along at a million miles an hour. Slow down the pace of the editing.

- Announce all Pit Stop placements.

Route & Tasks:
- Routes are typically good if they visit at least one new country or visit 2+ once-visited countries not visited for 10+ seasons.

- Africa is cheap and tasks as simple as milking a camel are easy, culturally relevant, and memorable.

- Have at least 1 Fast Forward each season. They don't need to be expensive, extravagant tasks, but should be harder than other tasks that leg.

All of these things have been achieved before in previous seasons, so I don't see why they can't happen today.
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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2016, 06:30:05 PM »
Per Wikipedia:

Quote
Organic unity is the idea that a thing is made up of interdependent parts. For example, a body is made up of its constituent organs, and a society is made up of its constituent social roles. Organic unity was propounded by the philosopher Plato as a theory of literature. In Poetics (c. 335 BCE), Aristotle describes organic unity by explaining how writing relies internally on narration and drama to be cohesive; but without balance between the two sides, the work suffers.

Organic Unity is definitely something editing needs these days.

Take a look at TAR5, for instance.

On the Dubai to India leg, we had foreshadowing of Chip & Kim and Colin & Christie rivalry that went something like this:

Quote
Colin: (in a confessional) We trust Chip & Kim!
Christie: We think we can work together well.

Kim: (in a confessional) I want Colin & Christie to EXPLODE :')

That's a really funny/witty juxtaposition, AND it actually led somewhere, as we saw Chip & Kim Yield Colin & Christie in the Philippines. Yes, it was thrown in for the sake of drama, but it did NOT dominate the episode and was just randomly placed in the episode as funny/witty.

Now look at TAR27, where we had three ENTIRE episodes focused on Justin vs. Texas. And it wasn't even anything like TAR5! We had the rivalry foreshadowed on Leg 2, but editors went WAY overboard by focusing the THIRD and FOURTH leg onto their rivalry... and as a result, forgot about EVERYONE ELSE. This made it feel unnatural, peculiar, and helped plunge 27 into a season that was such a cesspool of entertainment it was very easy to forget despite having a decent cast and route.

By handling Justin and Texas on TAR27, you can see how editors failed to create organic unity. Instead of narration and drama being cohesive, they force it. They go overboard. By delving too much on the other end of the spectrum of focusing on the drama, they helped ruin what could have been three decent episodes. The fact that the rivalry is also never heard of again is also nothing short of maddening.

Seriously... this new era is terrible, editing-wise. Although there are STILL some really high highs (TAR25's chain of Shetland - Morocco 1 is nothing short of top tier and so was TAR26's Thailand - Germany and TAR28's chain of Armenia - Dubai), there are also some excruciatingly bad lows (TAR25 Italy was an awful leg and so was Morocco 2, 26's Japan string is self-explained, 27's near ENTIRETY, and 28's winter legs being just as awful, if not worse, than TAR24's).

If production really wants to change (and they have to, for the sake of the show, my goodness, it speaks massive volumes that TAR5's Dubai leg is a top tier episode and not because of the tasks or the location but the TEAMS, and despite having 20 ENTIRE minutes without any tasks it's still an amazing episode), they must rewatch TAR3/5. Those are the series at its peak and they need that kind of magic back.

Gimmicks are fun, but if you force it (TAR26's PS interactions are so cringe + TAR28's entire first 10 minutes), it just ends up looking pathetic or poorly thought out.

Follow Aristotle and Plato's example. Fix the editing and try to create a season rich with organic unity and fun.

As Rachel Reilly herself said, "The Amazing Race is supposed to be fun and good!". And yes, Rachel, yes it really has to be fun and good. But at this rate, unfortunately it might not be good... nor fun either.

Offline TARUSAFan

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #8 on: June 05, 2016, 11:29:55 PM »
•   Twists

>      CBS has been experimenting on twists to try and salvage the Amazing Race but going in this direction is doing the show no good. Apparently, the Season 28’s “Social Media Cast” really did not live to their expectations despite all of them having huge fan bases. Their viewership is still low.

>      Season 26’s “Dating” themed season was atrocious on all levels. It is as bad as Season 24. None of the Blind-Dating teams even sparked a relationship. Also, there were too many double legs on the same country: Japan, Thailand, Namibia, Peru which some of the tasks were underwhelming. The only redeemable part was Hayley & Blair, a visit to Monaco and return visits to Peru and Namibia.

>      They dubbed Season 24 an “All-Star” season, when clearly it was not. It was even no near the Unfinished Business season The tasks were beyond simple, a teenager could do that. Clear examples would include Season 24’s Spain leg. They went there to shave a balloon. Really? This is Spain, another country teeming with loads of activities and culture. I remember, in Season 18’s Unfinished Business, Phil said “This race is going to harder than your previous races.” The cast of Season 24 was terrible, bland and absolutely boring. Why would you put Jessica & John there, they both were dumb enough not to use the Express Pass in Season 22’s Bali leg and the fact that he said “ I don’t need a million dollars” does not deserve him to go back. They are not All Star material. Also, 3-peaters Margie & Luke, Jet & Cord, Flight Time & Big Easy. They had their chance, wasted spots to others. They could axed the All Star Season and made it a normal season instead.

> Cut it with the twists. I am an Amazing Race purist. I just want a regular cast with people from all walks of life.

•   Editing
   
>     Recent Seasons have had terrible sub-par editing. Season 27 was a clear example. They focused much on Justin & Diana that even to a point that even the previews for next week included them. Also, the rivalry with Tanner & Josh looks milked. First few episodes revolved around their rivalry leading to the underdeveloped 8th -10th place teams. There were scenes there that are clear that were cut. I remember one of the contestants noted that what they said were cut or shortened. Also, there were no more suspense found on recent seasons. Where are the suspense-style edits?

>   Please announce each team placements when they arrive at the mat. We do not see these nowadays, even the reactions of the teams. Also, the pitstart where the team who won the last leg reads the clue for the next destination. We need to see that again Moreover, Phil narrates it now. We do not get to see teams interact and they capitalize on 2 teams just like Season 28’s Blair + Blodie = Blodie. Atrocious, they could have used that time to explore the city more + team interactions. Don’t give the viewers something forced.

>   In Season’s 27-28, the pit stop greeters are lessened and they are an important element in the Race. I miss seeing interactions with the greeters. We now only get it through secret scenes where only a few get to see it.

>   The editing is very fast-paced in recent seasons. It is just too much to take into.

•   Routes/Countries Visited

>   I love that the Race has been visiting new countries lately from Season 25-28. Malta, Monaco, Zimbabwe, Colombia, Armenia and Georgia. Good job to the production for doing that. Also, visiting undervisited countries are also good such which they did in recent seasons. I would suggest mixing overvisited countries with undervisited countries and couple that with a new country or two. Season 25 did that. The only let down for that route was the U.S. Virgin Islands, they could replaced that with a Bahamas leg or any Central American or Caribbean leg. Also too much Europe overload, the Italy leg should have been a different leg.

>  In visiting Asia, please visit other nations as well. We’ve been getting China, India, Indonesia, Japan… What about Israel, South Korea, The Philippines, Maldives, Cambodia? Stop visiting overused countries back to back or consecutively in Asia.


>  Europe. There are so many countries in Europe that are not visited so much, we have Greece, Finland, Norway, Spain, Portugal, Czech Republic, Ireland, Iceland, Belgium, Lithuania. There are also countries that have never been visited before such as Latvia, Luxembourg, Slovenia, Slovakia, Montenegro and Bulgaria to name a few.

> Oceania, I am waiting for this one to pop up. Where's Australia, New Zealand, French Polynesia, Fiji and Vanuatu. I still cannot fathom, why this continent, Oceania is not visited considering it is one of the safest continents and there are loads to be done there.

> Africa, The last time I saw South Africa was in Season 7 and this country never even had a double leg. It really deserves a visit. Also Mauritius, last visited in Season 10 and it was underwhelming. Mauritius is one of the crown jewels in Africa. Such a diverse island with so much activities to do. Africa is one of the hardest continents and it would be nice to see them interact more with the culture with culturally relevant tasks and harder ones.

> South America, I'm glad Colombia gets a visit despite the travel advisory there. Cartagena, Colombia was awesome. Why visit Argentina many times, give others a chance. Bolivia, Uruguay, even Brazil needs a chance to be explored more.

> Central America / Caribbean, I still don't get why this has not been visited that much. Costa Rica, The Bahamas, Nicaragua, Jamaica, Panama. Hopefully, we will see Cuba soon.

> North America, It is about time that Canada needs to get a decent visit. We've only seen it visited last Season 8. It would be also good for Jon Montgomery ( TAR Canada's host) to be a pit stop greeter.

•   Cast

>   Season 22, Season 23, Season 25 had a really great cast very diverse in my opinion. Season 27 also has a great cast but they did not develop them all properly. The only let down for Season 25’s cast for me was Keith & Whitney. Absolutely bland and boring. They both had their share in Survivor, so don’t steal another teams spot on the Amazing Race. Stop casting Big Brother, Survivor reality crossovers to join the Race. They have had their share of fame. They are obviously stealing a valuable spot to those who have applied.. Kudos for casting Bethany Hamilton in Season 25, a real inspiration for those with disabilities.

>   Please do cast older married teams. They were normally part of at least every season before. We’ve had 1 in Season 26, Jeff & Lyda, they were 1st eliminated. We need grandparent teams like Bill & Cathi from Season 19. The Race finds it easy to cast 40-50’s aged M/M teams: Rowan & Shane, Michael & Scott, Art & JJ, Ron & Bill, Bopper & Mark but finds it hard to cast 40’s-50’s aged F/F teams. The last one was Carol & Brandy from Season 16. Mona & Beth of Season 22 were close but they were in their late 30’s.

>   Also, cast stronger F/F teams. Kym & Alli were gold. I have no problem casting Models/Beauty Queens, as long as they are like Dustin & Kandice, why can’t the Race find another similar pair like them. Also, Brooke & Claire when TAR can find another similar team like them. We need F/F’s that have Beauty, Brains and Brawn with a sense of humor. They always find alpha-male teams but limit it to at least 1 or 2. Tanner & Josh were my favorite alpha-male team.

>   Please cast Americans across America. Most people who get casted are in the California area. There are many great personalities found in all states.

>     We need diversity in every cast

> If the production team were to cast a semi-famous or famous teams. Limit it to at least 2 teams. I know some of them are huge fans of the Race but don't cram them all in one season.

•   Tasks

>   Tasks nowadays look easy. Let me just say of all the things you could do as a Roadblock in Armenia, it would be changing an oil in a hill somewhere near the pitstop. It is not culturally relevant. Season 27’s Buenos Aires leg where the Detour was to deliver a statue. What on earth is this monstrosity? Most tasks in Season 27 involve waiting in line to get a turn. What is this grade school? It makes it predictable who gets booted. The only thing that saved it was the mishaps and mistakes of each team. The most recent one, Season 28’s Indonesia 2 leg Detour: Deliver 50 coconuts and 4 chickens, there are so much more to do than just that in Indonesia. In a nutshell, most of the tasks are just plain simple, no thrill, no challenge. I do not need to mention Season 24. A teenager or even a child could finish some of the tasks there. We need tasks that are both physically and mentally challenging and culturally relevant at the same time

•   Recurring & New Elements on the Race:

>   Fast Forwards - Please include Fast Forwards per Season, a harder one compared to the other tasks on the same leg.

>   U-TurnsPlease put U-Turns strategically on the Race. Do not put it after a Non-Elimination leg as it puts the team with a Speed Bump at a disadvantage. Also it would be nice to add a new U-Turn such as Triple U-Turn in early legs of the Race such where 8-10 teams remain.

>   Speed Bump – Could the Speed Bump at least be a culturally relevant one where locals really do it. I find some of the recent Speedbumps quite irrelevant.

>   Intersection – Could we see the return of this one. It has been ages since we last saw it.

>   Yield – Apart from the U-Turn, The Yield is also a great element to add a bit of suspense where you get to slow a team down. I would suggest it would be a Double Yield


Additional Comments/Suggestions:

>   For the premiere episode, it would be good if it was at least 2 hours or an hour and a half to give us the opportunity to at least get to know the teams more and make it not too rushed on the editing because you are fitting 11 teams in one episode and that is hard. Everyone must be memorable even for a 1st boot. It would also be good to have at least 2 Roadblocks and 2 Detours on the 1st leg.

>   Revert back to Sunday viewing timeslot as Amazing Race is a family-oriented show and most families would bond on Sundays and stay at home.

>   Have us fans get to help develop the Race for the benefit of the show as well

>   Remove the geoblock at TAR’s Youtube page and give access for people to see it.

>   Where exactly are the harder finales? we need this back Recent finales have been bland and boring.

>    I am missing the competitiveness of the teams against each other along with competitive and suspenseful style edits.



Bottomline: Look back at the previous seasons where you have had success and capitalize on that. As Pi said above, do not fix something that is not broken.

« Last Edit: June 09, 2016, 12:25:00 AM by TARUSAFan »

Offline redskevin88

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2016, 11:57:35 PM »
•   Twists

>      They dubbed Season 24 an “All-Star” season but the tasks were beyond simple, a teenager could do that. Clear examples would include Season 24’s Spain leg. They went there to shave a balloon. Really? This is Spain, another country teeming with loads of activities and culture. I remember, in Season 18’s Unfinished Business, Phil said “This race is going to harder than your previous races.” The cast of Season 24 was terrible, bland and absolutely boring. Why would you put Jessica & John there, they both were dumb enough not to use the Express Pass in Season 22’s Bali leg and the fact that he said “ I don’t need a million dollars” does not deserve him to go back. They are not All Star material. Also, 3-peaters Margie & Luke, Jet & Cord, Flight Time & Big Easy. They had their chance, wasted spots to others. They could axed the All Star Season and made it a normal season instead.

I made the comment before was that they cast Jessica & John because they threaten to sue CBS because of their elimination (it was a lame joke). I've yet to hear any other explanation that makes a shred of sense.


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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2016, 01:51:02 AM »
First of all, thanks TARUSAFan for the essay, however I want to talk about some of your points for the sake of friendly discussion. :)

•   Twists

>      Season 26’s “Dating” themed season was atrocious on all levels. It is as bad as Season 24. None of the Blind-Dating teams even sparked a relationship. Also, there were too many double legs on the same country: Japan, Thailand, Namibia, Peru which some of the tasks were underwhelming. The only redeemable part was Hayley & Blair, a visit to Monaco and return visits to Peru and Namibia.

I really do not get TAR26's hate when TAR6 almost literally did the same thing by having its near entire end-game have nothing but dating couples. No way is it as awful as 24.

>   Please announce each team placements when they arrive at the mat. We do not see these nowadays, even the reactions of the teams. Also, the pitstart where the team who won the last leg reads the clue for the next destination. We need to see that again Moreover, Phil narrates it now. We do not get to see teams interact and they capitalize on 2 teams just like Season 28’s Blair + Blodie = Blodie. Atrocious, they could have used that time to explore the city more + team interactions. Don’t give the viewers something forced.

Agreed, but wouldn't you say that part of the awkwardness of the Pit Starts now also comes from Phil no longer narrating the intro? I did notice that TAR26 began the annoying trend of showing off a team interaction before the first clue is ripped open instead of Phil narrating the history of the city. The Amazing Race is a show about the WORLD. I legit do not understand why petty interactions have replaced narration about the Pit Start country. Smh.

>  In visiting Asia, please visit other nations as well. We’ve been getting China, India, Indonesia, Japan… What about Israel, South Korea, The Philippines, Maldives, Cambodia? Stop visiting overused countries back to back or consecutively in Asia.

I would argue that it's more or less the LEG DESIGN and the EPISODE that matters and not the overused countries in Asia. Look at the early seasons. Indian legs would always be fun, Indian legs would always bring out the best or worst in teams and would be season highlights (compare that to now where an Indian leg is Delivery vs. Delivery Detours and Balloon Roadblocks). I would say that the leg design and the episode matters the most rather than the location. I for one, would love a China visit in an area yet untouched. (Shenzhen on 28 was good!)

> Oceania, I am waiting for this one to pop up. Where's Australia, New Zealand, French Polynesia, Fiji and Vanuatu. I still cannot fathom, why this continent, Oceania is not visited considering it is one of the safest continents and there are loads to be done there.

We had NZ and French Polynesia on 22 but yeah, we need another visit to these places. Can you believe it has been more than TEN SEASONS since Australia? Crazy.

> Central America / Caribbean, I still don't get why this has not been visited that much. Costa Rica, The Bahamas, Nicaragua, Jamaica, Panama. Hopefully, we will see Cuba soon.

Apparently it's American-Cuba ties that may prevent visits.

>   Season 22, Season 23, Season 25 had a really great cast very diverse in my opinion. Season 27 also has a great cast but they did not develop them all properly. The only let down for Season 25’s cast for me was Keith & Whitney. Absolutely bland and boring. They both had their share in Survivor, so don’t steal another teams spot on the Amazing Race. Stop casting Big Brother, Survivor reality crossovers to join the Race. They have had their share of fame. They are obviously stealing a valuable spot to those who have applied.. Kudos for casting Bethany Hamilton in Season 25, a real inspiration for those with disabilities.

I really don't see how these contestants have had their 'share of fame' but you call Bethany a standout and she has had a MOVIE based on her? I have no problem with crossovers, myself, but I find it weird that you call them to "stop casting these crossovers" when we have had only SIX (Alison/Donny, Rob/Amber, Ethan/Jenna, Keith/Whitney, Brendon/Rachel, Jordan/Jeff) out of 289 teams and two of them didn't even make it past two legs.

>   For the premiere episode, it would be good if it was at least 2 hours or an hour and a half to give us the opportunity to at least get to know the teams more and make it not too rushed on the editing because you are fitting 11 teams in one episode and that is hard. Everyone must be memorable even for a 1st boot. It would also be good to have at least 2 Roadblocks and 2 Detours on the 1st leg.

I agree that premieres need to be longer, but I would also say that it's all about a matter of leg design. Look at the TAR28 premiere. It had one very fun (but unbalanced) night Detour and a pretty difficult Roadblock. If the episode's first obnoxious ten minutes were cut out, it would easily be the best premiere since 17 AND it was only 45 minutes.

With that in mind, look at the TAR26 premiere. Despite it being 90 minutes long, it still sucked because there was only one task and it was stretched out to 90 minutes. Additionally, the TAR6 premiere is an early-age boring example as well. Forty minutes of driving to an HoO and then one Detour stretched out over 50 minutes (the TAR4 one is also just eh). I would say that the best example of a 90 minute premiere is TAR17. Despite it being 90 minutes with only ONE Roadblock, it was still good due to the cryptic clue, coracle task, ladder task, and iconic watermelon RB. Ultimately, I would argue that we don't necessarily need 2 RBs and DTs, more ARIs and a major task that's actually difficult would suffice.

>   Have us fans get to help develop the Race for the benefit of the show as well

I want this but the closest we'll probably get is Design Challenge. We have had winners have tasks make it on the show, with the second Peru leg on TAR26 almost being EXACTLY like DC V runner-up RSF's leg! (Go to Chan Chan (the Detour location for one of the options) + her/his Detour was Surfing (the actual leg's RB) vs. Marinara (an ACTUAL Detour option for the leg!)  :hearts:

>   Where exactly are the harder finales? we need this back Recent finales have been bland and boring.

I would argue that we have actually been having better finales though? The 25-27 finales are nowhere near as awful as the 18/19/20/22/23/24 finales and the 27 finale is actually pretty top-tier due to the memory task overload? The 26 finale was also crammed with tasks, something very unusual with modern-day finales.

If you read this all thank you and I agree with a lot of your points with some reservations :)
« Last Edit: June 06, 2016, 02:18:20 AM by gamerfan09 »

Offline SamualDude

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2016, 02:06:51 AM »
I would argue that we have actually been having better finales though? The 25-27 finales are nowhere near as awful as the 18/19/20/21/23/24 finales and the 27 finale is actually pretty top-tier due to the memory task overload? The 26 finale was also crammed with tasks, something very unusual with modern-day finales.

I would agree completely! With the exception of the 21 finale, I think 22 would be best suited on your list instead!
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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2016, 02:17:17 AM »
I would argue that we have actually been having better finales though? The 25-27 finales are nowhere near as awful as the 18/19/20/21/23/24 finales and the 27 finale is actually pretty top-tier due to the memory task overload? The 26 finale was also crammed with tasks, something very unusual with modern-day finales.

I would agree completely! With the exception of the 21 finale, I think 22 would be best suited on your list instead!

I typoed sorry :lol:

Offline tarflyonthewall

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2016, 04:46:15 AM »
There's two issues with the finale: the formulaic leg design (arrive, first-come-first-served heights task, cryptic clue, task vaguely related to the local culture of whatever city you're in, memory task, finish line; occasionally the local culture task comes before the cryptic clue or there's a second one in place of the memory task, but that's about it) and the producers thinking that tasks that take the same amount of time for everybody regardless of skill level are exciting or likely to result in a close finish. That's not the case at all. The heights task that usually kicks off the leg often splits the teams beyond the point of catching up, and taxis getting lost do it the rest of the time. Other legs are less formulaic, but still have the same issue in terms of task design, to which I say: You don't actually need a footrace at the end of the episode to make an episode enjoyable or exciting. Look at TAR3: how many of those legs actually end with a tense finish? Portugal and Ho Chi Minh City do but they're both because of penalties, and Grindelwald does but it's a NEL that everyone knows is a NEL, and the final leg does but it's The Final Leg. Every other episode is edited as a blowout (even though Gina/Sylvia were only actually three minutes behind LOL), and the season is better for it. It lets you feel like every team's race has actually ended rather than randomly being cut off at some arbitrary point when they happened to find themselves in last place.

I also think the twists are actually detrimental to the show. Nobody's going to tune in because you're promising a Double Express Pass or a Save in the first episode, and the people who do tune in are going to be annoyed by the entire first episode being All About The Twist. And that's if you're lucky and we're getting one of those kinds of twists instead of a themed cast that results in everybody helping each other because of pre-season alliances (24, 28) or makes everyone in the cast blur together because they're all basically the same team (26, 28). The best twist in the show's history, and pretty much the only one that hasn't actively made the race worse, is changing up the leg structure by putting the Road Block before the Detour in some TAR4 episodes after the Detour had always been first throughout the first three seasons. It was simple, it was surprising, it worked well with the concept of the show, and you didn't even need to explain it beyond a random 'this doesn't normally happen' from the first team to arrive at Le Mans for that first Road Block. It's just a thing that happened that threw the teams off balance for a bit, but it didn't damage the show in any way.

I absolutely agree that the editing's been janky for a while, and it's only getting worse. Yes, it's a race, but the entire point of the show is that it's a marathon and not twelve sprints. Marathon runners slow down and get second winds all the time, and the show used to be the same. TAR1's second Thailand leg is an exercise in filler, and it's followed by the brilliant Beijing episode. The Chiang Mai NEL is followed by both the Hong Kong leg and then the incredible Sydney episode. TAR3's two worst episodes are unquestionably the Austria and Singapore episodes, and the episodes that follow them - Grindelwald and Ho Chi Minh City - are both strong, strong contenders for TAR's greatest episode ever. Venice follows the dull TAR4 premiere. Marseilles is followed by Amsterdam, and then by Mumbai. The forgettable Kota Kinabalu island filler leg is followed by Sepilok. St Petersburg gets the tone right but is otherwise kind of awful, and then we get the joys of Cairo. TAR5 later also gives us Dubai followed by I'M PACKIN' IT and Rotorua followed by MY OX IS BROKEN. And so on. I get that the show is beholden to the #12Legs21Days hashtag Phil keeps trying to make happen, but stop trying to make #12Legs21Days happen. It's not going to happen. Nobody cares if you take 21 or 22 or 23 or even 29 days to run the race - indeed, it would actually help if it was a bit longer and you used the extra time to wear the teams down even more. To put that timing into context, 21 days in, TAR1 isn't even in Thailand yet, and in TAR6 it's not even enough time for noted bottom-feeders Adam and Rebecca to actually fall into last place (they aren't ever Last For Real until the lighthouse in Sri Lanka, on Day 23).

I disagree, however, with the idea that Africa is cheap. It's actually prohibitively expensive in terms of filming permits and airfares, especially when you need connecting flights between African cities, and when you add safety issues and infrastructure, pretty much the only viable countries we haven't already seen since TAR17 are South Africa (how has it been twenty-two seasons since the last visit?) and Lesotho. Like I have no doubt that if Egypt and Tunisia was safe we'd have been back, and if Swaziland had a commercial airport we'd have been there too. But that's not the world we live in, sadly.

We definitely need a better variety of countries. It's great that the show has finally cut back on India (and crazy that the stereotype still persists given it's only turned up three times in the last fourteen seasons), but it's absurd that every season seems to visit Holland or one of the German-speaking countries when we've still only had a combined total of one leg in the entirety of the former Yugoslavia. Especially when those legs are invariably underwhelming - it's not a coincidence that the only two seasons since TAR13 to skip that part of the world, TAR17 and TAR25, are the only two that are widely considered modern classics. The best legs are the ones that feel fresh, and it's almost impossible to get that feeling when you're racing through Amsterdam or Bavaria or Bangkok for the fifth time. Ironically, the fact that so much of the TAR6 route hasn't been revisited (Iceland, Senegal, Hungary, and Ethiopia are all one-visit countries, and we've also never been back to either southern Norway or Corsica, with a long delay before Sri Lanka's only other visit) is the key reason it's aged so well when most of the other early seasons haven't. Meanwhile, every blatant attempt to recreate the magic of TAR1 comes off as phony AND ruins TAR1's legacy. I think we all agree that TAR is probably closer to finishing than it is to starting, but: stop looking back, and start looking forward.

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #14 on: June 06, 2016, 05:14:55 AM »
TAR3's two worst episodes are unquestionably the Austria and Singapore episodes, and the episodes that follow them - Grindelwald and Ho Chi Minh City - are both strong, strong contenders for TAR's greatest episode ever.

Those two would count as TAR3's 'weakest episodes' and yet they contain:

Austria:
-Flo sabotaging Andre & Damon
-Teri & Ian randomly leaping to first place on the way to Germany
-Flo melting down over staying in a cheaper hotel
-Flo bitching about being last only to then realize that they were FIRST after the Fast Forward
-Derek & Drew losing the clue, making Teri then find it and THEN abandoning Teri causing Teri to fly into a rage and THEN the former suffer a navigational breakdown
-Ken & Gerard's absolutely hilarious car breakdown and the resulting positivity and hilarity they have over the situation DESPITE BEING NEARLY IN LAST PLACE

Singapore:
-Flo sitting with Drew on the plane instead of Zach
-Flo bitching about the YMCA and then this resulting in Flo & Drew being closer in the hotel room
-Teri & Ian's PAPER UNDERWEAR
-That hilarious Teri & Ian moment immediately followed by them sniping at each other after seeing John Vito & Jill arrive at the Roadblock
-Zach finally getting tired of Flo's BS and consequently also bitching at her and getting LOUD
-The resulting event above causing them and Ken/Gerard's temporary alliance to falter over directions but both end up in a footrace for 2nd place

And I can go on and on. TAR3 <3333333333333333

It's probably the most perfect season of anything ever?

Other than that, great points tarflyonthewall! I also do notice that somehow the Race loves to go back to old locations (TAR27 and 28 are guilty of this) but they fail to make it anywhere as decent as the original (all the Switchbacks failing at recreating magic).


Offline TARUSAFan

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #15 on: June 06, 2016, 09:40:40 AM »
First of all, thanks TARUSAFan for the essay, however I want to talk about some of your points for the sake of friendly discussion. :)

•   Twists

>      Season 26’s “Dating” themed season was atrocious on all levels. It is as bad as Season 24. None of the Blind-Dating teams even sparked a relationship. Also, there were too many double legs on the same country: Japan, Thailand, Namibia, Peru which some of the tasks were underwhelming. The only redeemable part was Hayley & Blair, a visit to Monaco and return visits to Peru and Namibia.

I really do not get TAR26's hate when TAR6 almost literally did the same thing by having its near entire end-game have nothing but dating couples. No way is it as awful as 24.

I did not like it, nothing jumped at me for that Season other than what I've mentioned, Hayley & Blair, a visit to Monaco and return visits to Peru and Namibia. I would also include Jeff & Lyda, because they were an older couple that had a potential to be fun but got screwed over by U-Turn and Dancing Detour but it was a meh season for me. The tasks were just simple. Go to Japan to eat noodles infront of an electric fan feeding your partner, running around Monaco looking for flowers and chocolates while your partner sits back and relaxes on the yacht. Is this a travelling Season of The Bachelor. Phil was even putting on a different face or forced acting in Season 26. For me it is just as bad as Season 24, the casts were a majority of a boring and forgettable ones, the ultra-easy tasks and the overuse of double legs in 1 country. I also forgot to mention, they forgot to cast an all-female team, a lesbian team.

>   Please announce each team placements when they arrive at the mat. We do not see these nowadays, even the reactions of the teams. Also, the pitstart where the team who won the last leg reads the clue for the next destination. We need to see that again Moreover, Phil narrates it now. We do not get to see teams interact and they capitalize on 2 teams just like Season 28’s Blair + Blodie = Blodie. Atrocious, they could have used that time to explore the city more + team interactions. Don’t give the viewers something forced.

Agreed, but wouldn't you say that part of the awkwardness of the Pit Starts now also comes from Phil no longer narrating the intro? I did notice that TAR26 began the annoying trend of showing off a team interaction before the first clue is ripped open instead of Phil narrating the history of the city. The Amazing Race is a show about the WORLD. I legit do not understand why petty interactions have replaced narration about the Pit Start country. Smh.


Season 27's Leg 2 started off with Justin & Diana interacting with teams on either Copacabana or Ipanema Beach. Milking, "oh we were on the 1st flight and we did not get to meet all the teams." Then starts off with Phil narrating a brief description of Brazil and Argentina. Tanner & Josh did not even get to read their clue. Yes, this is a travel show and many people aren't really that fully capable to travel as it is costly, the least they could do is let us get some information of these countries. 5 seconds of Blair talking about Brodie in Georgia is 5 seconds that should have been used elsewhere to add to see more of Georgia.


>  In visiting Asia, please visit other nations as well. We’ve been getting China, India, Indonesia, Japan… What about Israel, South Korea, The Philippines, Maldives, Cambodia? Stop visiting overused countries back to back or consecutively in Asia.

I would argue that it's more or less the LEG DESIGN and the EPISODE that matters and not the overused countries in Asia. Look at the early seasons. Indian legs would always be fun, Indian legs would always bring out the best or worst in teams and would be season highlights (compare that to now where an Indian leg is Delivery vs. Delivery Detours and Balloon Roadblocks). I would say that the leg design and the episode matters the most rather than the location. I for one, would love a China visit in an area yet untouched. (Shenzhen on 28 was good!)

I do not mind if the leg design is proper, what I do not like is spamming it consecutively back to back or straight 3 consecutive visits. It would be good to have intervals so as to not exhaust the country too much. There must be proper balance.

> Oceania, I am waiting for this one to pop up. Where's Australia, New Zealand, French Polynesia, Fiji and Vanuatu. I still cannot fathom, why this continent, Oceania is not visited considering it is one of the safest continents and there are loads to be done there.

We had NZ and French Polynesia on 22 but yeah, we need another visit to these places. Can you believe it has been more than TEN SEASONS since Australia? Crazy.

> Central America / Caribbean, I still don't get why this has not been visited that much. Costa Rica, The Bahamas, Nicaragua, Jamaica, Panama. Hopefully, we will see Cuba soon.

Apparently it's American-Cuba ties that may prevent visits.

It might not be in the next seasons but I'm optimistic they will soon. The fact that Fast and the Furious 8 recently filmed there last May is history in the making and Vin Diesel himself told that the Cubans were ecstatic about Americans filming there.



>   Season 22, Season 23, Season 25 had a really great cast very diverse in my opinion. Season 27 also has a great cast but they did not develop them all properly. The only let down for Season 25’s cast for me was Keith & Whitney. Absolutely bland and boring. They both had their share in Survivor, so don’t steal another teams spot on the Amazing Race. Stop casting Big Brother, Survivor reality crossovers to join the Race. They have had their share of fame. They are obviously stealing a valuable spot to those who have applied.. Kudos for casting Bethany Hamilton in Season 25, a real inspiration for those with disabilities.

I really don't see how these contestants have had their 'share of fame' but you call Bethany a standout and she has had a MOVIE based on her? I have no problem with crossovers, myself, but I find it weird that you call them to "stop casting these crossovers" when we have had only SIX (Alison/Donny, Rob/Amber, Ethan/Jenna, Keith/Whitney, Brendon/Rachel, Jordan/Jeff) out of 289 teams and two of them didn't even make it past two legs.

Bethany Hamilton got her fame for her life experience about the near-death experience that almost cost her life and how she overcame that incident, live a normal life and be a champion surfer again, not because she let herself get bitten by a shark to make her a movie and be popular. It was her faith, determination and perseverance is what got her to this stage. People with disabilities like Bethany Hamilton who has one arm and still complete 12 legs is an inspiration. We do not normally see them on the Race that is why I root for them and I thank the casting producers for doing so as they give hope for other people who share the same disability. Look at Charla & Mirna, Amy & Daniel, Margie & Luke, Peter & Sarah and Alex & Adam. Ones in bold, yeah they are popular, these people have disabilities but I would rather prefer these people over some other people who came from other reality series. They were just 6 teams combined Survivor and Big Brother that participated on the Race but they are for me in my honest opinion taking another spot of another hopeful who wants to join the Race, that's 6 hopefuls that could be bringing more to the show than them. There are so much more greater personalities than them who weren't picked. Besides, most of these crossovers were bland, boring and not memorable. Only Rob & Amber stood out. Ethan & Jenna had a million dollars already why join the Race. They have won Survivor. Bottomline, reality crossovers to TAR aren't my cup of tea

>   For the premiere episode, it would be good if it was at least 2 hours or an hour and a half to give us the opportunity to at least get to know the teams more and make it not too rushed on the editing because you are fitting 11 teams in one episode and that is hard. Everyone must be memorable even for a 1st boot. It would also be good to have at least 2 Roadblocks and 2 Detours on the 1st leg.

I agree that premieres need to be longer, but I would also say that it's all about a matter of leg design. Look at the TAR28 premiere. It had one very fun (but unbalanced) night Detour and a pretty difficult Roadblock. If the episode's first obnoxious ten minutes were cut out, it would easily be the best premiere since 17 AND it was only 45 minutes.

With that in mind, look at the TAR26 premiere. Despite it being 90 minutes long, it still sucked because there was only one task and it was stretched out to 90 minutes. Additionally, the TAR6 premiere is an early-age boring example as well. Forty minutes of driving to an HoO and then one Detour stretched out over 50 minutes (the TAR4 one is also just eh). I would say that the best example of a 90 minute premiere is TAR17. Despite it being 90 minutes with only ONE Roadblock, it was still good due to the cryptic clue, coracle task, ladder task, and iconic watermelon RB. Ultimately, I would argue that we don't necessarily need 2 RBs and DTs, more ARIs and a major task that's actually difficult would suffice.

I'll stay firm with what I've said. We need longer premieres. But with better tasks, better leg design, better editing that everyone gets a decent shot.


>   Have us fans get to help develop the Race for the benefit of the show as well

I want this but the closest we'll probably get is Design Challenge. We have had winners have tasks make it on the show, with the second Peru leg on TAR26 almost being EXACTLY like DC V runner-up RSF's leg! (Go to Chan Chan (the Detour location for one of the options) + her/his Detour was Surfing (the actual leg's RB) vs. Marinara (an ACTUAL Detour option for the leg!)  :hearts:

Now that is good but that is just half of the iceberg. We need to complete it, the editing, the casts and other Race elements. I have read all those Design challenges and I'm 100% impressed

>   Where exactly are the harder finales? we need this back Recent finales have been bland and boring.

I would argue that we have actually been having better finales though? The 25-27 finales are nowhere near as awful as the 18/19/20/22/23/24 finales and the 27 finale is actually pretty top-tier due to the memory task overload? The 26 finale was also crammed with tasks, something very unusual with modern-day finales.

tarflyonthewall stated that recent finales have been formulaic, this is what I am referring to. It has been bland and boring because it has become predictable. Even if they encounter a few mishaps. You'll already see who's got the advantage who's at a disadvantage. Look at Season 28's Finale. Too many heights-related tasks. Dana & Matt just cruised to it to a point Sheri & Cole could not even catch up. While those Seasons you have mentioned, the Finales were awful. I will agree but for me, Season 25-27's Finales were halfway for me. I only felt the suspense on the last task before the Finish Line. The Final Roadblock, the containers for Season 25 or the chairs in Season 27, for me the suspense must be felt throughout the episode. Why would you even put the Finish Line near the Final Roadblock? It becomes all the more predictable.

If you read this all thank you and I agree with a lot of your points with some reservations :)

I read everything. Here you go gamer, I actually enjoyed doing this discussion.  :)
« Last Edit: June 06, 2016, 10:38:20 AM by TARUSAFan »

Offline Bookworm

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #16 on: June 06, 2016, 05:55:43 PM »
I actually think TAR26 was top tier? I mean, the Japan legs sucked ass, but the Phuket Leg was strong and fun, if only racers actually tried to get The Save. The focus on Patong Beach nightlife was fun imo. Bangkok was a cool leg, with a transportation Detour reminding me of older TAR seasons. Germany was good; while it may be over visited as of late, the Bavaria Leg was one of the best in a while. France/Monaco was fun to watch, despite the Leg design not being perfect. Teams racing in suits and dresses is so <3333. Then, Namibia had two stellar EPISODES, despite the design for Leg 8 being decent at best. The Leg 8 RB is hilarious, as teams expect to be skydiving and then they had to run through the desert :lol: Amsterdam wasn't a great Leg, but the teams were great. Peru had two AMAZING Legs. I loved all of Otuzco and Trujillo, I just wish the Legs had a little bit more content design-wise. The KOR Finale was great again, and it had a full final leg. It was almost as good as TAR25 imo, and it would've been better if Hayley & Blair won. In the recent, crappier, seasons, TAR26 (& especially 25) is (are) great.
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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #17 on: June 06, 2016, 06:30:29 PM »
I actually think TAR26 was top tier? I mean, the Japan legs sucked ass, but the Phuket Leg was strong and fun, if only racers actually tried to get The Save. The focus on Patong Beach nightlife was fun imo. Bangkok was a cool leg, with a transportation Detour reminding me of older TAR seasons. Germany was good; while it may be over visited as of late, the Bavaria Leg was one of the best in a while. France/Monaco was fun to watch, despite the Leg design not being perfect. Teams racing in suits and dresses is so <3333. Then, Namibia had two stellar EPISODES, despite the design for Leg 8 being decent at best. The Leg 8 RB is hilarious, as teams expect to be skydiving and then they had to run through the desert :lol: Amsterdam wasn't a great Leg, but the teams were great. Peru had two AMAZING Legs. I loved all of Otuzco and Trujillo, I just wish the Legs had a little bit more content design-wise. The KOR Finale was great again, and it had a full final leg. It was almost as good as TAR25 imo, and it would've been better if Hayley & Blair won. In the recent, crappier, seasons, TAR26 (& especially 25) is (are) great.

Yeah, 26 is probably in my Top 10 :lol: :C

Offline ianthebalance

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #18 on: June 06, 2016, 08:30:20 PM »
I liked season 26, though it could of been even better without the blind date twist and Phil always asking if teams were In love.

"Are you guys in love?"
"No"
.....
"Are you guys in love now?"
"NO!"
"Please..."

Offline Jimmer

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #19 on: June 06, 2016, 08:48:53 PM »
The only comment I really have that I felt like really worked when it comes to editing was when the first 10 minutes of editing was actually formulaic and repetitive. I always liked it and thought it was really good.

The repetitive and formulaic editing that I actually like goes something like this:

First you have Phil introducing the departure city and identifying a certain location was the nth pit stop/start of the nth leg. While it was standard and repetitive, I feel like many people liked it and actually showcases the world and culture

Then you have the first team reading the clue and say where they are flying next, and Phil cuts in to explain the location and culture and fun facts.

After this you come back to the team getting in a taxi and having a confessional or comments while riding on the way to the airport.

Then you flash to the 2nd team to depart reading the clue (even partially works), the proceeds to a shot in the taxi and a confessional.

This repeats until all teams have departed.

I does not need to be completely repetitive, as you can intersperse earlier teams arriving at the airport and booking tickets on their flight. (Also I love flight drama, and even if it makes up 15 minutes of the episode, I think it is worth it and also shows the actual travel aspect of the race, something that is now not seen as often as I liked before)

With multiple teams reading the clue, you are able to get all parts of the clue (including revealing to audiences how much money teams receive, something I feel needs to comeback. I feel like this is something fans always like to see and it is a shame that it is only shown in a handful of legs).

Additionally, with this editing, you give a chance to show all teams and helps to balance out air time since everyone gets one confessional at the beginning.

Offline Mandoli

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #20 on: June 08, 2016, 01:04:54 PM »
A lot of you (okay, all of you) hit the points I wanted to make.

I want a season where there's no semi-famous or famous teams/people. No bringing on cast members of Survivor/Big Brother. There's a major need for a season full of diversity. I never cared about the blind date season. I never cared about the internet famous season. Bring back teams who are diehard fans.

I think a footrace to the finish line is kind of boring. What season was it when the finish line was at LVMS and the final task was a Roadblock with skydiving? That's the kind of adventure that TAR should include. Make it somewhat difficult to find the finish line. I'm not saying that every season should end on a Roadblock, but make it so that teams are using different methods of transportation to make it to the end. Skydiving was the BEST FINISH EVER. (Sorry for all caps.)

Also - and I'm going to be in the minority here - I kind of liked the family season, and I think it should be brought back. Fortunately for you guys, I don't want another four-person team kind of season. I want blood relations here. No married couples. Just straight parent/child, siblings, cousins... You name it, I want it. Just no more dating couples and mashed up teams.

I agree with the idea that a lot of previously-used countries need to be brought back. Seeing the same countries visited multiple times in the span of X seasons is like beating a dead horse with a stick. Stick a fork in China. It's overdone.

Offline TARUSAFan

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #21 on: June 09, 2016, 12:33:38 AM »
A lot of you (okay, all of you) hit the points I wanted to make.

I want a season where there's no semi-famous or famous teams/people. No bringing on cast members of Survivor/Big Brother. There's a major need for a season full of diversity. I never cared about the blind date season. I never cared about the internet famous season. Bring back teams who are diehard fans.

I think a footrace to the finish line is kind of boring. What season was it when the finish line was at LVMS and the final task was a Roadblock with skydiving? That's the kind of adventure that TAR should include. Make it somewhat difficult to find the finish line. I'm not saying that every season should end on a Roadblock, but make it so that teams are using different methods of transportation to make it to the end. Skydiving was the BEST FINISH EVER. (Sorry for all caps.)

Also - and I'm going to be in the minority here - I kind of liked the family season, and I think it should be brought back. Fortunately for you guys, I don't want another four-person team kind of season. I want blood relations here. No married couples. Just straight parent/child, siblings, cousins... You name it, I want it. Just no more dating couples and mashed up teams.

I agree with the idea that a lot of previously-used countries need to be brought back. Seeing the same countries visited multiple times in the span of X seasons is like beating a dead horse with a stick. Stick a fork in China. It's overdone.


Very well said, we share the same points. I like the idea of that Finale that you are talking about, no footrace just different mode of transport to get to the Finish Line. That skydiving race to the Finish Line in Las Vegas Motor Speedway was from Season 24 (All-Stars). The Family Edition would be better off as a two-team race which I'd like to see rather than the 4-team race with kids. Well we can't avoid them casting a semi-famous or famous teams but they could at least tone it down, maybe at least 1 or 2 teams only. I know there are semi-famous/famous teams who are also diehard fans of the Race but don't put them all in the same season. I can make exceptions to some semi-famous/famous teams casted but absolutely a big NO to Big Brother/Survivor casts, there are many Americans out there who have greater personalities and who could bring more to the Race than them.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2016, 12:43:16 AM by TARUSAFan »

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #22 on: June 09, 2016, 01:49:10 AM »
I'm sorry, but I find it preposterous that TAR24's absolutely horrible "skydive finish wherein it was actually first-come first-served" is actually being considered as a good idea.

Same with the BB/Survivor people, I really do not see the problem?

Brendon & Rachel were the only saving graces of 24 considering how terrible the outcome became.
Ethan & Jenna were too irrelevant yet at least fought to stay in, instead of Jennifer (of Justin & Jennifer) and had way more personality than Laurence & Zac or Jeremy & Sandy.
Alison & Donny provided one of the most memorable eliminations ever considering their giant blowup and walk-away on the mat (which would be replicated 21 seasons later with Bergen & Kurt).
Keith & Whitney were generally just there, but their elimination episode was probably one of the best of the season and they caused the leg 1 mass-quit which is a memorable moment on TAR25?
Jordan & Jeff were generally fun too on a season that was an utter cesspool of entertainment that I can't believe anyone actually enjoyed it (TAR16).
Rob & Amber either made or break TAR7 for you. But you can't deny that they helped bring strategy to the game of The Amazing Race as well as have one of the best eliminations ever on TAR11.

I would rather have these people on and potentially bring viewers with their fans (considering CBS-linked Reality TV is more adaptive to viewers, than say, 'social media stars') than absolutely boring people.

I could not care less how they stuntcast, since it's inevitable. Just bring us good TV for casting and I'll be happy.

Offline TARUSAFan

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #23 on: June 09, 2016, 05:45:53 AM »
    Going back to tarflyonthewall’s comment that recent Finale legs have been formulaic. Yes, I agree, it has been predictable, you clearly could predict who’s going to win. Now, Mandoli stated that: “Make it somewhat difficult to find the finish line. I'm not saying that every season should end on a Roadblock, but make it so that teams are using different methods of transportation to make it to the end.” I honestly liked the idea of Mandoli for the sole fact it is different and dynamic. In a way, by making it harder to get the finish line by adding an additional task, let say an obstacle course is an added suspense and more of surprises. For me, I saw what Mandoli wants to point out. She wants an additional task apart from the Detour and the Roadblock to get to the Finish Line, something more climatic, harder and to level out the competition, which for me is welcome.  That TAR 24 skydiving to the finish line that you mention that is preposterous is for me and Mandoli’s a good idea. For me that skydiving task had the potential and it could have been better if both team members did it. TAR attempted to do something different once in their Finale and I appreciate that, I look at that perspective. They just need to fix it or take inspiration from it for future seasons.

     An additional task before the Pit Stop that could be an inspiration for Finales would include Season 22’s French Polynesia Leg 1, where teams had to construct this v’aa canoe and row to the Pit Stop, that 3-way suspense between Max & Katie, Caroline & Jennifer and Matt & Daniel was suspenseful to watch or TAR Australia 2 where they had to create a wooden raft and row to get to the Pit Stop in the Philippines, it was Lucy & Emilia vs Paul & Steve. Even from Season 26, that Mud Run Obstacle on the 1st leg was actually good. In my opinion, the moving pit stop (boat) and getting there via rowing a canoe in Season 28’s Indonesia 1 leg where Zach & Rachel were eliminated was a breath of fresh air. It was different, it was unique. In a nutshell, as a suggestion, TAR should include an additional task apart from the Roadblock/Detour before the Finish Line. It depends on how TAR will develop it. Putting the Finish Line within the vicinity of the Final Roadblock is really predictable and somehow boring just like Season 27 & Season 28. As Brooke & Claire have mentioned: "They don't call it the Amazing Race for nothin!"

     Going back to the whole BB/Survivor, I am firm with what I've said and I've mentioned it in one of my replies above, none of them jumped at me with the exception of Rob & Amber, where they brought their unorthodox gameplay, smartness and in a way some dirty gameplay to a whole new level. The others were really “meh”. For me in my opinion, based on their overall performance, character, personality and their presence in the legs they've competed in, they did not bring much to the table. Most of them were either irrelevant or not memorable or boring. Keith & Whitney (I only noticed them on the premiere episode and when Shelley & Nici blew a fuse on them which led to their elimination), Ethan & Jenna were just practically there. Rachel was absolutely annoying who acted like a kid in Season 20, Season 24 gave her a likable side without Rachel crying like a big baby but that is where it stops for me. Alison (of Alison & Donny) was just having a meltdown with the Walking Dogs Detour in Buenos Aires and a high-stakes relationship with Donny. Going back to what I’ve said, there are many Americans out there who have auditioned but were never picked, for all I know, they could be either average Americans or semi-famous/famous people who have greater personalities and who have a more interesting and intriguing background that could have taken their spot and who could bring more to the Race than them. I can't obviously stop TAR from casting BB/Survivor teams, who am I to do so, but at least they could get better ones from BB/Survivor if they were to cast ones for a specific season. Some of them that they casted before are just a waste of a spot on TAR. The only positives I could draw from them is only them bringing in more viewers which are their fans which you've mentioned. Just my 2 cents.     
« Last Edit: June 09, 2016, 07:08:15 AM by TARUSAFan »

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #24 on: June 09, 2016, 09:58:37 AM »
For those who think races to the Finish Line aren't a good idea, just watch this:

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/XC_PVQDWq-A" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/XC_PVQDWq-A</a>

Still one of the best finishes of the show EVER. TAR8 also came close with the Bransen and Linz footrace to the Finish Line.

I would argue that Finale legs having the Finish Line close to the final tasks are producers trying to recreate magic... but excruciatingly fail (TAR28) or poorly implement it (TAR27 imagine if Justin & Diana finishing the final task so close to Kelsey & Joey. The latter could have still won and the former would still fall to an obnoxious crying finish but it would be much more suspenseful. Instead, the latter was just shown running alone while the former bitched and moaned. It could easily have been edited to be suspenseful, but the editors took the easy way out and phoned it in.).

And I also think TAR18 with the bike race was an attempt to do a cool "task to the finish" ending, but since Kisha & Jen seemed so far ahead, not even clever editing could dismiss the fact that the Globes lost lol.


Offline Mandoli

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #25 on: June 09, 2016, 12:06:57 PM »
    Going back to tarflyonthewall’s comment that recent Finale legs have been formulaic. Yes, I agree, it has been predictable, you clearly could predict who’s going to win. Now, Mandoli stated that: “Make it somewhat difficult to find the finish line. I'm not saying that every season should end on a Roadblock, but make it so that teams are using different methods of transportation to make it to the end.” I honestly liked the idea of Mandoli for the sole fact it is different and dynamic. In a way, by making it harder to get the finish line by adding an additional task, let say an obstacle course is an added suspense and more of surprises. For me, I saw what Mandoli wants to point out. She wants an additional task apart from the Detour and the Roadblock to get to the Finish Line, something more climatic, harder and to level out the competition, which for me is welcome.  That TAR 24 skydiving to the finish line that you mention that is preposterous is for me and Mandoli’s a good idea. For me that skydiving task had the potential and it could have been better if both team members did it. TAR attempted to do something different once in their Finale and I appreciate that, I look at that perspective. They just need to fix it or take inspiration from it for future seasons.     

Took the words right out of my mouth. The skydiving finish didn't HAVE to end on a Roadblock, but the concept of having teams find their finish line location from the air to the Strip was pretty cool. It made it harder for teams to find their where they were going.

Offline Platrium

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #26 on: June 11, 2016, 02:19:26 AM »
What would you want to tell CBS/WRP if you could?  :tup:

Some are too long to read, and I don't feel like typing every rant I have in mind right now, so I'll just list the important ones IMO.

1. Lessen gimmick seasons. It's okay to have them once in 5 to 10 seasons, but overflowing them in a short period of time is a bad idea. I may or may not like the new twists, but if TAR thinks it's good, too much of a good thing is bad.
2. Cast unfit people and older people. Their chances of winning may be small, but their presence and actions on the show may be fun to watch. Besides, they're really easy to root for.
3. Continue visiting new countries, but also consider countries that have not been visited for several seasons.
4. Have the fast forward appear at least twice each season. I would wish for about 4 times if possible, but at least 2 will do. I miss seeing teams fight for a fast forward, then when at least one of them loses, the fast forward could have cost that team the race. I think fast forwards still have a significance to legs that have them.
5. Self-driving has been a crucial part of the race, so please have this more often. Recent example: Matt & Dana weren't good with self-navigation in Dubai, so imagine having more legs that require self-driving. The game would've played and differently! I like Matt & Dana winning though, but things would've been different if the crucial skill of self-navigation appeared more often.
6. The yield was not a poor idea in my opinion, so having this back could make some legs better.
7. Please have more NELs in earlier legs, so the other teams (who will be eliminated early) could still be recognized and remembered some way or another.
8. TAR is aware that there are fans of the show outside the US, so I really hope secret scenes and missed episodes can be more accessible to those living outside the US. I really don't understand the point of the geoblock.
9. Editing. This has been elaborated really well several times by other people in the forum.
10. 60 minutes, or rather 43 minutes, is not enough in my opinion. Can we please have 90-minute episodes, inclusive of commercials, for some or all episodes?

Offline Lmh1988

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #27 on: June 24, 2016, 07:09:14 AM »
First off, I'll say that any Amazing Race is still far superior to any show on television in my opinion, but I do agree that there are improvements to be made.

1. I may be in the minority, and I know it won't happen due to budget cuts, but I really wish the Fast Forwards were still on every leg. I really like the strategic aspect of when to use your Fast Forward and giving a team that may have made one mistake the chance to get back in the Race. Plus, it's always exciting watching teams compete for the Fast Forward, and set up some pretty spectacular comebacks when they didn't win it (Kelly & Jon coming back to pass Millie & Chuck in the end? Amazing.)

2. Casting for sure. I don't have a problem with pretty people being cast, I just want more of a variety and more teams that actually really seem like they want to be there for the competition and the Race and not just to get on TV and try for their shot at fame.

3. More tasks and make them harder! One thing I thought the earlier seasons really nailed is that the tasks were more difficult and really gave teams at the back the chance to get to the Roadblock/Detours, perform well, and pass struggling teams ahead of them. I don't feel like the budget is an excuse on this one because the international versions I think are really running like the early seasons of TAR (task wise and casting wise) and there is a lot of movement in the rankings, and we know they are working on much smaller budgets. I would be okay with having a few legs in the U.S. each season if it meant that we could get more/harder tasks.

I'm in the middle of watching the second season of TAR Canada right now, and the tasks and the casting have been phenomenal in my opinion. I really think U.S. TAR should take some pointers from the international versions.


Offline Cocoa

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #28 on: June 24, 2016, 09:17:52 AM »
I just want a more serious Phil Keoghan :( Oh the shivers hearing him narrate the "previously on"

Offline BourkieBoy

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #29 on: August 02, 2016, 03:04:04 AM »
Here's my suggestions for an 'Amazing' (sorry for the pun  :gaah:) season 30:

1. Cast older parents or grandparents. (I'm sick and tired of seeing ONLY middle-aged people)
2. VISIT AUSTRALIA (Biased, I know, but we are VERY unused Down Under)
3. Fast Forward's on at least 4 legs (Productin costs are just to much to have on every leg, hey?)
4. Don't visit overused countries like India, Japan and China (more countries in North America would be GREAT!)
5. Harder RoadBlocks and Detours.
6. Rebirth of the Intersection.
7. Have at least 90 minute episodes (including commercials)
8. Have more Start/Finish Lines in the 'biggest city in the world'

If these suggestions are taken into conservation The Amazing Race will have more viewers and therefore, more seasons and more excitement!

Let me know what you think:
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Offline RachelLeVega

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #30 on: August 02, 2016, 06:32:37 PM »
I really enjoy reading all of these suggestions to upgrade the show! I definitely agree with more age and fitness diversity. Like what Debra & Steve said in season 4, "We're fat, we're 40, but we are fun!" And when will see another grandmother (since Jody & Shannon) or grandfather (since Nic & Don)?

One of the concepts that dragged me into the show in the first place is its fast-paced editing, suspenseful music, and clear character development like in seasons 10 to 17. I really hope the program style will return to this era of editing because not only were the teams most memorable, it actually felt like I was watching a competitive race instead of happy, smiley travelers.

Also, I believe tasks need to make sense enough for Phil to add a little culturally relevant commentary about the task after the 1st place team first unveils the next clue. Otherwise, I will feel like the task is only a filler. Example: TAR28, why change oil in Armenia when it could be done just the same elsewhere (have you forgotten Teri & Ian's Dieselgate situation)?
<3 Family, friends, food, freedom... FULFILLED <3
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"My mama told me how to shake it. It just never turned into butter before!" ~Kym (from Kym & Alli on season 25, leg 6)

Offline Best Loser

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #31 on: August 02, 2016, 07:46:50 PM »
I feel like the sense of adventure of exploring the world and the relationships between and within teams have been pushed aside in favor of focusing on the tasks themselves and forcing drama.


I personally think it'd be possible to make a leg without any tasks whatsoever, with clues - actual clues - taking teams place to place. That would be enough to A) show off the locations and B) have teams struggle to figure it out.

Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #32 on: November 22, 2016, 11:00:57 PM »
Just looking forward to more TAR!! Couldn't resist this post in this thread.

I have loved every minute!
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Offline RachelLeVega

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #33 on: November 23, 2016, 07:35:16 AM »
Just looking forward to more TAR!! Couldn't resist this post in this thread.

I have loved every minute!
Congrats on posting quintuple fours! :conf:

Maybe TAR is revamping itself with the editing process and we don't know it yet.
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Offline Platrium

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #34 on: November 26, 2016, 01:30:27 AM »
Just looking forward to more TAR!! Couldn't resist this post in this thread.

I have loved every minute!
Congrats on posting quintuple fours! :conf:

Maybe TAR is revamping itself with the editing process and we don't know it yet.

That was amazing! :nut:

Offline RachelLeVega

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2016, 06:14:30 PM »
For those who think races to the Finish Line aren't a good idea, just watch this:

<a href="https://www.youtube.com/v/XC_PVQDWq-A" target="_blank" class="new_win">https://www.youtube.com/v/XC_PVQDWq-A</a>

Still one of the best finishes of the show EVER. TAR8 also came close with the Bransen and Linz footrace to the Finish Line.

I would argue that Finale legs having the Finish Line close to the final tasks are producers trying to recreate magic... but excruciatingly fail (TAR28) or poorly implement it (TAR27 imagine if Justin & Diana finishing the final task so close to Kelsey & Joey. The latter could have still won and the former would still fall to an obnoxious crying finish but it would be much more suspenseful. Instead, the latter was just shown running alone while the former bitched and moaned. It could easily have been edited to be suspenseful, but the editors took the easy way out and phoned it in.).

And I also think TAR18 with the bike race was an attempt to do a cool "task to the finish" ending, but since Kisha & Jen seemed so far ahead, not even clever editing could dismiss the fact that the Globes lost lol.
Don't forget about season 9 wanting to create a similar footrace outcome as the Family Edition. The final Roadblock seems easy, to us, but no joke to teams with a not-so-esoteric knowledge of flags. I also miss the finales where they edit it as to seem that anyone could claim the million like in All-Stars with Eric & Danielle dreading the red lights, Dustin & Kandice lucking out on rows of green lights, and Charla & Mirna casually "catching up" by finding the SF Botanical Garden on a map and guiding their taxi driver almost effortlessly. The amount of suspense doubled for that particular race, and I was on the edge of my seats crying, laughing, and cheering sometimes all at the same time. :yess:
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TAR QUOTE OF THE MONTH April 2017
"My mama told me how to shake it. It just never turned into butter before!" ~Kym (from Kym & Alli on season 25, leg 6)

Offline rafael02

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #36 on: December 17, 2016, 10:15:02 PM »
Wow just saw this thread....

I think this recent seasons has lost their tense, i don't why if it because budget or TAR will near end or any problems...

But, i think TAR should learn from other franchise such TARAus, TARCAN, or even TARA... They have simple editing and tasks that yet still enjoyed... And yes also stellar casts in their respective seasons.... In other way, i think TAR must go back in time when simple become stellar....

I loved how TAR 25, 26, and 28 had become salvation for TAR, but it is not enough... And they were presented on friday night, which had worst rating ever on TAR... I think it will be make sense if they move to sunday night... It will be much good...

FF task need to be risen back, so far we had none in 26, 1 but unused in 27, and none again in 28... And more diverse task rather than play on linear high task... For RB, detour or ARI, more sense task and cultural relevant....

Premiere and finale are the essence... Premiere is to atract new fans, and finale to conclude what it has been, i think they need to improve both and make it balance... We never seen how premiere and finale are both great in recent season and that it made it uninteresring...
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Offline BourkieBoy

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Re: TAR: Where are we Going? Suggestions for the Future!
« Reply #37 on: December 17, 2016, 11:09:29 PM »
I agree with you on every point here rafael.

I just don't know why we aren't airing on Sunday nights, if we went well then. Is it because other shows air then, or is it because of something else...

Fast forwards have just died down since TAR20. Hardly any now! Time to pick them back up!

Finally, they also need to make sure that the premiere and finale are interesting! We need start and finish lines in Portland, Oregon, Ohio etc.

Let's hope TAR29 and 30 take these points into account!
'Nice Garry'

Offline Chameleon777

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Problems with The Amazing Race and The Amazing Race Canada
« Reply #38 on: February 14, 2017, 11:07:16 AM »
As much as I love The Amazing Race, it is not what it once was and I find myself trying to find the DVD's of older seasons so I can enjoy what it once was because what it is now is not so enjoyable. In short, all The Amazing Race is doing now is casting skinny yuppies mostly from California or glamourous states and forgetting about everyone else.

Sadly, The Amazing Race Canada is following suit and a lot of good applicants are getting ignored because they aren't skinny, wealthy, well-known, or naturally perfect. The Canadian version had the BodyBreak television celebrities in the very first season, Team Canada hockey players on the 2nd season, a Big Brother showmance couple on the 4th season, and also a beauty queen with her father on the 4th season. Joel and Ashley, however, were a very nice team to have BECAUSE they represented diversity being from the First Nations! There might have been some sort of celebrities on the 3rd season, but casting yuppies/celebrities exclusively totally detracts from the purpose of The Amazing Race and endless celebrities make me not want to watch The Amazing Race Canada.

The Amazing Race U.S. is just as bad with doing that and it takes away the thrill of watching ordinary people do extraordinary things. I liked Season 1 of The Amazing Race immensely because there was diversity in the cast and everyone seemed to genuinely enjoy themselves. However, it just seems so mechanical now and I see the Canadian version not lasting as long as its American counterpart if it doesn't have a look at how to make things better. Going to places outside Canada is interesting, but there needs to be more diversity within the casting spectrum like there was in Season 1 and there needs to be more teams of ordinary people who have the belief they can do something extraordinary.

Those in charge of The Amazing Race are so very afraid to cast ordinary people who are diverse simply because they don't believe that ordinary people bring value to television, but they are so very wrong with that theory. That, I believe, is part of the reason why the American version of The Amazing Race is having issue with their ratings; they have stopped casting diverse body types and developed a bit of a stereotype in terms of what the best casting choices are. Exposing a diverse spectrum of ordinary people to such a situation and simply watching how they handle themselves is all part of the thrill! I've been a fan of the show since the beginning, but it is not as good as it used to be and that's very sad. As a show grows older, it should become better and more full of life, but The Amazing Race is slowly beginning to die.

 

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