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Author Topic: TAR12 timeline speculation  (Read 57219 times)

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Offline patlini

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #125 on: November 28, 2007, 11:52:12 AM »
ok getting from Dubrovnik to Florence

(seems to be a lot easier then getting into Dubrovnik)

From Dubrovnik to Frankfurt  seems to be the main hub.

7:20am  11:30am FRA OU 0631 / LH 2479* 
7:20am 11:30am FRA  OU 0631 / 0416 
7:30am  9:35am FRA   LH 2469* 
7:30am 9:35am FRA   OU 0418 


From Frankfurt to Florence 2 options

10:50 12:15 LH4060
12:15 13:45 LH4062


Flights to Prague

depart 7.30am arrive 12.55 there are 3 options

LH 2469* / 3260 
TP 9018* / 7939* 
OU 0418 / LH 3260 

all connecting in Frankfurt  see 7.30 departure above

From Prague to Florence

15:50 arrive 17:20  IG3622

Could the two TAR's have collided in Prague on the 20th?


Paris

7:30am  12:00pm   LH 2469* / AF 1519 
7:30am  12:00pm   OU 0418 / AF 1519 

interesting this connects through Frankfurt see above

but they could get
13:20  15:20  AF5042


connections through amdam wouldn't work 


« Last Edit: November 28, 2007, 01:40:24 PM by patlini »


Offline patlini

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #126 on: November 28, 2007, 01:48:33 PM »
where I'm going with all this is that there had been discussion that the 18th was a rest day in Lith.  Priming them up for 3/4 legs to come.

With the timings of the flights into Croatia and then out again into Florence, they could be easily checked in - in Florence early evening of the 20th.  Getting them out of Florence early on the 21st and onto India.

Florence has early flights to Frankfurt, London, Paris, Vienna and Amsterdam (all of which have direct flights to Delhi)

Offline Chateau d If

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #127 on: November 29, 2007, 12:39:23 AM »
Great find patlini !

I like this flight you found  the best now.  It gets Ron & Christina to that first cluebox on time.

It also allows them  to start the leg on the 19th.  My London flight required starting the day before.

The LOT sequence is much better.

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Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #128 on: November 29, 2007, 12:53:19 AM »
Would it have gone on the 18th as well?
"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan

Offline Chateau d If

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #129 on: November 29, 2007, 01:35:00 AM »
I don't know!

But the day that patlini has used is equivalent to Thursday July 19th, 2007.  It is just one year ahead in 2008
« Last Edit: November 29, 2007, 01:41:02 AM by Chateau d If »
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Offline puddin

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #130 on: November 29, 2007, 02:00:44 AM »
We are lucky to have patlini  :cmas26! Good job patlini !

Offline TARAsia Fan

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #131 on: November 29, 2007, 09:32:59 AM »
patlini totally rocks! :cmas16 :cmas16 :cmas9 :cmas9
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Offline patlini

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #132 on: November 29, 2007, 09:43:08 AM »
Cheers Guys  :cmas51

I don't know!

But the day that patlini has used is equivalent to Thursday July 19th, 2007.  It is just one year ahead in 2008

yeah next year is a leap year so +2 days. That threw me initally too.

Any thoughts apart from what apskip had speculated for locations in India?

Offline puddin

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #133 on: November 29, 2007, 11:05:37 AM »
apskips master timeline is  back on page one of this thread pantini -- :kisses


Just for good measure
Lorena & Jason~

TVGuide.com: At least you got to race for a week and a half. How long were you actually in Burkina Faso?
Lorena: Three days.
tvguide

Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #134 on: November 29, 2007, 06:07:49 PM »
APSKIP is BACK!!! :yess: :hearts: :jumpy: :hearts: :yess:

I am NEVER doing flights again! :happy:
"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan


Offline puddin

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #135 on: November 29, 2007, 06:25:20 PM »
YIPPEEE  :jumpy:

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #136 on: November 29, 2007, 07:14:43 PM »
sorry no

but it could be a way out via Frankfurt
http://www.kaunasair.lt/index.php?lang=2&m=2&p=220



patlini, I appreciate the efforts that you and Peach made during my absence. Interpreting flight data can be tricky. The RyanAir timetable information available through the above link does not help at all in providing an alternative to the route from Paris to Vilnius. It currently only gives the winter schedule, but it may not have been much different in mid-July. It shows 3 weekly flights FR1856 from Frankfurt to Kaunas, departing at 1830 and arriving 2145. Unfortunately, those 3 days are Monday, Friday, and Sunday, not Tuesday when July 17th was. It's highly unlikely that this was the way teams got to Kaunas and if they did they would be way behind.

NOTE - ADDED LATER:
Now, coming out back is also on those same days. FR1857 departs Kaunas 2210 and arrives Frankfurt 2330. That makes it useless unless the July schedule had additional days, in which case using it on Tuesday July 18 would be very interesting.
« Last Edit: November 30, 2007, 03:52:21 PM by apskip »

Offline patlini

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #137 on: November 29, 2007, 07:47:32 PM »


patlini, I appreciate the efforts that you and Peach made during my absence. Interpreting flight data can be tricky. The RyanAir timetable information available through the above link does not help at all in providing an alternative to the route from Paris to Vilnius. It currently only gives the winter schedule, but it may not have been much different in mid-July. It shows 3 weekly flights from Frankfurt to Kaunas, departing at 1830 and arriving 2145. Unfortunately, those 3 days are Monday, Friday, and Sunday, not Tuesday when July 17th was. It's highly unlikely that this was the way teams got to Kaunas and if they did they would be way behind.

apskip - definitely agreed.  after living your world for the past 3 days I can see that

Welcome back
« Last Edit: November 29, 2007, 08:20:00 PM by patlini »

Offline puddin

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #138 on: November 29, 2007, 08:01:16 PM »
No matter patlini, we needed help and you stepped up. All and all you Rock!

Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #139 on: November 29, 2007, 08:15:34 PM »
sorry no

but it could be a way out via Frankfurt

http://www.kaunasair.lt/index.php?lang=2&m=2&p=220



patlini, I appreciate the efforts that you and Peach made during my absence. Interpreting flight data can be tricky. The RyanAir timetable information available through the above link does not help at all in providing an alternative to the route from Paris to Vilnius. It currently only gives the winter schedule, but it may not have been much different in mid-July. It shows 3 weekly flights from Frankfurt to Kaunas, departing at 1830 and arriving 2145. Unfortunately, those 3 days are Monday, Friday, and Sunday, not Tuesday when July 17th was. It's highly unlikely that this was the way teams got to Kaunas and if they did they would be way behind.

I vote we all step back and let apskip see if what we did measures up at all!  :jumpy: :cmas9 :jumpy:

But if IIRC, patlini WAS saying there that we couldn't get INTO Kaunas but we just might be able to get out...

But now we can doublecheck everything: :yess:

WE need to see if Vilnius and/or Kaunas work to Florence 7/18  (outside chance in my mind that there is time for this but would solve some probs)

Can we then get Florence to Dubrovnik in our preferred schedule on 7/19 **

OR --in case Lithuania is a TBC or a 36 hour Pitstop--can we get Lithuania to Dubrovnik in our preferred schedule on 7/19 **

And lastly, can we get Dubrovnik to Florence on 7/20**

** see Patlini's excellent work too for input

"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan

Offline TARAsia Fan

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #140 on: November 29, 2007, 08:21:43 PM »
 :cmas9 :cmas9 :cmas9 :cmas9 :cmas9 :cmas9 :jumpy: :jumpy: :jumpy: :yess: :yess: :yess: :yess: :cmas16 :cmas16 :cmas16

WELCOME BACK, APSKIP!!!!  :cmas51 :cmas51 :cmas51 :cmas20 :cmas20 :cmas20 :cmas9 :cmas9 :cmas9 :waves: :waves: :waves: :waves:
« Last Edit: November 29, 2007, 08:25:41 PM by TARAsia Fan »
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Offline mswood

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #141 on: November 29, 2007, 08:32:44 PM »
apskips master timeline is  back on page one of this thread pantini -- :kisses


Just for good measure
Lorena & Jason~

TVGuide.com: At least you got to race for a week and a half. How long were you actually in Burkina Faso?
Lorena: Three days.
tvguide
3 days is also mentioned by one of the racers on the episode clips (can't remember which one). 

Offline mswood

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #142 on: November 29, 2007, 08:33:52 PM »
Apskip welcome back.....  Literally tried doing it for three hours and wanted to kill myself.....

Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #143 on: November 29, 2007, 08:48:42 PM »
I spent one whole day doing it and I had to take 2 Advil and go to bed! :groan:

SO glad our flight guru is back!

"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan

Offline patlini

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #144 on: November 29, 2007, 08:52:25 PM »
but we're all experts on getting around Europe in the summer now  :cmaslol


Offline apskip

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #145 on: November 29, 2007, 08:57:50 PM »
I have some other news as I have been carefully reviewing the good work done in my absence. The existence of the flight combination OK871 Vilnius Prague, OS 704 Prague Vienna, and OS7059(the key flight) Vienna Dubrovnik was based on July 17, 2008 schedule data. This is a good technique most of the time; however, I cannot verify the existence of OS7059 for Thursday July 19, 2007, nor can I for OS5221 which is the next flight Vienna to Dubrovnik. If that earlier flight did not exist, then the early flight combination from VNO arrives at 1540 instead of 1120. I have sent inquiries to both Austrian Airlines and to the Dubrovnik Airport tonight. We will have to wait for a response to see whether there was such a flight on 7/19/07. My conclusion is that the best you can do starting from VNO without that is:

VNO PRG  OK871  0600 0635
PRG ZAG  OK818  1200 1325
ZAG DBV  OU662  1445 1540  

The first flight into DBV, OU660, departs from Zagreb at 0930 on Thursdays only and arrives DBV 1025. In order to get on that flight, a team must overnight in Zagreb because you cannot fly into Zagreb early enough from Lithuania to make the connection. Through Vienna and through Frankfurt it does not work to be there by the evening of the 18th. And if you can leave early enough from Vilnius to overnight in Zagreb, then you could get all the way to Dubrovnik that evening on the late flight OU664 arriving DBV 2155. I cannot come up with a rational explanation for the observed spacing unless there were 3 charter flights from either Vilnius or better yet Kaunas airport to Dubrovnik on July 19.

NEW ADDITION - The information that one team got behind because they missed a connection by 5 minutes indicates that charter flights could not have been the sole mode. the critical bottleneck is the scarcity of flights Zagreb to Dubrovnik, so I am altering my proposal to be one charter aircraft that flies back and forth beetween Zagreb and Dubrovnik 3 times starting around 11am on July 19.
« Last Edit: November 29, 2007, 09:54:12 PM by apskip »

Offline georgiapeach

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #146 on: November 29, 2007, 09:11:58 PM »
Well that is a bummer..

What about these flights from patlini, apskip?  http://forum.realityfanforum.com/index.php/topic,13694.msg240490.html#msg240490

Esp the early LOT one?

And just to humor me--could we get them into/out of  SPLIT instead? On the 18th?
"Our fans are pretty good. They don't give away too much. Sometimes people love dropping spoilers, but our fans are good. They tend to do it in such a way that doesn't ruin it for fans who don't want to know."--Phil Keoghan

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #147 on: November 29, 2007, 09:27:03 PM »
Dubrovnik to Florence flights for July 20(my guess) are pretty easy to estimate. There are only 2 good options:

OU661 DBV ZAG  0640 0735
AZ545  ZAG MXP 1155 1325
AZ1694 MXP FLR 1515 1615

or

OU384 DBV FCO 1555 1700
AZ1681 FCO FLR 2130 2230

Some teams will get the early combination; others will not.

Florence to India is another easy one. Because I don't think the earliest possible flight combinations for July 21 are feasible unless it is a TBC, I am showing:

LH4059 FLR FRA 0950 1135
LH760 FRA DEL  1335  0115 +1

Trailing teams will have to take:

LH 4077 FLR MUC 1710 1835
LH 762  MUC DEL  1940 0740 +1

If teams go on to Jaisalmer via flying to Jodhpur and taking the train, there would be a bunching point at Delhia airport. The first flight does not leave until 9W 3311 departs DEL 1210 arrives JDH 1330.

 



Offline gingerman28

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #148 on: November 30, 2007, 09:18:55 AM »
Have we had any thought that the teams might fly to one city, say Milano or Venice, and then drive themselves to Florence?

Offline apskip

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Re: TAR12 timeline speculation
« Reply #149 on: November 30, 2007, 10:37:48 AM »
GMAN, that isn't the way World Race Productions sets up travel even though it occasionally would result in earlier arrivals. In this case it is a long way to Florence by road from these cities:

Florence from Milan 190 miles

Florence from Rome 171 miles

Florence from Venice 160 miles

Flights to Venice are nonsensical since the best ones go through Rome to get there and schedules therefore can't be good. Fights to Milan from Dubrovnik start with:

DBV ZAG OU661 departing 0640 and connecting with ZAG MXP arriving 1325, obviously with a long layover in Zagreb.

There is one nonstop flight DBV to FCO(Rome), but it isn't until Friday afternoon: DBV FCO 1555 1700 OU384


 

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