Author Topic: TAR 20 Transport  (Read 42032 times)

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Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #150 on: March 28, 2012, 07:55:19 AM »
TARFANSurvivor,

Of course Peach is right. There is no need to do this again, since post #59 has what you ask for. Here are the 3 most probable flight possibilities (although there are dozens of low probability alternatives):

GYD NBO on maybe Dec. 8, 2011

QR975 GYD DOH 1800 1945 connecting QR534 2030 0610+1

TK333 GYD IST 1330 1430    connecting TK607 1835 0210+1

EK256 GYD DXB 1845 2135 connecting KQ3110235+1 0645+1   


Here is something new, a connection on to Kilimanjaro airport in Arusha Tanzania:

Dec. 9 NBO JRO PW724 0800 0900
« Last Edit: March 28, 2012, 08:25:09 AM by apskip »

Offline TARFansurvivor

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #151 on: March 28, 2012, 10:41:42 AM »
TARFANSurvivor,

Of course Peach is right. There is no need to do this again, since post #59 has what you ask for. Here are the 3 most probable flight possibilities (although there are dozens of low probability alternatives):

GYD NBO on maybe Dec. 8, 2011

QR975 GYD DOH 1800 1945 connecting QR534 2030 0610+1

TK333 GYD IST 1330 1430    connecting TK607 1835 0210+1

EK256 GYD DXB 1845 2135 connecting KQ3110235+1 0645+1   


Here is something new, a connection on to Kilimanjaro airport in Arusha Tanzania:

Dec. 9 NBO JRO PW724 0800 0900
Thanks! So Baku connection Istanbul connection Nairobie and then Arusha????
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Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #152 on: March 28, 2012, 09:44:42 PM »
I guess I should have been clearer. Flights from Nairobi to Kilimanjaro (Arusha) or Kilimanjaro to Nairobi are all speculation. They may or may not happen. It is not a huge distance from Nairobi to Arusha, specifically 144 miles so buses or cars could easily be the source of transportation in either direction. What is clear based on schedules is that from outside Africa, flights will come in to Nairobi and from Africa to India the cross-Indian Ocean leg will be a flight from Nairobi.

Offline TARFansurvivor

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #153 on: March 29, 2012, 09:49:24 AM »
I guess I should have been clearer. Flights from Nairobi to Kilimanjaro (Arusha) or Kilimanjaro to Nairobi are all speculation. They may or may not happen. It is not a huge distance from Nairobi to Arusha, specifically 144 miles so buses or cars could easily be the source of transportation in either direction. What is clear based on schedules is that from outside Africa, flights will come in to Nairobi and from Africa to India the cross-Indian Ocean leg will be a flight from Nairobi.

Thanks!!!!
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Offline DrRox

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #154 on: April 01, 2012, 02:41:21 AM »
If they are flying from Nairobi to Kerala, South India, then they could just as well fly into Calicut International Airport in Karipur, Kerala as either Kochi or Trivandrum. Kozhikode (formerly Calicut) is known as the city of spices and is a textile center. It has many arrival flights from all over the Middle East, Kuwait, Oman, Saudia Arabia and all the emirates. Seems the Arabs like to hire the people of S India for their worker bees. It also has domestic connections to Mumbai and Delhi if they go somewhere else first in India. As far as exiting South India…..I think they would have to leave by either Kochi or Trivandrum. Both those airports have connections to either Kuala Lumpur or Singapore and both those airports have connections direct to Osaka.
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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #155 on: April 01, 2012, 07:40:26 AM »
What day did teams check into Baku? Is it December 8?

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #156 on: April 01, 2012, 01:16:08 PM »
If they are flying from Nairobi to Kerala, South India, then they could just as well fly into Calicut International Airport in Karipur, Kerala as either Kochi or Trivandrum. Kozhikode (formerly Calicut) is known as the city of spices and is a textile center. It has many arrival flights from all over the Middle East, Kuwait, Oman, Saudia Arabia and all the emirates. Seems the Arabs like to hire the people of S India for their worker bees. It also has domestic connections to Mumbai and Delhi if they go somewhere else first in India. As far as exiting South India…..I think they would have to leave by either Kochi or Trivandrum. Both those airports have connections to either Kuala Lumpur or Singapore and both those airports have connections direct to Osaka.

Dr. Rox,

The use of Kozhikode airport is possible, but unlikely. The reason is only one flight per day in from Mumbai and one flight per day out to Mumbai. The population in the metropolitan areas of Kochi, Thiruvananthapuram and Kozhikode is all at 2 million or slightly less. Thiruvananthapuram has the largest city population, followed by Kochi and by Kozhikode. So, bottom line, the probability of using either Thiruvananthapuram or Kochi for at least one leg is my conclusion.

It is only 113 miles from Thiruvananthapuram to Kochi and vice-versa, so that makes the possibility of 2 Kerala legs in those two cities reasonable. It would be possible to take the AR20 to Bangalore or Chennai or Goa or Mumbai or Delhi, but I don't think world Race Productions has done that. Kochi is next to Ernakulam, a major rail center for southern India.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2012, 01:30:03 PM by apskip »

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #157 on: April 01, 2012, 10:24:58 PM »
I want to look ahead to leg 11 transportation where teams will have to fly from probably either Kochi or Trivandrum airports to Kansai Airprot in Osaka. It will take a minimum of 2 connections and nearly 24 hours to make the shortest possible trip. I have looked at routes through Chennai and through Mumbai and I strongly prefer those connecting in Mumbai. I have also looked at a second connection in Kuala Lumpur, Bangkok and Hong Kong, which I believe have the best possibilities for decent schedules. It turns out that the optimal second flight is Mumbai to Bangkok and the third is Bangkok to Osaka. Here are the specifics:

16 Dec. TRV BOM AI668 0938 1134 
or COK BOM AI682 0720 0905  or   COK BOM 9W2112 0850 1043

16 Dec. BOM BKK 9W68 1315 1847

16 Dec. BKK KIX TG622 2324 0636+1
« Last Edit: April 21, 2012, 03:14:57 PM by apskip »

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #158 on: April 01, 2012, 10:49:06 PM »
Here is one other, probably unlikely option. The teams could fly to Tokyo, which has a lot more connections, and then travel by train to Osaka or Kyoto. The bullet trains are super fast (it only takes a few hours).

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #159 on: April 02, 2012, 09:04:32 AM »
Paldog,

Although that is a good idea in theory (only one air connection in Mumbai is needed to NH944 BOM NRT), the actual timing of that flight makes it unlikely (as you have stated alternative). Any flight from TRV or COK into Bombay will do, but NH922 timing is 2118 0825+1. Add at least 4 hours for disembarking and taking fast trains to Osaka.  You have to have a morning flight from TRV or COK to get the optimal result, as most Amazing Race legs start between midnight and noon.

I do have a flight alternative to what you propose, but it suffers from the same drawback. Here it is (second connection is in Seoul):

COK BOM G8452 1918 2103
BOM ICN KE656 0300+1 1415
ICN KIX KE725 1520+1 1740+1
« Last Edit: April 02, 2012, 09:09:32 AM by apskip »


Offline TARFansurvivor

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #160 on: April 03, 2012, 10:24:12 AM »
Here is one other, probably unlikely option. The teams could fly to Tokyo, which has a lot more connections, and then travel by train to Osaka or Kyoto. The bullet trains are super fast (it only takes a few hours).

Yes i hope it is true the Racers taken trains in Japan!!!! :yess: :yess: :yess: :yess:
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Offline walkingpneumonia

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #161 on: April 04, 2012, 05:53:09 PM »
In the latest preview from CBS - I can see that the teams are at the Kenya airways transfer desk in Nairobi around 6:35 (there are 2 wall clocks visible).
Of course I can't tell if its AM or PM.
What does that tell us about flights?
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Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #162 on: April 04, 2012, 07:01:09 PM »
walkingpneumonia,

Precisely what I would expect from this post above:

GYD NBO on maybe Dec. 8, 2011

QR975 GYD DOH 1800 1945 connecting QR534 2030 0610+1
or
EK256 GYD DXB 1845 2135 connecting KQ3110235+1 0645+1   

Note: I have excluded the flight combination arriving at 0210+1.

From NBO, teams could take a car, take a bus or fly to get to Arusha about 120 miles away.

Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #163 on: April 05, 2012, 12:25:36 AM »
They Fly. In the new promo they are transiting in Nairobi...
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Offline walkingpneumonia

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #164 on: April 05, 2012, 10:07:23 AM »

Here is something new, a connection on to Kilimanjaro airport in Arusha Tanzania:

Dec. 9 NBO JRO PW724 0800 0900

This flight works for me - its a code share with Kenya Airways (6724 ) so it would make sense that the teams are at the Kenya Airways transfer desk.

There are some later flights if teams don't make the first one:

JRO Kilimanjaro PW 724 Precision Air Services 08:00 AT7    
JRO Kilimanjaro 5H 451 Fly540                 08:15 BE1    
JRO Kilimanjaro PW 722 Precision Air Services 10:45 AT7    
 
From there to here, and here to there,
funny things are everywhere


Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #165 on: April 09, 2012, 11:18:17 AM »
I am trying to reconcile the information presented in this telecast to real-time flight information for Dec. 8, 2012. Previous information assumed Dec. 7 but if you count out the days of the race that cannot be true. I cannot quite get the first one to match but it's only a half hour off and has no impact on when teams reach Nairobi.

From Baku there are two flights to Istanbul possible (note - I also checked Dubai, Doha, Muscat and Cairo but none had any flights):

TK337 0800 0915
J2 75  1000 1038

Both streams of teams meet up and got on the same Dec. 8 flight from Istanbul to Nairobi:

TK607 1843 0223+1

So then they wait around for about 5.5 hours for the first Precision Air flight to Arusha, PW724 0800+1 0900+1.

Offline DrRox

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #166 on: April 09, 2012, 04:45:18 PM »
I am trying to reconcile the information presented in this telecast to real-time flight information for Dec. 8, 2012. Previous information assumed Dec. 7 but if you count out the days of the race that cannot be true. I cannot quite get the first one to match but it's only a half hour off and has no impact on when teams reach Nairobi.

From Baku there are two flights to Istanbul possible (note - I also checked Dubai, Doha, Muscat and Cairo but none had any flights):

TK337 0800 0915
J2 75  1000 1038

Both streams of teams meet up and got on the same Dec. 8 flight from Istanbul to Nairobi:

TK607 1843 0223+1

So then they wait around for about 5.5 hours for the first Precision Air flight to Arusha, PW724 0800+1 0900+1.

The flight you have teams on from Nairobi to Kilimanjaro International, PW724, is a daylight flight. How do you reconcile that with the episode when teams land at Kilimanjaor in the dark, take a taxi from there to the Arusha airport, sign in for charter flights from Arusha to Ngorogoro, still in the dark. Then they have an HoO waiting for charter flights at 930, 945, 1000?

There is/was no 830 departure to anywhere from Baku on Dec 8. If you noticed the travel agent computer screens, TPTB had them all fogged up so we couldnt see. I think they were trying to fool up. I think a much more likely itinerary was:

GYD to DXB  J2 11    1005-12:39 pm
DXB to NBO  EK721   305 pm to 715 pm
NBO to JRO   PW728  1000 pm to 1100 pm

This fits more into what was seen on the televised episode.
« Last Edit: April 23, 2012, 01:47:52 PM by DrRox »
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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #167 on: April 12, 2012, 06:55:52 PM »
I expect that teams will be leaving on December 12 after an extended pit stop in between the 2 Tanzania legs. Here are logical flight connections to go from Kilimanjaro Airport to Nairobi to Mumbai to Trivandrum:

JRO NBO PW723 0600 0655  or  PW721 0915 0935  or  5H452 1415 1500

connecting to:

NBO BOM KQ202 1730 0406+1

connecting to:

BOM COK 9W2111 0535+1 0738+1  or  SG131 0830 1015  or a number of later flights

In order to reach the first flight out of Kilimanjaro International Airport, teams will probably have to take a taxi for 100 miles (just like AR5)
from the Kibaone area on the west side overlooking Lake Manyara. That will have to be done early enough to reach JRO by about 8am or 1pm, depending on which flight is possible. It [probably rules out the 6am flight for teams.

 
   
« Last Edit: April 12, 2012, 07:03:38 PM by apskip »

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #168 on: April 13, 2012, 08:56:39 PM »
There are a lot of trains on the Eranakulam (either the in-city station or the suburban Junction station) to Trivandrum Central station. Here are the ones that ran on Wednesday Dec. 14, 2011:

0055 0515
1725 2055
0755 1250
1050 1540
0625 1120
0945 1435
0255 0725
2125 0125
2252 0335
1625 2210
0500 0940
1257 1750
0550 1005
0130 0605
1415 1840
0002 0505
0440 1015
1010 1505
0235 0715
1620 2110
0345 0910
1330 1830
1350 1855

So that's 23 separate trains running at the average length of about 4.5 hours.

Bus will be an option for this 130 mile trip, but Indian National Railways will have the edge.   

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #169 on: April 14, 2012, 03:59:53 PM »
I thought I would run find available schedules on buses Kochi to Thivurananthapuram. However, almost all the potential websites provide train schedules only. Although there is bus service, they won't reveal schedules. The only one I discovered was this:

depart Thrissur 2110
arrive Kochi         unidentified (but since it's 40 miles and late evening it should arrive soon after 2200)
arrive Alappuzha  unidentified
arrive Kollam       unidentified
arrive Thiruvananthapuram 0310+1

The road distance Kochi to Thiruvanananthapuram is only 177 km (108 miles).

There is an alternate report that the distance is 205 to 225km (sources vary) and buses take 5 hours, which is what is shown above. It appears that buses move about as slowly as trains do in Kerala.

The India Rail Ministry has approved, but it will be a long time before high speed rail is available in this corridor. when that happens and the first phase of this proposed project is completed travel between Kochi and Thiruvananthapuram will be reduced to 45 minutes.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2012, 04:11:58 PM by apskip »

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #170 on: April 21, 2012, 03:21:28 PM »
KOCHI to OSAKA FLIGHTS on Dec. 16, 2011

COK BOM AI682 0720 0905  or  9W2112 0850 1143

16 Dec. BOM BKK 9W68 1315 1847

16 Dec. BKK KIX TG622 2324 0636+1

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #171 on: April 22, 2012, 10:27:14 PM »
I have reconsidered which route and flights the first 4 teams took. The arrival 45 minutes before 605am bothered me but I had to work extra hard to come up with a route and actual flight departures/arrivals that were closer. Here is what I believe they did through Muscat:

Dec. 12 PW486 JRO DAR 0740 0900

Dec. 12 WY716 DAR MCT 1645 2310 2323

Dec. 13 WY201 MCT COK 0150+1 0645+1

The problem with this is what I expect Vanessa/Ralph did:

Dec. 12 JRO NBO PW723 0600 0635

Dec. 12 NBO DOH QR539 1359 1856
 
Dec. 12 9W555 DOH COK 2320 0605+1

I think that the other teams actually connected through somewhere in the Middle East to get to Doha in time for the same 9W555 because teams appeared to arrive at the same time in Kochi. This would not be possible if they connected through Dubai (earlier arrival) or through Muscat (later arrival) or Mumbai (quite a bit later arrival).

« Last Edit: April 23, 2012, 02:23:24 PM by apskip »

Offline DrRox

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #172 on: April 23, 2012, 02:10:44 PM »
Dec 9. Pit Stop for Leg 7 at Ngorogoro Crater Simba Camp @ around noon and ~18 pit stop till sunup on Dec 10.
Dec 10 Start Leg 8 @ Ngorogoro Crater tour and finish Leg in Mto Wa Mbu the same day. I see no evidence of an extended pit stop for sightseeing. The sightseeing was covered in the Ngorogoro Crater tour. I believe the length of the pit stops were determined by filming in HD during the daytime. So pit stop at the Simba camp was around 18 hours and the pit stop after Lake Manyaro pit stop was 26-28 hours to give teams time to book flights to India

After re-watching the start of Episode 9 multiple times, I have an alternate theory on how teams got from the orchard pit stop in Mto Wa Mbu, Tanzania to Cochin, India.

Bopper/Mark finished Leg 8 very close to midday Dec 10. When B/M and R/D approach the mat, there is almost no shadow. When Ralph/Vanessa and Nary/Jamie arrive, the shadows are very pronounced/elongated, late afternoon Dec  10. I believe that teams were transported to Arusha from Mto Wa Mbu in daylight on Dec 10.  The Pit Start on Leg 9 was in darkness on evening of Dec 11, in a fairly well lighted town. The taxis were parked near a curb. What I am attempting to say, is that the Pit Stop Release for Leg 9 was not in Mto Wa Mbu, but in Arusha on the evening of Dec 11. Plus if you look at the special credits posted by Slowhatch here   http://forum.realityfanforum.com/index.php/topic,26988.100.html



You will see that the Mt. Meru Hotel was listed in the credits. It is in Arusha and is an 8 story luxury hotel. The décor of the hotel rooms match the room that the doctor examines Bopper’s knee in. So I think that the pit release for Bopper/Mark was at 9:06 pm on Dec11, 2011 in Arusha. With the other teams following. They are directed to go to Rickshaw Travel (also in Arusha) to get tickets for flights to Cochin, India. Seems like another example where Production got a local travel agent to remain open after hours. The first four teams all book the same itinerary, through Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, arriving in Cochin @ 6:05 am on Dec 13. They will fly out of Kilimanjaro International at 7:40 am on Dec 12.  When Ralph/Vanessa arrive at the travel agency, all the other teams have left…either to the airport or back to the hotel. It is about 30 miles from Arusha to Kilimanjaro International. Ralph/Vanessa actually get on the 6:00 am flight to Nairobi. From the short conversation, it appeared that some seats had just opened up, according to the travel agent. One would think that if seats were available earlier, the other teams would have booked them. Reminds me of the finale flights in TAR5 in a way. Last team in to the airport, got the first flights out.

So leaving JRO on Dec 12, 2011
Ralph/Vanessa:
1)  PW723   6:00 am - 7:00 am    JRO>NBO (Kilimanjaro-Nairobi)
2)  EK720   4:35 pm - 10:22 pm  NBO>DXB (Nairobi-Dubai)
3)  IX434   11:55 pm - 5:20+1 am    DXB>COK (Dubai-Cochin)

Other 4 teams JRO-COK
1) PW435   7:40 am - 9:00 am  JRO>DAR  (Kilimanjaro>Dar es Salaam)
2) QR535  11:55 am - 7:10pm  DAR>DOH (Dar es Salaam>Doha)
3) 9W555  11:20 pm-6:05+1 am DOH>COK (Doha>Cochin)

The arrivals in Cochin are pretty close to what was shown in the episode, with R/V already in the terminal, looking for bus schedules, when the other 4 teams arrive.

I just cannot see that any team flew through Mumbai, since the first Mumbai-Cochin flight didn’t arrive till 7:25 am, by which time all teams were gone from the Cochin airport.
Matthew 7:15

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #173 on: April 23, 2012, 05:25:02 PM »
Dr. Rox,

I congratulate you on good detective work getting teams to Arusha but it hardly matters given that they started at 906pm to 131am whether they started in Mto Wa Mbu or in Arusha.

On your assertion that the teams in DarEsSalaam flew from DAR to Doha, here is some information that devastates your assertion:

QR 535    Qatar Airways    13:59    18:56 This is for a flight from Nairobi to Doha. The only flight from DAR to DOH was QR545 1756 2332. On arrival, they were too late to connect to 9W555, which was the flight clearly taken by Vanessa and Ralph.

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Re: TAR 20 Transport
« Reply #174 on: April 23, 2012, 05:53:38 PM »
apskip,

You certainly have the right to believe what you wish. Personally, I like to believe in the facts.


(QR) Qatar Airways 535
(DAR) Dar Es Salaam, TZ to (NBO) Nairobi, KE
Status: Landed - On-time
Scheduled Departure:  11:55 AM - Tue 13-Dec-2011
Actual Departure:11:38 AM - Tue 13-Dec-2011
Scheduled Arrival:  1:15 PM - Tue 13-Dec-2011
Actual Arrival:12:56 PM - Tue 13-Dec-2011

 

(QR) Qatar Airways 535
(NBO) Nairobi, KE to (DOH) Doha, QA
Status: Landed - On-time
Scheduled Departure: 2:15 PM - Tue 13-Dec-2011
Actual Departure:  1:59 PM - Tue 13-Dec-2011 
Scheduled Arrival:  7:10 PM - Tue 13-Dec-2011
Actual Arrival:7:13 PM - Tue 13-Dec-2011


Tis a pity you didn't just research the flight number instead of just the route......you would have found what I orginally posted above. Oh well







 





 
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