Author Topic: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information  (Read 58316 times)

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Offline Chateau d If

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #150 on: February 23, 2009, 10:08:13 PM »
Quote
KL553/RO102 leaves Amsterdam at 9.00pm and arrives in Bucharest at 6.15am, connecting through Cairo. (Brad/Victoria missed the flight leaving at 8.20pm.) That's five hours behind the (previously) trailing teams. If hours of operation and train schedules work to their favour, they may still be able to climb out of that ditch.



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Offline Neobie

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #151 on: February 24, 2009, 09:51:02 AM »
Regarding Tammy/Victor: Was looking at flights that are definitively marked as 'cancelled' from Munich, Salzburg, Vienna and Frankfurt, and there are no flights that are included in Tammy/Victor's possible itineraries.

There are a lot of flights which are marked as 'unknown' though, so options are still open (though limited). Also, we see teams on Lufthansa and KLM, but none of the teams are known to be taking TARom, the Romanian flag carrier. Has it been banned (for safety, security, money or what not)?

These are the best flights, throughout the day, from Munich to Bucharest (Apskip has them):
LH3554/OS791 via Vienna: 1100-1335
CL3422: 1320-1615
CL3480: 1525-1825
RO312: 1645-1945 (if TARom is allowed)
(Mel/Mike and Margie/Luke arrive before this line, if clock theory holds)
HG8389/RO344 via Vienna: 1710-2235 (if Niki and TARom are allowed)
KL1798/KL1361 via Amsterdam: 1730-0010 (Brad/Victoria on this flight, for a while)
(LaKisha/Jennifer, Tammy/Victor and Mark/Michael arrive after this line)
LH981/LH3416 via Frankfurt: 1755-0010
LH3276/OK804 via Prague: 1925-0010 (if Czech is allowed)
LH3424: 2130-0025 (Jodi/Christie, maybe Jamie/Cara on this flight)
« Last Edit: February 24, 2009, 10:28:59 AM by Neobie »
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Offline georgiapeach

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #152 on: February 24, 2009, 10:05:57 AM »
Here is the actual quote:

Quote
Next On The Amazing Race
 I'm Not Wearing That Girls Leotard! (Romania)
Teams scour the Transylvanian countryside for buried coffins outside of Dracula's castle and a first place team falls to the back of the pack when their plane is forced to make an unexpected landing.


So an unexpected landing suggests an actual airplane issue  (Mechanical? Weather? Passenger emergency?), so I was hoping we could find that data historically.


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Offline walkingpneumonia

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #153 on: February 25, 2009, 05:12:24 PM »
Here's the train schedule from bucharest to Brasov in the early morning

http://www.infofer.ro/


dep. 5:50 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 8:52   dur. 3:02 fast train
dep. 6:13 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 10:56  dur. 4:43
dep. 7:30 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 10:37  dur. 3:07
dep. 8:30 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 11:38  dur  3:08 fast train
dep. 8:45 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 11:47  dur. 3:02 fast train
dep. 9:42 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 12:49  dur. 3:07


Looks like a team that misses the first train needs to be careful they don't take the 6:13 which gets them there later despite leaving earlier...

there must be a bus they could take that would be faster - but since we see Tammy in a train station I'll assume they take a train. 
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Offline DrRox

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #154 on: February 25, 2009, 06:49:45 PM »
For whatever reasons, Brad/Victoria, team #5 ended up in Amsterdam.

I "think" that all the teams have to drive the cars back to Munich International Airport. That is my base assumption at this point in time. I, like a few, thought Salzburg was a perfect place for a morning task before heading to Romania. Now I think they got an extended pit stop with Tammy/Victor release at Noon. Why noon? No reason, just sounds good to me. Other teams are released at same interval they arrived at Schloss Hellbrunn.

I think that, the flight that Tammy/Victor where orginally on, returned to Frankfurt. It's Lufthanza's hub and maintainence base. That would explain why they showed up in Bucharest mixed into the other later teams that are split on either the late night FRA-OTP or MUC-OTP flights.

I think it is entirely possible that Mel/Mike, team #2 and Amanda/Kris, team#3, and Luke/Margie, team#4 got on the same flight to Bucharest. I think, because of the clock, that they are actually doing the gynastics at 9 pm. We do not see Amanda/Kris at the gynastics, so they might not have been on the same flight. If they can complete the gymnastics and get to the train station before 9:30 pm, I think they can make the last night train to Brazov. I think the last train is at 9:30. If so, then there is good chance they are doing the detour in Brazov when other teams are still on the train to Brazov. They are probably held up by an HOH there, while other teams are held up by train schedule in early morning hours in Bucharest.

Missing the flight connection in Amsterdam pretty much dooms Brad/Victoria, team #5, unless they can be helped by the time delays of the other teams for HOH or some other team has a drastic meltdown.
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Offline georgiapeach

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #155 on: February 25, 2009, 07:49:43 PM »
Latest preview shows Amanda there, and of course we have the spoiler with multiple teams in the train station at 430 AM.
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Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #156 on: February 25, 2009, 08:34:14 PM »
For whatever reasons, Brad/Victoria, team #5 ended up in Amsterdam.

I "think" that all the teams have to drive the cars back to Munich International Airport. That is my base assumption at this point in time. I, like a few, thought Salzburg was a perfect place for a morning task before heading to Romania. Now I think they got an extended pit stop with Tammy/Victor release at Noon. Why noon? No reason, just sounds good to me. Other teams are released at same interval they arrived at Schloss Hellbrunn.

I think that, the flight that Tammy/Victor where orginally on, returned to Frankfurt. It's Lufthanza's hub and maintainence base. That would explain why they showed up in Bucharest mixed into the other later teams that are split on either the late night FRA-OTP or MUC-OTP flights.

I think it is entirely possible that Mel/Mike, team #2 and Amanda/Kris, team#3, and Luke/Margie, team#4 got on the same flight to Bucharest. I think, because of the clock, that they are actually doing the gynastics at 9 pm. We do not see Amanda/Kris at the gynastics, so they might not have been on the same flight. If they can complete the gymnastics and get to the train station before 9:30 pm, I think they can make the last night train to Brazov. I think the last train is at 9:30. If so, then there is good chance they are doing the detour in Brazov when other teams are still on the train to Brazov. They are probably held up by an HOH there, while other teams are held up by train schedule in early morning hours in Bucharest.

Missing the flight connection in Amsterdam pretty much dooms Brad/Victoria, team #5, unless they can be helped by the time delays of the other teams for HOH or some other team has a drastic meltdown.

Dr. Rox, the Timeline identifies the last train of each day from Bucharest Nord to Brasov as dep.  Bucharest Nord 2358 arr. Brasov 0246.   

Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #157 on: February 25, 2009, 08:42:16 PM »
Here's the train schedule from bucharest to Brasov in the early morning

http://www.infofer.ro/


dep. 5:50 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 8:52   dur. 3:02 fast train
dep. 6:13 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 10:56  dur. 4:43
dep. 7:30 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 10:37  dur. 3:07
dep. 8:30 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 11:38  dur  3:08 fast train
dep. 8:45 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 11:47  dur. 3:02 fast train
dep. 9:42 Bucurest Nord arr. Brasov 12:49  dur. 3:07


walkingpneumonia, my official train schedules are a bit different than yours, but mostly the same:

dep. Bucharest Nord  0630 arr. Brasov 0922 
dep. Bucharest Nord 0730 arr. Brasov 1019 
dep. 0616 arr. 1051(note: nobody would want this)
dep. Bucharest Nord 0830 arr. Brasov 1124 
dep. Bucharest Nord 0942 1254  or  1130 1404

My 0616 is about the same as your 0613 departure and no sane racer would take either one since you can arrive earlier by waiting until the 0730 departure. The 730am, 830am and 942am departures are the same. I do not show any 550am or 845am departures and I do have a 630am deqaprture you do not show.






Looks like a team that misses the first train needs to be careful they don't take the 6:13 which gets them there later despite leaving earlier...

there must be a bus they could take that would be faster - but since we see Tammy in a train station I'll assume they take a train. 
:neener:

Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #158 on: February 27, 2009, 08:13:49 AM »
AR14 Timeline(revised 3/16):

all changes are focused on legs 4, 5 and 6

Oct. 31 leg 1 depart U.S. for Locarno, Switzerland via Frankfurt and Zurich or via Milan:

LAX to Milan-Malpensa(MXP) as follows: AF75 LAX CDG 1600 0930+1, connecting with AF4806 CDG MXP 1125+1 1305+1     
Here are the schedules in the same time frame:
take taxi to Chiasso, the first train station in Switzerland. Schedules to Locarno would be:
depart Chiasso 1500 arrive Locarno 1613
depart Chiasso 1533 arrive Locarno 1657
depart Chiasso 1603 arrive Locarno 1727 
 
From LAX to Zurich via Frankfurt we have the interesting combination:
LH457  LAX FRA  1535 1025+1 connecting with LH3726   FRA ZRH  1200 1255

There are 10 nonstop flights on Saturday between Frankfurt and Zurich, so if any are delayed there are alternatives.

The train schedule from Zurich to Bellinzona to Locarno indicates that 3 1/4 hours is required. Here it is:
de.Zurich 1402 arrive Arth-Goldau 1446 dep. 1448 arr. Bellinzona 1623 dep. 1630 arrive Locarno 1657

Nov. 1 arrive mid-morning in Europe and reach Locarn late afternoon afternoon; then sign up for 0715, 0730 or 0745am departures; then sleep overnight;
Nov. 2 Verzasca Dam bungee jump then Locarno to Domodossola to Spiez to Interlaken by train;
schedule for a leading team:
dep. Locarno 0903 arr. Bellinzona 0927
dep. Bellnizona 0936 arr. Lucerne 1141 via the St. Gotthard Tunnel
dep. Lucerne 1155 arr. Interlaken Ost 1355
this is nearly a 5 hour trip;

schedule for good train (taken by Brad/Victoria and lagging teams get there in time to take it):
dep. Locarno 1042 arr. Domodossola 1230
dep. Domodossola 1248 arr. Spiez 1353
dep. Spiez 1403 arr. Interlaken West 1423
total trip is 4 hours train;
other teams go earlier and get there slightly earlier(except for Christie/Jodi who get a circuitous route 1 1/4 hours hours earlier but arrive later or teams that are behind Brad/Victoria);

Interlaken tasks;
Interlaken area (Stechelberg) pit stop

Nov. 3 leg 2 Interlaken by tasi directl to Zurich airport, then plane to Salzburg:
 
From Interlaken to Munich, the early morning Monday(as in Nov.3) flights are:
LX1100 ZRH MUC 0710 0815
LX3616 ZRH MUC 0845 0945

then self-drive less than an hour to Ruhpolding
Tasks in Raushberg near Ruhpolding parasailing, 25 mile drive to Schnoau am Kongisee for tasks, then
Evening Extedned 18 hour Pit stop in Salzburg at Schloss Hellbrunn

Nov. 4  begin leg 3;
Salzburg to Bucharest starts with driving to Alzburg rail station, getting on a train to Munich and switching there to an airport train. The schedules from Salzburg  all the way to MUchich Flughafen (on average once per hour) are:

1103 1317
1152 1417
1303 1526
1314 1537
1352 1557
1441 1657
1552 1757
1617 1827
Flight choices depend on arrival at Munich Airport. Tammy/Victor initially get LH3480 1525 1825 but then it comes back with a mechanical problem.
RO312 1645 1945 is taken by 3 teams.
LH3424 2130 0025+1 is taken by everyone else except Brad/Victoria
Brad/Victoria attempt to get 15 minutes ahead of the alst group by going MUC AMS and AMS OTP but delays on the flight into Amsterdam doom them to not departing until the KLM nonstop the next morning and not arriving into Bucharest until after 1pm.

Nov. 5 arrival in Bucharest after midnight; transfer to train to get to Brasov
morning train departures: Bucharest Nord 2358 arr. Brasov 0246  or  dep. 0630 0922  or  dep. 0730 1019  or  dep. 0616 1051(note: nobody would want this) or  0830 1124  or  0942 1254  or  1130 1404

tasks in Brasov and nearby Transylvania
extended pit stop in Transylvania (includes Brasov)

Nov. 7 leg 4  leave Transylvania for Krasnojarsk, Siberia
return to Bucharest, then choice of:

TK1444  OTP IST RO261 0825 0955 connecting in Istanbul to SU208 SVO 1255 1705 

OTP SOFIA RO293 0820 0920, connecting to SOF SVO SU162 1240 1630

OTP FRA LH3417 0610 0750 or RO321 0910 1050, either connecting to SU106 FRA SVO 1405 1910 

OTP MUC LH3425 0700 0810, connecting to SU122 MUC SVO 1310 1825 

OTP IST RO261 0825 0955. connecting to TK1415 IST SVO 1335 1740,
connecting at Moscow-Sheremetyevo to SU779 SVO KJA 2055 0540+1 OR
SU781 0045+1 0910+1

Nov. 8 do tasks
pit stop

Nov. 9
leg 5 begins allowing teams to board TransSiberian Express in late afternoon
Here is the schedule from Krasnojarsk to Novosibirsk on a weekday:

Dep.Kr  Arr.No Duration
00:57  14:09  13:12   
02:01  17:27  15:26 
04:10  16:01  11:51   
05:59  20:06  14:07   
06:52  18:51  11:59   
07:18   22:52  15:34     
08:05   21:24  13:19     
10:09   23:55  13:46     
10:36   23:12  12:36     
11:16   00:58  13:42     
12:36   01:12  12:36     
13:51   02:24  12:33     
14:37   04:19  13:42     
15:27   04:33  13:06     
18:26   06:47  12:21     
23:36   12:38  13:02   

I have no idea why teams had to wait for the non-listed 2228 train, which would arrive Nov. 10 around 1130.

Nov. 10 TransSiberian Express arrival in Novosibirsk
tasks in Novosibirsk, Siberia
pit stop (about 50/50 to be Extended 36 Hour variety)

Nov. 11 or 12 leg 6 begins
flights Novosibirsk to Jaipur:
if on Nov. 12,
SU810 OVB SVO 0700 0815
KC872 SVO ALA 0920 1645
KC907 ALA Delhi DEL 1805 2115;
if on Nov. 11,
S7865 OVB DXB  0800 1145
EK514 DXB DEL 1540 2015;

overnight at Delhi Airport

Nov. 13 or 14
There are 5 nonstop flights from Delhi to Jaipur on Wednesdays or Thursdays (Nov. 12 or 13). They are:

9W709 0545 0630
AI9896/IC896 0605 0645
IC7809 0700 0755
IT611 0930 1010
IT 2302 1930 2030

tasks in Jaipur area
pit stop (Extended if it was not so in Novosibirsk)

Nov. 14 leg 7 Fly Jaipur to Phuket
From Jaipur to Phuket late on Fridays with enough flex to accommodate teams laging far behind:

IC612  JAI BOM  0735 0910  connecting TG340  BOM BKK  1230 1815  connecting  TG227  BKK HKT  1915 2035
IT612  JAI DEL  1950 2030  connecting  SQ407  DEL SIN  2315 0715+1  connecting  SQ5052  SIN HKT  0850+1 0935+1
IT2301  JAI DEL  0550 0650  connecting  TG324  DEL BKK  1155 1725  connecting to  TG223  BKK HKT  1820 1940
9W372 JAI BOM  2040 2220 connecting 9W062  BOM BKK  0155+1 0740+1  connecting  PG924  BKK HKT  1145+1 1305+1
IT3128  JAI BOM  1415 1600  connecting   AI442 BOM SIN 0010+1 0750+1  connecting  MI752  SIN HKT  0850+1 0935+1

Nov. 15 see above
Phhuket area tasks
pit stop

Nov. 16 leg 8 fly from Phuket to Bangkok
Choices for flights are: TG226 0725 0850, TG1204 0935 1100, PG272 1025 1145, TG1206 1235 1400, TG1214 1355 1520, PPG 276 1350 1510
 
tasks in Bangkok area
Extended pit stop

Nov. 18 leg 9 fly from Bangkok to to Guilin
 Shenzen Air 9669 BKK CAN 2110 2225. The viable CAN KWL flights are TG668 0950 1330 and MS958 1310 1655. 
tasks in Guilin area

Nov. 19 leg 10 Guilin to Beijing flight choices:
CZ3281 0900 1125
CA6312 1145 1435
CZ3287 1710 1950
CA1226 2105 0015

then tasks in Beijing and start TBC or NEL
extended pit stop (note: this may also be one later later after next leg)

Nov. 20
 pitstop continues

Nov. 21
leg 11 starts
tasks
pitstop

Nov. 22
leg 12 return from Beijing to U.S. for Finish Line in Hawaii via Tokyo
PEK NRT on Air China has several choices:
CA6651/NH956 0845 1305
CA925               0930 1350
CA167               1350 1750

Continuing on from Tokyo-Narita to Honolulu (NRT to HNL), there are 9 choices with departures between 645pm and 10pm. With the 6 hours 45 minute flying team and 5 hour time difference, these flights arrive HNL 0630 to 0950. The most logical choice to me would be UA880 NRT HNL 1925 0710+1. All these are same day due to crossing the International Date Line.

Finish Line on Maui, so teams will take a 36 or 37 minute flight Honolulu to Kahului. There is at least one every hour from 5am to 9pm and several in some hours.
tasks
Finish Line

Note: this is a 22 day race.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2009, 07:08:09 AM by apskip »

Offline Neobie

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #159 on: March 01, 2009, 09:09:11 PM »
Brad and Victoria are in deep doo-doo.
*shrugs* We tried to save you, you know we tried.



From Salzburg to Munich

Teams took the train from Salzburg to Munich, then switched to the S-Bahn to the airport. Teams 2-4 got on at least two separate Salzburg trains, with Mel/Mike and Margie/Luke boarding one to Dortmund (which could only be the EC114), and Amanda/Kris holding a ticket for the IC2294. Hmm, they turned an 18min lead into a 51min deficit?

Tammy/Victor
Depart Pit Stop: 1013
IC2296 to Munich Central: 1153-1334
S1 to Munich Intl Airport: 1345-1426
Mel/Mike, Margie/Luke
Depart Pit Stop: 1201 & 1230
EC114 to Munich Central: 1302-1430
S1 to Munich Intl Airport: 1445-1526
Amanda/Kris
Depart Pit Stop: 1212
IC2294 to Munich East: 1353-1524
S8 to Munich Intl Airport: 1547-1617



From Munich to Bucharest

There are flight combinations (similar, and in addition to Amsterdam) that get the trailing teams to Bucharest about 15min earlier, but those involve a connection. You can see why teams didn't try those.

Tammy/Victor
CL3480: 1525-1825 (grounded)
LH3424: 2130-0025
Mel/Mike, Margie/Luke, Amanda/Kris
RO312: 1645-1945
Brad/Victoria
KL1798 to Amsterdam: 1730-1915 (delayed to 1806-2006)
KL1361 to Bucharest: 2020-0010 (missed)
KL1389 to Bucharest: 0950-1335
Christie/Jodi, Jamie/Cara, Mark/Michael, LaKisha/Jennifer
LH3424: 2130-0025



From Bucharest to Brasov

Brad/Victoria, if they took the same time as Mel/Mike and Margie/Luke, would be at the Roadblock at 2.49pm. There are two trains between then and sunset (the team's seen on the train in daylight). Ten hours behind - yikes! (Tammy/Victor had checked in before they arrived in Brasov.)

Everyone
0630-0922
Brad/Victoria
R827: 1530-1826 OR
R346: 1645-1939

Thanks to DrRox, Apskip, Peach and WalkingPneumonia for this leg's information!
« Last Edit: March 06, 2009, 02:50:28 AM by Neobie »
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Offline georgiapeach

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #160 on: March 03, 2009, 12:48:37 PM »
Mark and Michael say in an insider clip that they were at gymnastics 1-130AM and are driving thru Bucharest at 2AM.
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Offline TARAsia Fan

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #161 on: March 03, 2009, 12:56:39 PM »
The insider clips are running together for me. There was someone else who mentioned the kids at Gymnastics Hall stayed up at 1:30 a.m. for the teams so that gives us an idea when the teams landed in Bucharest.
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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #162 on: March 03, 2009, 02:20:42 PM »
There are clear shots of 'the clock' behind Tammy & Victor.  I think it said 1:53.
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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #163 on: March 04, 2009, 03:12:52 AM »
Bran, Romania is very likely to be an extended Pit Stop.

Teams' train arrived in Brasov at 9.22am on 5 Nov (fixed, thanks Apskip!). Let's say they speed by and check in within half an hour. Now if the Pit Stop was a traditional 12-hour one, they'd be leaving at earliest 9.52pm that evening, with the last international flight out of Bucharest at 9.25pm. They're stuck for the night.

The best flight to Krasnojarsk next morning would be:
SU152 to Moscow SVO: 0805-1125, connecting to
SU783 to Krasnojarsk: 1615-0040

If Brasov lasted only 12 hours, lead teams would be connecting through Moscow long before sunset at 4.38pm, but we see Mark/Michael (who are in the lead) transferring at night. SU152 does not run the next day on the 7th (under an extended Pit Stop), which would explain why the earliest teams reach Moscow only in the evening.

Regarding the assumption that teams can make the 8.05am flight: if Tammy/Victor check in four hours after the lead teams and yet manage to arrive before sunset (5pm), even taking the train (2.25am - 5.26am for example) teams can get to the airport in time.

Edited to add: But if the night cab shot of Mark/Michael are in Krasnojarsk instead of Moscow, then all this goes out the window! :ascared
« Last Edit: March 06, 2009, 02:51:22 AM by Neobie »
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Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #164 on: March 04, 2009, 07:52:05 AM »
Neobie:

I have a few questions about your information in the post above:

1. How do you know that teams arrived on the train in Brasov 30 minutes early? The time for the better Bucharest to Brasov trips including that one is around 170 minutes.  With scheduled arrival at 922am, how could they get that far ahead of schedule?

2. All other teams probably have the option of taking the 226am train back to Bucharest, but Tammy/Victor do not. They would not release from the pit stop until about 4am and that train would be halfway to Bucharest by then. My bet is that World Race Productions springs for a bus or two for the first group (all every Tammy/Victor, who would have their own bus) or they make sure plenty of taxis arrive around midnight to the Vila Panoramic.

3. I find SU152 OTP SVO, but I do not find any SU783 SVO KJA for the right time frame. I checked for Friday (Nov. 7) and for Thursday (Nov. 6) in case there is no Extended pit stop in Romania. It is possible that SU783 exists, but when I checked them directly on the Aeroflot website, they are not shown there for those days of the week.

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #165 on: March 04, 2009, 08:10:19 AM »
1. How do you know that teams arrived on the train in Brasov 30 minutes early? The time for the better Bucharest to Brasov trips including that one is around 170 minutes.  With scheduled arrival at 922am, how could they get that far ahead of schedule?

Like WalkingPneumonia, the train schedule I got from the official website shows the first train on Wednesdays running from 5.50am to 8.52am. But no matter in this case; we're trying to prove that no team can leave Romania on the evening of the 5th.

2. All other teams probably have the option of taking the 226am train back to Bucharest, but Tammy/Victor do not. They would not release from the pit stop until about 4am and that train would be halfway to Bucharest by then. My bet is that World Race Productions springs for a bus or two for the first group (all every Tammy/Victor, who would have their own bus) or they make sure plenty of taxis arrive around midnight to the Vila Panoramic.

You're right; Tammy/Victor may take up to 8.37am to get into Bucharest if they take a train from Brasov. But here we're trying to set the early and late bounds for the lead teams arriving in the Bucharest Airport, as we're concerned with what time Mark/Michael get to Moscow.

Since even taxis can't get from Bran to Bucharest in 3 minutes, we've got the early bound covered; teams arriving at 9.26pm are as good as arriving at 5.00am the next day. The late bound would be assuming travel by train, and we see that the lead teams should have little trouble getting into Bucharest by 5.26am.

3. I find SU152 OTP SVO, but I do not find any SU783 SVO KJA for the right time frame. I checked for Friday (Nov. 7) and for Thursday (Nov. 6) in case there is no Extended pit stop in Romania. It is possible that SU783 exists, but when I checked them directly on the Aeroflot website, they are not shown there for those days of the week.

Attached is the information for SU783 from Moscow SVO to Krasnojarsk on 6 Nov. The service has stopped running since the beginning of February this year.

(I don't think FV573 from St Petersburg to Krasnojarsk runs on Thursdays or Fridays. Our racers should all be headed to Moscow then?)
« Last Edit: March 04, 2009, 08:56:22 AM by Neobie »
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Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #166 on: March 04, 2009, 07:31:22 PM »
Neobie,
there is little else I think is worthwhile to look at at this time. We have 4 flights for Nov. 6 arriving in Krasnojarsk the next morning at 1240am(I'll take your word based on how you developed this as I can't substantiate it independently becasue it no longer exists), 240am(this is through St. Petersburg and I cannot provide any substantiation other than it continues to exist in a major database even though Rossia Airlines does not show it) , 540am 600am and 645am. For any team, one of them should be right. This is the no-extended-pit-stop-Romania case. The extended pit stop Romania case is departure on Nov. 7 and arriving Krasnojarsk the next day at 240am, 540am, or 600am or 645am. For either date, the Moscow connecting airport (except for the St. Petersburg case) is DME twice, VKO once, or SVO once.

Now let's move backward to departure from Bucharest. The modified options on Nov. 6(adding SU152) are:
SU152 at 0805 via VIE to DME (connecting to SU573 leaving at 1615 and arriving 0040+1)
RO341 at 0835 via VIE to DME, leaving there at 2220 unless taxi transfer to one of the other airports for a slightly earlier arrival
TK1444 at 1050 via IST to SVO, leaving there at 2055
NE3207 at 0930 leaving Bucharest-Banasea BBU via VIE to SVO, leaving there at 2055
For VKO airport on this day you can't get there from here because there are no apporpriate flights from OTP to VKO

The options for Nov. 7 departure from Bucharest (subtracting SU152) are:
MA857 at 0615 via BUD to DME, leaving there at 2220
TK1444 at 1050 via IST to SVO, leaving there at 2055
NE3207 at 0930 via from BBU to VIE to SVO, leaving there at 2055

I have another layer of detail not shown beacuse it's already complex enough. I will wait until after the actual episode to provide more detail on the actual paths chosen.


« Last Edit: March 07, 2009, 11:05:54 AM by apskip »

Offline georgiapeach

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #167 on: March 05, 2009, 11:41:35 PM »
I believe that you will find that a 36 hour Pitstop in Romania, as you have speculated, works well into the Timeline.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2009, 11:44:41 PM by georgiapeach »
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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #168 on: March 06, 2009, 12:28:57 AM »
Its the "weekend."
Matthew 7:15

Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #169 on: March 06, 2009, 07:13:58 AM »
Dr. Rox, of course the weekend has nothing to do with it. When any Amazing Race gets to its 4th episode, an extended pit stop wherever they are is frequently scheduled. There will be another one later in the race, probably 3, 4 or 5 eipsodes later. That would be India, Phuket or Bangkok or Guilin. My best guess, and it's only that, is that it will be at the end of the Bangkok leg. I think there will be a third one after one of the Beijing legs.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2009, 07:20:39 AM by apskip »

Offline Neobie

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #170 on: March 06, 2009, 09:07:07 AM »
There's no shortage of good flights into Moscow; ticket availability for the Moscow-Krasnojarsk leg is probably what's holding teams back.

Airports for those just joining in: Moscow has three main airports: Sheremtyevo, Domodedovo and Vnukovo. Baneasa is Bucharest's secondary airport.

There are plenty of flights through at least 13 European cities that can get teams poised for the first Moscow-Krasnojarsk flight at 8.55pm. With Apskip's Athens flight leaving Bucharest at 9.40am, even Tammy/Victor should be able to catch up with everyone if there were enough tickets.

I'm with Apskip in his flights. Mark/Michael, Jennifer/LaKisha and Christie/Jodi probably qualify for his "second wave of teams", arriving at 5.40am. This flight runs out of tickets, and the rest make up his "lagging teams combination", arriving at 6.45am. With the earlier flight flying out of Sheremtyevo and the later flight flying out of Domodedovo, that's likely what Mark meant when he mentioned the other teams "stuck at the other airport". Since Baneasa flights also wind up at the 8.55pm bunching point, it's not likely teams would be stuck at this "other airport".

In short, we should be seeing the three earliest teams holding a 65min lead over the rest of the pack.

(If ticket problems are that serious, there's a flight from Vnukovo arriving at 7.05am, and another arriving at 8.05am. Last flight out that evening leaves from Sheremtyevo, arriving at 9.10am.)

Teams 3, 5 and 6 scoring the best tickets? Are we seeing a bunching, probably a train from Brasov back to Bucharest? Or Mark's "leading teams" are not the leading teams at all?



Krasnojarsk is unlikely to be a 36-hour Pit Stop since there was just one in Bran, plus Phil can fly to Novosibirsk while teams take the train. Novosibirsk is likely to be extended, after which we have just the right amount of time to get to Jaipur. (Fixed stupid accidental swap. Thanks DrRox!)

Jaipur as a regular Pit Stop is the most likely reason why Phil isn't further ahead of the teams getting into Thailand. With Phuket on the 15th, Bangkok on the 16th and Guilin on the 17th, Phuket and Bangkok cannot be 36-hour Pit Stops.

Guilin can go either way depending on the transport from there to Beijing. I don't see a need for Beijing I to be extended (since Phil doesn't need to scramble to another city). Beijing II is not extended, or Phil would be way ahead of teams getting to Hawaii.

My educated picks: Bran on the 6th, Novosibirsk on the 11th, Guilin on the 18th. Which kind of (but not absolutely) fits into DrRox's "once a week" model.



Edited to add: Bran is confirmed as an extened Pit Stop. Phil cannot be a day ahead of the teams (as in his Krasnojarsk diaries) with a regular 12-hour Pit Stop; after eliminating Brad/Victoria he too is basically stuck in Romania for the night. He probably saved one trip over the racers though, with that direct flight to Moscow only available on the 6th...
« Last Edit: March 10, 2009, 07:04:44 AM by Neobie »
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Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #171 on: March 07, 2009, 07:34:45 AM »
DELETED due to accuracy issue.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2009, 08:55:50 AM by apskip »

Offline apskip

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #172 on: March 09, 2009, 10:01:26 AM »
Episode 4 Flight Alternatives

We know from the telecast that teams actually chose to go from Bucharest to Moscow by a number of different paths, connecting in Sofia, Frankfurt, Munich or Istanbul. Here are the flights they had access to in the relevant time frames (sometimes there is more than one possibility):

OTP SOFIA RO293 0820 0920, connecting to SOF SVO SU162 1240 1630

OTP FRA LH3417 0610 0750 or RO321 0910 1050, either connecting to SU106 FRA SVO 1405 1910  or FRA DME 1035 1550

OTP MUC LH3425 0700 0810, connecting to SU122 MUC SVO 1310 1825 or  MUC DME S74898 1015 1510

OTP IST RO261 0825 0955. connecting to TK1415 IST SVO 1335 1740, with no connections from Istanbul to DME

So, I conclude from the above that no team could possible catch the DME KJA flight Siberian S7 073 1010 1835. Next, I conclude that all teams going to Sheremetyevo airport would have access to the earliest arriving flight team could get SVO KJA SU779 2055 0540+1. Other teams could get DME KJA S7 071 2220 0645+1, but teams would do that only if restrictions froze them out of the earlier one. I think the leading teams Mark/Michael, Christie/Jody and Kisha/Jen have taken all available seats on SU779 and all other teams arrived later, not able to get on it despite ticketing, and were stuck with S7(Siberian) 071. The Backup would have been SU781 0045+1 0910+1, but it lands 3.5 hours after SU779 so that did not happen.

Now here is the really interesting part. In order to get the 2220 flight from Domodedovo, teams would have all flown into Sheremetyevo expecting to get the 2055 flight from there to Krasnoyarsk. All 5 teams left would have have to take shuttle buses or taxis across Moscow about 1 hour to DME airport. Not showing any of that drama or how the decisions to have 5 teams not on the 2055 flight is a real casualty of the new World Race Productions policies about air transportation's share of the telecast. More would have been appropriate.

EDITOR'S NOTE - As a result of a note below by Neobie, I doublechecked my work and found a few typos (not surprising since they happen to me all the time these days) and corrected them. SU162 now is SU172. SU176 (you had to see how I actually wrote this down in my notes) now is SU122 and its departure time was 1310, not 1300. I do have a diofferent connecting flight in Istanbul and I am sticking with it. Aeroflot does not have an office in Bucharest Airport and  the originating flight on Turkish Airlines would mean that Turkish is likely to have made the booking. Are they going to have a transfer in Istanbul to Aeroflot that arrives 35 minutes earlier? In a pig's eye, as that saying goes!

« Last Edit: March 09, 2009, 02:15:41 PM by apskip »

Offline bearkat

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #173 on: March 09, 2009, 10:51:30 AM »
but wouldn't the teams if they caught the flight arriving at 6:45 catch up to the first three teams since the hours of operations at the dam was 8:30 and the 5 teams didn't arrive until the first three were doing their tasks


Offline Neobie

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Re: AR14 Timelines, Timetables and Flight Information
« Reply #174 on: March 09, 2009, 12:23:54 PM »
The only flight arriving after sunrise (at 8.09am) is the next best flight from Sheremetyevo, landing at 9.10am. The teams were all poised to board the earliest flight by flying into Sheremetyevo, but it looks like customs took longer than expected. Those scheduling the most comfortable connections were rewarded for it. Lead teams arrived in Krasnojarsk 3.5 hours before the trailing teams, and had an hour's lead even after hours of operation.

Teams could have cut their losses by trying any of the three flights from Domodedovo and Vnukovo, but I guess no one wanted to take the risk of leaving the pack and braving the Moscow traffic...

Below flights are somewhat different from Apskip's, but match up with Puck's over at TWoP. Perhaps we were looking at different dates?

From Bucharest to Moscow

LaKisha/Jennifer, Mark/Michael
RO293 to Sofia: 0820-0920
SU172 to Moscow SVO: 1240-1640 (4h15 for connection)
Jodi/Christie
RO261 to Istanbul: 0835-0950
SU208 to Moscow SVO: 1255-1705 (3h50 for connection)
Cara/Jaime, Luke/Margie, Tammy/Victor
LH3425 to Munich: 0700-0810
SU122 to Moscow SVO: 1310-1825 (2h30 for connection)
Mel/Mike, Amanda/Kris
LH3417 to Frankfurt: 0610-0750 OR
RO301 to Frankfurt: 0910-1050
SU106 to Moscow SVO: 1405-1910 (1h45 for connection)



From Moscow to Krasnojarsk

LaKisha/Jennifer, Mark/Michael, Jodi/Christie
SU779: 2055-0540
Cara/Jaime, Luke/Margie, Tammy/Victor, Mel/Mike, Amanda/Kris
SU781: 0045-0910

ETA: Five... hundred!
« Last Edit: March 09, 2009, 12:49:02 PM by Neobie »
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