Topic: What do you think about the Fast Forward?

[David]

Long ago, it was once posted in the forum that the Fast Forward could be avoided so as to exchange it for other similar tasks (something like and Express Pass for all the teams and more options).

BUT; I really like this awesome clue! It makes you be very competitive through all the leg, and only if you're the first team, you may attempt for it.

Also, there is a new thing coming up... The Fast Forward blessing. Nat & Kat; Dan & Jordan; Meghan & Cheyne; Nick & Starr; Ken & Tina (2nd placers!); Nick & Don (3rd place for the ¿oldest contestant ever?); Uchnna & Joyce; BJ & Tyler; Tyler & James... All of them won the Fast Forward (most of the times, their race's ONLY Fast Forward) and ended up in the F3; one of them as 3rd placers; one of them as 2nd Placers, and the rest of them as WINNERS.

Is there any MAGIC involved with the Fast Forward that gives you extra powers for the rest of the entire race??

Feel free to comment your impressions, if you want to!  

[Prophet]

I don't really like the FF that much but I am glad that they are using less of them and making them slightly harder. I understand that if I was on the Race I would want them b/c it gives you a break.

As far as magic I think the FF team has reached the final a lot b/c in order to do the FF you must be a frontrunner and reach the cluebox first. Also you must be a strong team to finish it.

[Zack.]

Firstly, you can add BJ/Tyler and Tyler/James to that list of FF winners turned winner-winners.

Secondly:

Is there any MAGIC involved with the Fast Forward that gives you extra powers for the rest of the entire race??

I think there are multiple benefits to a Fast Forward victory.

The first is everything associated with being able to quickly finish a leg.

If you have an injury, it gives less time for it to be aggravated (Steve/Dave in TAR 4). Similarly, if the conditions in the area are brutal, it allows you the chance to quickly find better accomodations (Meghan/Cheyne in Dubai, the unaired FF in Phuket  in TAR 14).

Some of them allow you not to deal with difficult navigation (Ken/Tina, Nicolas/Donald, Nat/Kat) and/or save money (Dan/Jordan not taxiing all around Singapore).

The second is, I think, the motivational benefits. For a team that has been dragging, it can give them the needed push to continue onward (Dan/Jordan, Meghan/Cheyne, Uchenna/Joyce, BJ/Tyler). A frontrunning team can use it to further gain steam (Ken/Tina, Nick/Starr). I think it gives the confidence in one's racing ability and team (especially since the FF doesn't guarantee a first place finish) and, given how hard killer fatigue hits, I think that's probably the most important reason FF winners are fairly successful in the rest of the race.

[Prophet]

Firstly, you can add BJ/Tyler and Tyler/James to that list of FF winners turned winner-winners.

Secondly:

Is there any MAGIC involved with the Fast Forward that gives you extra powers for the rest of the entire race??

I think there are multiple benefits to a Fast Forward victory.

The first is everything associated with being able to quickly finish a leg.

If you have an injury, it gives less time for it to be aggravated (Steve/Dave in TAR 4). Similarly, if the conditions in the area are brutal, it allows you the chance to quickly find better accomodations (Meghan/Cheyne in Dubai, the unaired FF in Phuket  in TAR 14).

Some of them allow you not to deal with difficult navigation (Ken/Tina, Nicolas/Donald, Nat/Kat) and/or save money (Dan/Jordan not taxiing all around Singapore).

The second is, I think, the motivational benefits. For a team that has been dragging, it can give them the needed push to continue onward (Dan/Jordan, Meghan/Cheyne, Uchenna/Joyce, BJ/Tyler). A frontrunning team can use it to further gain steam (Ken/Tina, Nick/Starr). I think it gives the confidence in one's racing ability and team (especially since the FF doesn't guarantee a first place finish) and, given how hard killer fatigue hits, I think that's probably the most important reason FF winners are fairly successful in the rest of the race.

Well said, Zack!

[Mug Costanza]

I was thinking about posting a very similar topic, David! I'm glad I'm not alone in my thinking!

I've always loved the idea of the Fast Forward. I love the competitive advantage a team gets from winning it, but what it's been lacking in recent years is strategy. The point of the FF when it debuted was that teams had to decide when it was most advantageous to use it, but that becomes null and void when there's only one FF per season, as there has been in the last 4 seasons. For it to really regain the magic it had in those early seasons, I think there need to be at least 3 per season. Otherwise, whoever gets that clue first is just going to go for it, regardless of whether they need it or not.

[Caelestor]

The FF is an amazing tool, WHEN IT APPEARS ON EVERY LEG. That hasn't been the case since Season 5 due to costs (another reason why the Speedbump may be retired soon). I really wish every team could get an Express Pass at the start of the race, it has potential to be a good replacement for the FF.

Similarly, the Yield (and other related markers) had potential when it appeared on every leg.

The intersection makes no sense to me whatsoever.

[Dånooky]

The FF is an amazing tool, WHEN IT APPEARS ON EVERY LEG. That hasn't been the case since Season 5 due to costs (another reason why the Speedbump may be retired soon). I really wish every team could get an Express Pass at the start of the race, it has potential to be a good replacement for the FF.

Similarly, the Yield (and other related markers) had potential when it appeared on every leg.

The intersection makes no sense to me whatsoever.

The intersection makes sense if you want to avoid a team getting too far ahead as it forces bunching and teams have the extra difficulty of getting along with the others.

[Prophet]

The FF is an amazing tool, WHEN IT APPEARS ON EVERY LEG. That hasn't been the case since Season 5 due to costs (another reason why the Speedbump may be retired soon). I really wish every team could get an Express Pass at the start of the race, it has potential to be a good replacement for the FF.

Similarly, the Yield (and other related markers) had potential when it appeared on every leg.

The intersection makes no sense to me whatsoever.

The intersection makes sense if you want to avoid a team getting too far ahead as it forces bunching and teams have the extra difficulty of getting along with the others.

Very true Dånooky!

I don't think the FF should be on every leg at all or the Yield/Uturn. But that's just my opinion.

[WalterC]

The point of the FF when it debuted was that teams had to decide when it was most advantageous to use it

That is what I loved about it, having teams deciding whether to use it now or save for it for later. It worked so much better when it was in every leg, and added more interest to the race.

Either it should be in every leg, or none at all.

[Sandra1991]

Either it should be in every leg, or none at all.

That's my opinion too.
When there was a Fast Forward on every leg, teams had to really think twice before using it. They had to strategize if that leg was the best time for using their only Fast Forward.
Now with only a Fast Forward every season, there's no strategizing around it... basically the first team that gets the clue goes for it.

[Prophet]

Either it should be in every leg, or none at all.

That's my opinion too.
When there was a Fast Forward on every leg, teams had to really think twice before using it. They had to strategize if that leg was the best time for using their only Fast Forward.
Now with only a Fast Forward every season, there's no strategizing around it... basically the first team that gets the clue goes for it.

I agree with you, Sandra, that the first team that gets to the Fast Forward clue gets it.

[AmazingRace]

I think it gives the confidence in one's racing ability and team (especially since the FF doesn't guarantee a first place finish)

  The epic moment!  

[Jobby]

As i've said before, i hope there's at least 2 Fast Forward on the race. And the Fast Forward task be sort of like a luck based task or endurance/dare task placed after an HoH, where everybody gets a chance to go for it and the luckiest team/most daring team will win the Fast Forward. With that, probably nobody will think that the FF is a random lame task where the first team who arrives gets it. And that if it is an endurance/dare task, the team has to actually EARN it and not just complete some lame task and win the FF.

Also, you cannot have the U-TURN every leg. The producers WANT the teams to use the U-TURN, that was why the Blind U-TURN (without using Courtesy Of photo, so that a team can use the U-TURN again later on) was first imposed, and now - the DOUBLE U-TURN. If you put the U-TURN on every leg, there's going to be less drama involved when it comes to a time when a team actually decides to use the U-TURN.

[Zack.]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

[Jobby]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

[Caelestor]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

Add another task! 

[DavidJunior]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

Have it be only one EP can be used on a particular task

i.e. once team A uses it on the leg's detour, teams B, C, D, E, and F can no longer use it for that task

[Jobby]

While ideally I'd like the FF to be on every leg up until the F5 elimination, I can see several instances of it not being used. What I'd suggest instead is 3-5 FFs (depending on the number of legs that season; since we're going with 12 I'd say 4 FFs). In this way it becomes less of a 'first person to see it goes for it' and more strategic.

That being said, I think giving everyone an Express Pass would be best of all. It's less inherently broken plus it allows for more strategy within the leg itself without an increase in cost.

Imagine if 5 teams uses the EP to bypass a task when there are only 6 teams remaining. How would that add up to the drama you see on TV? No tasks performed... imagine.

Have it be only one EP can be used on a particular task

i.e. once team A uses it on the leg's detour, teams B, C, D, E, and F can no longer use it for that task

That could work too. But that would mean EXTRA work for the producers you know? They need to constantly keep track of the team's movement and such. I still think one express pass is good.

[methylc]

I would rather they make the number of Fast Forwards unknown (but definitely more than one or two, maybe 4, 5, 6 or more in the entire race, variable between different races) and teams will take their chances whether they should take it or wait until the next one (IF there is another one, especially if they will not know whether there will be another opportunity again).

[Mug Costanza]

I think giving every team an Express Pass might be overkill, but I think more than one team should get one. Consider something to this extent: on the first leg, have an overnight rest on a beach. On this beach there is a marked area where 5 Express Passes are buried. Once teams arrive and sign in, they can start digging, and each team can only claim one. Teams that have raced better and arrived at the overnight rest are first will deservedly have more time to look for it and have a greater chance of finding them. This way, more than one team has one, and it's not just a hand-out; teams still have to compete for them.

(And since this is still a thread about the Fast Forward, I'll just say again that there should be at least more than 2 Fast Forwards on every leg to make it competetive and strategic again.)

[Prophet]

I think giving every team an Express Pass might be overkill, but I think more than one team should get one. Consider something to this extent: on the first leg, have an overnight rest on a beach. On this beach there is a marked area where 5 Express Passes are buried. Once teams arrive and sign in, they can start digging, and each team can only claim one. Teams that have raced better and arrived at the overnight rest are first will deservedly have more time to look for it and have a greater chance of finding them. This way, more than one team has one, and it's not just a hand-out; teams still have to compete for them.

I like this idea. However I don't think the way they did it on TAR17 is a handout, you have to win the leg after all.

[Rogue]

I think giving every team an Express Pass might be overkill, but I think more than one team should get one. Consider something to this extent: on the first leg, have an overnight rest on a beach. On this beach there is a marked area where 5 Express Passes are buried. Once teams arrive and sign in, they can start digging, and each team can only claim one. Teams that have raced better and arrived at the overnight rest are first will deservedly have more time to look for it and have a greater chance of finding them. This way, more than one team has one, and it's not just a hand-out; teams still have to compete for them.

I like this idea. However I don't think the way they did it on TAR17 is a handout, you have to win the leg after all.

I don't like the idea of having more than one Fast Forward. Supposedly one of the reasons they stopped doing so many was because they'd pay money to have these Fast Forwards set up and teams wouldn't go to them, trying to hold out so they could use one later. I think the way they used it this year was good because there were still 8 teams left as opposed to being down to say 5 and someone uses a Fast Forward. Maybe a better way to treat this would be to not have the Fast Forward on a leg in basically the same city as the previous leg. Even though it wasn't the same city this time it was just a drive through the boarder. Make teams hop on a flight to their next city, go to pick up their clue, and have the Fast Forward there.

As far as the Express Pass, I think maybe there should be two given in the race. One for winning the first leg and one thrown in a random leg but must still be used before a certain leg in the race. So maybe you can reward the winner of the third leg but still state that the Express Pass must be used by leg 8. If a team gets eliminated before using the Express Pass it either becomes void or they do what they state now, give it to the second place team from that leg. So if Thomas and Jill would have gotten eliminated before using their Express Pass it would have went to Nat and Kat. And let's say if Conner and Jonathan were eliminated in leg four and didn't use their Express Pass it would have gone to Gary and Mallory. And if teams were in a situation like we had in Oman, it would be interesting to see who would use their Express Pass at the best and most opportunistic moment. This is just a crazy thought in my head about how the situation could play out but of course it would never happen like this.

[Jobby]

3 FF and 3 Express Passes on the race?

Maybe the Express Pass should work like a HII like in Survivor? At the start of the leg (or maybe at any clue), the producers will drop a hint in the clue that an Express Pass has been hidden at a particular location on the race. Teams can either choose to race on and ignore travelling to the location to find the Express Pass, or go to that particular location on a search for the Express Pass.

The Express Pass cannot be found easily, for example let's say... they have a marked area at the beach and teams who want the EP will have to dig and try to find it. This could work out to be good drama if more than one team go for the EP, and then when they find the EP.. they will have to CONTINUE ON racing and make up for the valuable time that they lost while trying to find the EP.. which they may or may not necessary find. And if they managed to make up valuable time, they will get to keep the EP and can use it up till leg 8.. but if they found the EP but realized that they're at the back of the pack, they will have no choice but to use the EP to gain back some time. The worst of all is, if more than 2 teams went for the EP and 1 team found it.. the other team just lost valuable time and now will have to battle against the team with the EP to avoid elimination.

It all sounds pretty confusing.. but i think it can work out to be real good drama on the race. With that, the EP will not just be handed out.. but it will be more of a strategic move, which you try and find something which might potentially let you gain sometime in the future legs.. but at the same time you must make sure you can make up some time and not get eliminated.

And i still think.. tasks like this.. works best when you have an Hours of Operations. Let all the teams be bunched on equal ground. Imagine a team knew that another team (on a flight 2 hours later) has not reached yet and took all the time to find the EP... and will avoid elimination anyway? Same goes for the FF.. let there be HoO and let every team has an equal chance to go for it. The last time i remember there was an FF drama was when there were some sort of HoO and every team was on equal ground. Michael and Louie went for the FF in Singapore after arriving on the same train with Dan and Jordan.. arrived later than them at Victoria Concert Hall and did not know they went for it. As well as in TAR 13 where T/S and N/S fought for the FF after a HoO!

[Glamazon Racer]

I don't want to comment on the Express Pass until I see it in action for at least 1 more season, but as regards to the Fast Forward, I would be extremely disappointed if they scrapped the task. However, it cannot continue to exist with just one Fast Forward available in each season.

I would love a Fast Forward in each leg, but that is not economically feasible, so I would like at least 3 or 4 in the race course. When there is only 1, I believe it removes the strategy behind the Fast Forward. Before, you had to decide when would be the best time to use it. Now, if you are in the lead and you see one, you go for it - no questions asked, because you won't get another chance.

Also, the Fast Forward can't be used to catch up anymore.  There is only one per race, and the leading team at that particular point can go after it. If you are not leading, then you assume that the leader has taken it and you don't attempt it (this has been the case in Season 13 onwards, although Season 13 had 2-team- battles on two occasions between equal leading teams, Season 14's Fast Forward was unused and Nick & Vicki tried TAR17s although they seemed a little vague on the whole Fast Forward concept. )

This is just my opinion. Tell me if you agree or not, but I am a firm believer that there should be 3-4 Fast Forwards per race.

[David]

I'm OK with the FF things all of you said. I catch all of your points:
-If there's one, great for the competitivity, as you have to stay in the lead so as to go for it.
-If there's 3/4, better for competitivity and strategies.
-If there's one per leg, no competitivity but there IS a lot of strategy involved.

About the Express Pass, one for each team with no more than one team using it in the same task seems allright for me!

[kiki]

The FF as it is now doesn't have any meaning. The first team goes for it and the rest don't even read the clue. I agree that there should be perhaps 3 FF through out the race or if this is not financially possible then it should be at a point of the race that it would give to more than one teams the opportunity to go for it, for example after a flight or hours of operation. If there are more than one FF then the first ones in the race can be used by the last teams to catch up and perhaps save a team that had some bad luck in a previous leg.

About the Express Pass, one for each team with no more than one team using it in the same task seems allright for me!

Also a good idea and maybe this way the FF wouldn't be necessary.

[apskip]

The FF is an amazing tool, WHEN IT APPEARS ON EVERY LEG. That hasn't been the case since Season 5 due to costs (another reason why the Speedbump may be retired soon). I really wish every team could get an Express Pass at the start of the race, it has potential to be a good replacement for the FF.

Similarly, the Yield (and other related markers) had potential when it appeared on every leg.

The intersection makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Caelestor,

I have some shocking news for you. There has never been an Amazing Race with FAST FORWARDs on every leg. Here is the count of successful FAST FORWARDS in each one:

1- 5
2- 6
3- 6
4 -7
5- just 2, in spite of what you indicated
6- 2
7- 1 (not counting the infamous head-shaving abort for Brandon/Nicole)
8 -1
9- 2
10- 2
11- 2
12- 1 (one at Trakai was ignored by everyone)
13- 2
14-0 (in Phuket there was one unused to due to perception of little gain)
15-1
16-1
17-1

The highest count was for AR4 with 7 successful FAST FORWARDs out of 13 legs. I haven't got the time to go back and count the unused FAST FORWARDs for every Amazing Race 1 to 13 but there likely were a few.
 

[Reilly Queens]

wait, weren't Brandon & Nicole in season 5??
and didnt Uchenna and Joyce use one in s7? Wasnt it the head shaving one?

[Glamazon Racer]

The highest count was for AR4 with 7 successful FAST FORWARDs out of 13 legs. I haven't got the time to go back and count the unused FAST FORWARDs for every Amazing Race 1 to 13 but there likely were a few.

I'm pretty sure that in TAR2-4 (I don't know about TAR1 as I haven't seen it) that there was one Fast Forward in each leg except for the last two legs.

[apskip]

Long ago, it was once posted in the forum that the Fast Forward could be avoided so as to exchange it for other similar tasks (something like and Express Pass for all the teams and more options).

BUT; I really like this awesome clue! It makes you be very competitive through all the leg, and only if you're the first team, you may attempt for it.

Also, there is a new thing coming up... The Fast Forward blessing. Nat & Kat; Dan & Jordan; Meghan & Cheyne; Nick & Starr; Ken & Tina (2nd placers!); Nick & Don (3rd place for the ¿oldest contestant ever?); Uchnna & Joyce; BJ & Tyler; Tyler & James... All of them won the Fast Forward (most of the times, their race's ONLY Fast Forward) and ended up in the F3; one of them as 3rd placers; one of them as 2nd Placers, and the rest of them as WINNERS.

Is there any MAGIC involved with the Fast Forward that gives you extra powers for the rest of the entire race??

Feel free to comment your impressions, if you want to!  

David:


I want to improve your list rather a lot. My source is the excellent book "Circumnavigating the Globe: Amazing Race 10 -14 and Amazing Race Asia 1 - 3" which has an entire chapter devoted to "Summary of All FAST FORWARDs in All Amazing Races [through the publication date in 2009]. "  You are correct that most recent 3 Amazing Races had only one FAST FORWARD and each was won by the winner of that race. Let's take a look at the more ancient history of Amazing Races for 1st, 2nd, or 3rd places winning a FAST FORWARD:

AR1 - Rob/Brennan (1st), Frank/Margarita (2nd), Joe/Bill (3rd)
AR2 - Chris/Alex (1st), Wil/Tara (2nd), Blake/Paige (3rd)
AR3 - Flo/Zach (1st), Ken/Gerard (3rd)
AR4 - Chip/Reichen (1st), Jeff/David (3rd)
AR5 - Colin/Christie (2nd)
AR6 - Adam/Rebecca (3rd)
AR7 - Uchenna/Joyce (1st)
AR8 - none
AR9 - B.J./Tyler (1st), Eric/Jeremy (2nd)
AR10 - Tyler/James (1st), Rob/Kimberly (2nd), in an intersection and one of 4 times in Amazing Race history that the FAST FORWARD winners did not win that leg
AR11 - none
AR12 - Donald/Nicolas (3rd)
AR13 - Nick/Starr (1st), Ken/Tina (2nd)
AR14 - only one unused
AR15 - Meghan/Cheyne (1st)
AR16 - Dan/Jordan (1st)
AR17 - Nat/Kat

I have added above 14 1st, 2nd or 3 place finishers who won FAST FORWARDs to your original list of 9.


 

[zacz]

As the fast forward stands now there can be NO strategic use, its basically if you get there first then you take it. I know they were removed from every leg because it became expensive and often no team went for it.

However it IS possible to reduce the cost associated with the fast forward without getting rid of it completely. Not all the fast forwards were expensive even in the earlier seasons. Simply place the fast forward in places that are difficult to find and possibly make the teams going for it take public transport. The process of locating the fast forward would be difficult and thus a task would not be required.

I don't mind the express pass, it could easily replace the fast forward BUT I think every team needs to automatically start the race with one. Maybe put in the rules that only one team can use the fast forward on any given task to stop all teams simultaneously skipping the same task.

[Dånooky]

I agree with the person that posted that there should be several EP hidden and teams may attempt to find or retrieve it it during a Pit Stop or resting point. One user already suggested burying several ones in sand (like the first task in Season 7). Other idea could be, if they're camping in a frozen region, have several clue envelopes (only 2 or 3 with EPs and several TRY AGAINs) inside blocks of ice and have teams breaking them. IMO it would work best during non-racing time and have teams try to get them as soon as they reach the resting point.

[Reilly Queens]

I agree with the person that posted that there should be several EP hidden and teams may attempt to find or retrieve it it during a Pit Stop or resting point. One user already suggested burying several ones in sand (like the first task in Season 7). Other idea could be, if they're camping in a frozen region, have several clue envelopes (only 2 or 3 with EPs and several TRY AGAINs) inside blocks of ice and have teams breaking them. IMO it would work best during non-racing time and have teams try to get them as soon as they reach the resting point.

or when they travelocity gnome task comes, hide them like the free trip in season 7!

[tarflyonthewall]

Apskip, your list is wrong. Teri and Ian (2nd) also won a Fast Forward in TAR3 - the carpet shop one in Marrakech.

[AmazingRace]

"Circumnavigating the Globe: Amazing Race 10 -14 and Amazing Race Asia 1 - 3"

Wow. There is such a book?  Ima go check it out! 

[Rogue]

Nick & Vicki tried TAR17s although they seemed a little vague on the whole Fast Forward concept. )

This is just my opinion. Tell me if you agree or not, but I am a firm believer that there should be 3-4 Fast Forwards per race.

Brook and Claire also went for that Fast Forward and when they got there Nat and Kat were basically finishing so it would have been no point in trying to compete against them for the Fast Forward, if they still allow that. This is why they arrived to the bridge after Kevin and Michael and Gary and Mallory.

I think there is a bit of strategy in using the Fast Forward if there is only one per game but it's not the same type of strategy as holding out. But holding out until you decide to use yours could be a bad thing also. The strategy in using the only Fast Forward is that if you watch the race, (Nick and Vicki ) you know that it's going to be something unpleasant. You have to ask yourself what are you willing to do to stay in the lead? What if you get to the location and can't follow through? Now you have to travel to the Roadblock or Detour hoping that there is someone worse off than you. Holding out can be a bad thing because you could not use it and get eliminated that leg or you might never be in first again. It's all about you making what you think the best decision is for you team.

[apskip]

I agree with the person that posted that there should be several EP hidden and teams may attempt to find or retrieve it it during a Pit Stop or resting point. One user already suggested burying several ones in sand (like the first task in Season 7). Other idea could be, if they're camping in a frozen region, have several clue envelopes (only 2 or 3 with EPs and several TRY AGAINs) inside blocks of ice and have teams breaking them. IMO it would work best during non-racing time and have teams try to get them as soon as they reach the resting point.

From what I understand about the grueling and sleep-deprived nature of the Amazing Race, having new tasks to do at the pit stops is the LAST thing teams need. They need to Eat, Relax and Mingle like they used to several seasons ago.

[Weedy Spyze]

The degradation of the Fast Forward after TAR4 has always been my #1 beef with the show.  I understand that it was done to save money, and I don't think it should be on every leg anyway, but it should be on more than one or two legs of the entire race.  Like someone else said, before there was strategy involved because the teams could only ever use it once and they had to decide whether it was best to go for it then or save it for later.  Around TAR10/TAR11 when the rules were changed so you could use it more than once (like Oswald and Danny did) and especially since 15 when there's only one on the race....there's no point to it.  The first team that gets the clue goes for it and that's it.  Imo they should either increase the number of FFs to four/five in the race, or just get rid of it altogether.

As far as the Express Pass is concerned...meh.  I don't care for it personally, but then again it would probably be better if it was implemented more as well.  I don't think every team should get one, though.

[Rogue]

The degradation of the Fast Forward after TAR4 has always been my #1 beef with the show.  I understand that it was done to save money, and I don't think it should be on every leg anyway, but it should be on more than one or two legs of the entire race.  Like someone else said, before there was strategy involved because the teams could only ever use it once and they had to decide whether it was best to go for it then or save it for later.  Around TAR10/TAR11 when the rules were changed so you could use it more than once (like Oswald and Danny did) and especially since 15 when there's only one on the race....there's no point to it.  The first team that gets the clue goes for it and that's it.  Imo they should either increase the number of FFs to four/five in the race, or just get rid of it altogether.

As far as the Express Pass is concerned...meh.  I don't care for it personally, but then again it would probably be better if it was implemented more as well.  I don't think every team should get one, though.

But it seems as if no matter if there is one Fast Forward on the race, three Fast Forwards on the race, or five Fast Forwards on the race, the team in front is going to go for it anyway. More Fast Forwards really doesn't change anything but giving another team a chance to get a Fast Forward. But at the same time, since there is no cap, a team that got a previous Fast Forward can be first to the clue box on another leg to try for another Fast Forward. But if you decide to not use the Fast Forward hoping you'll be around and get eliminated that leg for whatever reason, where is the strategy in that? No one knows what any leg is going to bring or the previous leg, so I think as long as you're there and in a position to compete for it, you should always go for the Fast Forward.

Also there is nothing that says you can't compete against another team for the Fast Forward, especially depending on the task. If the second team is relatively close behind the first team then they can go hoping that the first team gets lost on the way, can't go through with the Fast Forward, or end the end lose to them.

As I said, I think part of the team strategy has to come down to what they're willing to do to keep a lead. Kat threw her 22 year old practice out of the window so the team could keep their lead. She could have said forget it and her and Nat would have went to the bridge and still placed seeing as how they were in the front of the pack. Brook and Claire got to the bridge only dropping two places and placed fifth. But Nat and Kat said going in they were going to do everything; that's strategy. I wouldn't have shaved my head and depending on my partner, I probably wouldn't have ate that sheep's head. So even if I were in first and I got to the Fast Forward, my teammate and I probably would have been out on that bridge with the rest of them.

[kiki]

But it seems as if no matter if there is one Fast Forward on the race, three Fast Forwards on the race, or five Fast Forwards on the race, the team in front is going to go for it anyway.

In the first TARs especially on the first few legs of each race the teams that went for the ff were the ones at the back of the pack, having a way to stay in the race. I still remember in TAR 3 the twin male models, Drew and Derek, went for the ff in the 2nd leg and they went all the way to fourth place at the end, otherwise they would have been eliminated.
I agree that even if there are more ff if that ff is towards the end of the race the first team will go for it, but if there is a ff in the first couple legs, then an otherwise doomed team might get a second chance. 

[Rogue]

But it seems as if no matter if there is one Fast Forward on the race, three Fast Forwards on the race, or five Fast Forwards on the race, the team in front is going to go for it anyway.

In the first TARs especially on the first few legs of each race the teams that went for the ff were the ones at the back of the pack, having a way to stay in the race. I still remember in TAR 3 the twin male models, Drew and Derek, went for the ff in the 2nd leg and they went all the way to fourth place at the end, otherwise they would have been eliminated.
I agree that even if there are more ff if that ff is towards the end of the race the first team will go for it, but if there is a ff in the first couple legs, then an otherwise doomed team might get a second chance. 

But the thing is that a "doomed" team must be in a position to get to the clue box first. Now no one is going to pass up the chance to possibly stay in front especially if the race allows a team to do a Fast Forward more than once. This season I believe our top three teams reached the clue box first more than any other teams. But as long as The Amazing Race allows for teams to compete for the Fast Forward, a middle of the pack/back of the pack team that may be uncharacteristically in the top a leg, can still have a shot.

[Weedy Spyze]

But it seems as if no matter if there is one Fast Forward on the race, three Fast Forwards on the race, or five Fast Forwards on the race, the team in front is going to go for it anyway. More Fast Forwards really doesn't change anything but giving another team a chance to get a Fast Forward. But at the same time, since there is no cap, a team that got a previous Fast Forward can be first to the clue box on another leg to try for another Fast Forward. But if you decide to not use the Fast Forward hoping you'll be around and get eliminated that leg for whatever reason, where is the strategy in that? No one knows what any leg is going to bring or the previous leg, so I think as long as you're there and in a position to compete for it, you should always go for the Fast Forward.

Also there is nothing that says you can't compete against another team for the Fast Forward, especially depending on the task. If the second team is relatively close behind the first team then they can go hoping that the first team gets lost on the way, can't go through with the Fast Forward, or end the end lose to them.

As I said, I think part of the team strategy has to come down to what they're willing to do to keep a lead. Kat threw her 22 year old practice out of the window so the team could keep their lead. She could have said forget it and her and Nat would have went to the bridge and still placed seeing as how they were in the front of the pack. Brook and Claire got to the bridge only dropping two places and placed fifth. But Nat and Kat said going in they were going to do everything; that's strategy. I wouldn't have shaved my head and depending on my partner, I probably wouldn't have ate that sheep's head. So even if I were in first and I got to the Fast Forward, my teammate and I probably would have been out on that bridge with the rest of them.

"More Fast Forwards really doesn't change anything but giving another team a chance to get a Fast Forward."  Umm, isn't that the whole point?  And there IS a cap, or there used to be at least.  Once a team used the Fast Forward, they could never use it again.  Which is the way it should be if there are multiple Fast Forwards on the race.  And I don't understand what you mean by "not going for it, hoping you'll be around to use it later but you get eliminated instead?"  Umm, how is that not strategy?  You decide if you want to risk going for it then, not knowing if another team took it, or not going for it and possibly saving it for later.  If no one took the Fast Forward and you got eliminated, well tough luck.  I know it's not a perfect way to use the Fast Forward, but it's definitely better than "Oh hey, you got here first.  Go take the Fast Forward."  And the last thing is a matter of opinion.  If I were on the race, and I got to the Fast Forward clue near the front of the pack (and I knew there were a few more Fast Forwards on down the line, and that I could only use it once), I'd probably choose not to go for it and possibly save it for later, when I may need it.  But if it I was near the back of the pack, I might choose to go for it.  Of course, if I got there first and I knew it was the only one in the race, I'd go for it without hesitation.

Absolutely, and I kinda wish teams competed for the Fast Forward more.  Who can forget Nancy/Emily and Joe/Bill competing for the Fast Forward in season 1?  As well as the Gaghans waiting to see if the Paolos would chicken out on the FF in season 8.

And I really don't see what you're arguing about here?  I certainly never claimed that part of the strategy wasn't to decide what you're willing to do to keep a lead.  Heck, you even used the Fast Forward as an example, and of course it is part of that too.  Some teams may get to the clue first and choose to go for it just to possibly expand their lead.  And backtracking to when you said "no one knows what each leg will bring."  Exactly.  Some legs could be like when Jill and Thomas had that huge lead in Bangladesh, only to completely lose it the very next leg when flying to Hong Kong.  Or they could be like leg 5, where there are no equalizers and Katie/Rachel had very little hope of climbing out of last place.  So, a team could use the Fast Forward, and completely lose their lead in the next leg, or they can use it and be sitting pretty for two or three legs.  This is ALL part of the strategy.

[georgiapeach]

I believe the only time a team was allowed to try for the FF a second time was after they did one Intersected, but you historians will know better than me...

I find the some people love and some people hate the FF discussion very interesting....

I LOVED it when there was one every leg...I HATE it now there is just one.

Keep the discussion coming, just please remember to

Have RESPECT for each other, regardless of opinion. This of course includes no flaming/insulting other users and/or their posts.

Thanks!

[AmazingRace]

I believe the only time a team was allowed to try for the FF a second time was after they did one Intersected, but you historians will know better than me...

Yes. It was in Season 11, when Oswald & Danny did the Fast Forward twice. 

[kiki]

I believe the only time a team was allowed to try for the FF a second time was after they did one Intersected, but you historians will know better than me...

Yes. It was in Season 11, when Oswald & Danny did the Fast Forward twice. 

Correct me if I'm wrong but Mary & David in season 10 also had the possibility of doing a second FF. They did one in Abu Dhabi and there was a second at the Intesection in Madagascar. Of course they were not the first to reach it but still they were allowed by the rules to go for it.

[AmazingRace]

Correct me if I'm wrong but Mary & David in season 10 also had the possibility of doing a second FF. They did one in Abu Dhabi and there was a second at the Intesection in Madagascar. Of course they were not the first to reach it but still they were allowed by the rules to go for it.

TAR 10 did'nt visit Abu Dhabi. I believe you're referring to Kuwait.  

Yes, I do agree with you on David & Mary. In fact, Mary asked Lyn & Karlyn: "Fast Forward, girls? I say we do Fast Forward."
But in the end, I guess they figured Tyler & James and Rob & Kimberly had already went for it, so they decided to pass it.

[kiki]

Correct me if I'm wrong but Mary & David in season 10 also had the possibility of doing a second FF. They did one in Abu Dhabi and there was a second at the Intesection in Madagascar. Of course they were not the first to reach it but still they were allowed by the rules to go for it.

TAR 10 did'nt visit Abu Dhabi. I believe you're referring to Kuwait.  

Yes, I do agree with you on David & Mary. In fact, Mary asked Lyn & Karlyn: "Fast Forward, girls? I say we do Fast Forward."
But in the end, I guess they figured Tyler & James and Rob & Kimberly had already went for it, so they decided to pass it.

You are right of course. It was Kuwait. I knew it was one of the countries in the Persian Gulf but I didn't remember which one.

[phant0m]

i wish theyd go back to 1 fast forward per leg. it makes the game way more strategic this way than the one random fast forward that will get picked up by the team that is first anyway

[Rogue]

I totally get what you are saying, and the argument a lot of people are making for more Fast Forwards. I may be the only person who feels like this but, my main point is as long as the competition aspect to win the Fast Forward is there, there should not be so many Fast Forwards on the race. I don't want to think teams are "giving" Fast Forwards to the first team instead of trying to compete for them because they are in second or third place. I think that two on the race is good. If there is a cap, if there isn't a cap, go for the Fast Forward when you're there if you're willing to do whatever the Fast Forward entails, and if the teams right behind you want it bad enough, they'll compete for it; which almost happened this season. I also don't want to see people passing them up in hopes of getting another opportunity later on and later on they are not in a position to compete for the Fast Forward or are eliminated before there is another Fast Forward. But I guess strategy is strategy and to each his own.

When you stated that holding out was better than taking the Fast Forward because you're first kind of goes back to the point I was making. Being first doesn't and shouldn't guarantee you winning the Fast Forward. Some people are not willing to go the distance on a Fast Forward. Some people won't give up a 22 year eating practice, some people won't face their fear of heights, some people won't shave their heads. So if you get to the location and change your mind, or can't finish, now you have put yourself possibly further behind, depending on location, and you have allowed the next team, if there is another one there, to win the Fast Forward. Or if you read the clue and decide to skip it just based off your TAR knowledge then you just have to continue on. You don't know what the that leg or next leg is going to bring but you want to at least make it to the next leg. A Fast Forward only guarantees you first that leg and that's all it should guarantee you. What happens in the next leg is whatever happens in the next leg. You don't have to have a Fast Forward to keep a lead or lose one. The main concern is getting to the next leg.

With teams constantly passing Fast Forwards over early on for later opportunities, I can understand why production would reduce Fast Forwards to only one. I don't know if the teams know ahead of time there is only one Fast Forward on the race. So if they decide to bring back more, the teams might not have this knowledge ahead of time. But once again it's not going to matter unless a team that is usually at the back like Nick and Vicki, is somehow in the front and they have an opportunity to compete for the Fast Forward. This is why I said more Fast Forwards don't really change anything but allow for more teams to get the Fast Forward, mostly the team in front. This season most of the time the first teams at the first clue boxes or first clue were Jill and Thomas, Brook and Claire, and Nat and Kat. The fact that Nat and Kat went for the Fast Forward with Brook and Claire attempting to challenge them for it and with Thomas' competitive nature, I doubt any of these teams would have passed up the opportunity to take a Fast Forward even if they knew there were more on the race unless it was something they weren't willing to do. Heck if there were three Fast Forwards this season, chances are slim that one of these teams wouldn't have had first crack at the Fast Forward. I don't think the teams in front are taking those risks of passing over Fast Forwards anymore. And if no other team is willing to compete with them or go in hopes of something happening with the first team, then nothing is changing.

[Dånooky]

I believe the only time a team was allowed to try for the FF a second time was after they did one Intersected, but you historians will know better than me...

Yes. It was in Season 11, when Oswald & Danny did the Fast Forward twice. 

Correct me if I'm wrong but Mary & David in season 10 also had the possibility of doing a second FF. They did one in Abu Dhabi and there was a second at the Intesection in Madagascar. Of course they were not the first to reach it but still they were allowed by the rules to go for it.

Intersected Fast Forwards don't count towards the cap

[slayton]

Rogue, the Fast Forward has never guaranteed any team first place in a leg.  The only thing that it's ever done is allow teams to skip all remaining tasks and head to the pit-stop.

[georgiapeach]

And of course, doing the FF doesn't guarantee coming in frst in the leg either....

[georgiapeach]

Heee...GMTA!!

[David]

I think that maybe 1 FF per leg is WAY to expensive. But, for example, 4 FF is good.

I'm playing in a Sam's game, and it is just great to have 4 FF. You don't need to go for it, but if you want, and you're not the first one to go for it, then BAD LUCK! Try again at the next FF. And, of course, make sure you're not eliminated and that you're in the first placings in case there's another one soon!

[Rogue]

Slayton and GeorgiaPeach you guys are right about what the Fast Forward does and does not guarantee. I spoke too soon on that statement.